strange metric caliber?

[Cowboy32]

I have another odd chambering that I've never heard of. I was told it is a 11.6 x 44r. I'm going to get a chamber cast done when time. Anyone hear of it?

[M-Tecs]

https://www.cartridgecollector.net/119-x-44r-hagen-lund

[dtknowles]

You might not need to do a chamber cast. Can you measure the mouth of the chamber to see if it is going to be a strait case or tapered/bottleneck. A thing that is hard to measure on a chamber cast is the necessary rim thickness. See if you can measure that too. Potential donor cases are 45-70 or 460 mag.

Tim

[17nut]

https://i.imgur.com/BQie1EX.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/aj497eq.jpg

The 11mm Lund is a 12,7x44R necked down.

[dtknowles]

After some more research it appears that it being a bottle neck cartridge based on the 12 x 44r case neither 45 -70 nor 460 mag will work. I am not sure if 50-70 will be long enough but I think .348 Winchester brass will work.

[jonp]

Could you use 50 Alaskan for that?

[Wayne Smith]

Does that use the 11MM Mauser case? If so it has a rebated rim - I have a 10.5x47R that uses the 11MM Mauser case. Several years ago I purchased some 9x47R brass from Fred Huntington and necked it up. It is based on the Mauser case.

[dtknowles]

8mm Lebel might work too

[17nut]

The Mauser A-base was invented to aid the then brand new (Mauser 1871 rifle) extractor over the rim of the new cartridge.

It has no meaning for RB's at all!

Someome with modern smarts will chime in and say headspace.
Guess what, when a rb round is fired the first time it will bang back into the block and fireform the cartridge for that rifle's headspace once and for all.

No need to overthink things.

[Cowboy32]

Thanks guys for the ideas. I'm a gonna work on it.

[Mr Hanssen]

304142 11,9 HagenLund

[Mr Hanssen]

304143 12 mm Remington,as we call it here inn Norway.

[Good Cheer]

Going off of the memories of working with a 9.5x52R over thirty years ago it was difficult to get even well annealed 45-70 brass to expand out (fire forming) and not split longitudinally. The rims can be reduced in diameter by either turning, grinding or filing.

[Cowboy32]

Definitely not a 11mm anything. Slugged the bore and it came out to be around .400. A Lebel case will slide right in but it he rim seems to be too thin. Took 3 attempts to get a primer to fire. Primer back out about .030" What do ya think about trying to fireform a Lebel case?

[Cowboy32]

Possibly .450/400 2 3/8"?

[Mr Hanssen]

What kind of rifle do you have?
You should take a chamber cast and post a picture here.

[Cowboy32]

What I was told it is a Hans Larsen/Joh. S. Guidim, Tennstempel model. I was intrigued with the design and craftmanship.

[dtknowles]

Definitely not a 11mm anything. Slugged the bore and it came out to be around .400. A Lebel case will slide right in but it he rim seems to be too thin. Took 3 attempts to get a primer to fire. Primer back out about .030" What do ya think about trying to fireform a Lebel case?

I would try fireforming the Lebel case with an o-ring or twist of wire around it ahead of the rim. Use a small charge of pistol powder and a case full of filler topped with wax or toilet paper.
Tim

[dtknowles]

Possibly .450/400 2 3/8"?

I have a couple rounds of 10.3 x 60R (10.3x60R or the 450/400 2 3/8 are almost identical) the rim is thinner than 8 mm Lebel.

[Mr Hanssen]

They are fantastic rifles. This is a plane rifle,normally they had a lot of engraving both on steel and wood.
Fredrikstad is my home town,a small city in the east of Norway, close to the swedish border.
The caliber could be 10,15 Jarmann ( 10,15 x61R ) A chamber cast is the only way to find out.

Take a look on this site http://norskevaapen.no

[Cowboy32]

Thanks for the link Mr. Hanssen. Do you know the purpose of the small lever under the opening lever? I just couldn't resist the quality of it. I would love to see a fancier one. I'll try to fireform a case from the 8mm Lebel first.

[Mr Hanssen]

Have never seen that lever before,so I don`t know.
Found som pics on the net of the rifle and it is not so plane as I thought.
Beautiful engravings and steel/horn trigger guard + the wedge pin plates are fantastic.
You have a very nice rifle there.

[Mr Hanssen]

You must take that bolt with the small lever out before you take the big one.
If you look at pictures of other tennstempel rifles, that small bolt have a slott for a screwdriver.
So I think it was made for easy takedown in the field for cleaning? without tools.

[Cowboy32]

I thought it was pretty nice when I saw it. I am amazed at old world craftmanship. That is the only thing I could come up with. I see no reason for me to disassemble it. With dual extractors it is going to be tricky to get a full chamber casting. I'm going to just get a casting minus the rim area.

[Texas by God]

I love seeing unfamiliar guns from the past. Please show us how the action opens to accept a cartridge. Perhaps a candle wax chamber cast will help determine the chambering?

Sent from my SM-A716U using Tapatalk

[Cowboy32]

Yep, it caught my eye! Breech block rotates back and then down. Similar to a Peabody or Martini.

304356304357

[Texas by God]

Very neat. Thanks for sharing. I would also try to figure out how to shoot it!

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[Cowboy32]

I finally got around to getting a chamber casting. I and several others all came up with 10.15x61R Jarmann. Has anyone had any experience with this chambering? I've got cases headed this way.

[17nut]

Had a sporterised Jarmann many moons ago.
Load was @80 grains (if i remember right) of bp behind a lube groove bullet.

Bullet used RCBS .416-350-FN
https://www.rcbs.com/bullet-casting/moulds/bullet-mould-.416-350-fn-562/355303.html

[Cowboy32]

Well Gents, I acquired some cases from Buffaloarms and some .403 cast bullets and loaded 4 rds. with 70grs. of some Goex Cartridge I had laying around. I'll get pictures next time of the group. I can't use iron sights much these days, but I got all 4 rds. in 3" at 50 yds., 2" high. Don't laugh too hard, but I will improve that. What a hoot to shoot. I think I need to get more cases while I can.

[Dutchman]

Yep, it caught my eye! Breech block rotates back and then down. Similar to a Peabody or Martini.

Or an 1870 Krag. https://public.fotki.com/dutchman/1870-krag/
and http://dutchman.rebooty.com/krag.html

https://images42.fotki.com/v1653/photos/4/28344/14451637/kr001-vi.jpg (https://public.fotki.com/dutchman/1870-krag/kr001.html)

https://images44.fotki.com/v1657/photos/4/28344/14451637/kr013-vi.jpg (https://public.fotki.com/dutchman/1870-krag/kr013.html)

[toot]

thank GOD, for 348 WIN. where would we be with out them? I think more of 348 cases are used in case reforming than in loading for348's.

[toot]

it seems to be a beautiful piece.

[toot]

when I fire form cases, I also use a small amount of pistol powder with Rice krispies and then push the case into a bar of IVORY soap it is hard and stays set untill being shot.

[BrassMagnet]

Well Gents, I acquired some cases from Buffaloarms and some .403 cast bullets and loaded 4 rds. with 70grs. of some Goex Cartridge I had laying around. I'll get pictures next time of the group. I can't use iron sights much these days, but I got all 4 rds. in 3" at 50 yds., 2" high. Don't laugh too hard, but I will improve that. What a hoot to shoot. I think I need to get more cases while I can.

So you have a few brass. What are they and what is the parent case to form more from?

[Cowboy32]

The caliber is 10.15x61R Jarman. Parent case I have no idea. Buffaloarms had the ammo and brass.