Trail Guns Armory Kodiak - Lead Stock

[Old Footman]

Good morning everyone,

I recently purchased a Trail Guns Armory (Pedersoli) Kodiak .58 that really needs to be brought back to life. I will share this story later with photos. The stripped stock itself is very heavy and I observed that the rear stock was filled with a lead plug. It appears that the lead was poured into the stock and it weighs 3.2 pounds on my bathroom scale. Has anyone on this forum owned this Trail Guns Armory Kodiak model and removed this lead plug? If so how did you do it?

Thank you,

Old Footman

[rancher1913]

is this a double rifle? if it is the lead is a recoil buffer for the second shot, helps the gun stay on target. i have a competitive m16 that the stock is lead weighted and the fore arm as well, its deadly in the 3 round shoot because it stays on target even with the recoil.

[Old Footman]

Rancher1913,

Yes it is a double .58 caliber rifled barrel ML. From what I could find on line it appears that the barrel twist is 1-48". With that I'm hoping that it will shoot patched round balls (.570"). I understand about the recoil and staying on target, but the rifle weighs 10+ pounds. I'm hoping to lighten it up. I found this post on a different forum with a photo of a 6" long lead plug that was removed from a stock.

https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/trail-guns-armory-kodiak-percussion-double-rifle-by-pedersoli-12ga-50cal.121800/

Thank you,

Old Footman

[rancher1913]

if your not going to be hunting deadly game, should be no problem removing the lead. if you can see the lead, try using a drill and remove what you can then heat up the rest and let it drop out. a heat gun might do it.

[725]

Drill, baby, drill.

[stubshaft]

1 - for drilling it out.

[dondiego]

Send a deck screw half way into the lead and use pliars to pull out the lead rod.

[BLAHUT]

If of you remove the lead plug. Be forewarned, this animal will beat you unmercifully, like it owns you, with full loads>>

[Texas by God]

Recoil is temporary; gravity is constant.
Get the lead out and restore the balance of that hunting gun.


Sent from my SM-A716U using Tapatalk

[Sig]

Automotive slide hammer dent puller can probably be rigged.

[RU shooter]

If you can’t pull it out drill out all that you can don’t try to melt it out you’ll just burn up the stock . I have a 24 ga (58 cal) smoothbore with a 30 “ barrel and it only weights 6 lbs and the recoils isn’t that bad with a RB. Even with a 1.25 oz of shot it’s more like a shove than a kick

[Old Footman]

Thank you for all the replies. As for recoil, I agree that shooting conicals with heavy charges will beat you up in a light rifle. I have some other .58's (percussion and flintlocks) that shoot round balls and I have taken my fair share of game with no problems. I hope to take care of it this week. I'll update everyone later.

Again thanks!

Old Footman

[Old Footman]

303634
303635
303636
303637

What I am starting with. The owner passed away and as you can see he liked to use epoxy paint, plus both barrels were loaded. I will share more pics later, the project is moving along pretty good. Click on the pics and they should straighten out.

Old Footman

[M-Tecs]

That is the ugliest rifle I have ever seen. Soaking the barrels and stock in MEK will remove epoxy paint without damaging the wood or metal.

[badwolf]

Wow, just wow!

[Sasquatch-1]

That is going to need some tender loving care, to say the least.

I would try a ball puller first with a good brass range rod. If that doesn't work, look into some of the alternatives. There are some people who put grease fitting in where the nipple goes and use a grease gun to force the ball out. Or maybe the compressed air method.

Good Luck

[Old Footman]

It took some time to finally get this Kodiak completely unloaded. First I decided to dump the powder and it took some brute force to get the nipples off. I used a piece of wire to try and get as much of the powder out through the nipple area. In looking down the barrel with a light it appeared that both barrels were loaded with conicals. I tried to use a CO2 discharger three times with no luck. Next I poured some Kroil oil down the barrels to see if that would help. After a few days I tried to use a bullet puller and that didn't work. Well if all fails it's off to the shop of "725". We tried his air compressor, again no luck. Next we decided to use a solid brass rod to see if we could move the conicals down a bit since we thought the conicals were rusted up against the barrels. Well that didn't work, so "725" said we need to drill to reduced the weight/mass of the conicals. As you can see we did that. Went back to the brass rod and finally we moved a conicals. From that we poured 20 grains of 2F through the nipple area and discharged them into some wood. "725" recovered one of the conicals and as you can see it was a hollow base "boolit". Inspecting the barrel I could see that there was rust where the conicals were (ugh!). I spent some time (hours) cleaning up the barrels.

Again click on the pic to straighten it out.

303647
303648
303649
303650
303651
303652
303653
303654
303655

[Baltimoreed]

Crazy paint job on that baby, wow. And loaded! I had also looked at one of these back when I was very into muzzle loaders. Good luck on your rebuild.

[Texas by God]

That's a two bagger[emoji16].
But something worth saving under all that!

Sent from my SM-A716U using Tapatalk

[Old Footman]

FYI, I took the barrels up to Bob Hoyt's shop in Pennsylvania so I could get his opinion. He told that there was a few rough spots that cleaned up, but he saw nothing wrong with me shooting this Kodiak.

Old Footman

[Old Footman]

Well it was just too much of a pain in the butt to try and clean off the multiple layers of epoxy paint that was on the metal. A friend of mine has a bead blast cabinet in his garage, so I decided to try this and three hours later the work was done. The locks/hammers will be blued by me and everything else will be cerakoted in a matte black finish. Click on the pic to straighten it out.

303665
303666
303667
303668
303669
303670
303671

Old Footman

[Super Sneaky Steve]

So glad to see you rescue this rifle. I hope the final product comes out nice.

[Baltimoreed]

Cleaned up nicely.

[Sasquatch-1]

For what you started with that looks great. I can't wait to see how it looks when you are done.

[Old Footman]

Finished detail stripping, cleaning, and bluing the locks with hammers. One of the hammer screws would not come off even after soaking in acetone/transmission fluid. I did not want to damage the screw or the tumbler so bluing was the answer (3 coats) for me. After assembling and thinking about it, I thought the bluing shows off the engraving better.

303710
303711
303712
303713
303714
303715
303716
303717

Old Footman

[dogrunner]

Good morning everyone,

I recently purchased a Trail Guns Armory (Pedersoli) Kodiak .58 that really needs to be brought back to life. I will share this story later with photos. The stripped stock itself is very heavy and I observed that the rear stock was filled with a lead plug. It appears that the lead was poured into the stock and it weighs 3.2 pounds on my bathroom scale. Has anyone on this forum owned this Trail Guns Armory Kodiak model and removed this lead plug? If so how did you do it?

Thank you,

Old Footman

I own a .50/50 version of that rifle. Bought it new from Cabela's back in the 90's.....it also had lead in the butt stock, which I promptly removed. My take is that it was put there to provide some sort of recoil dampener......I can fathom no other imagined purpose......I'd note that I would remove such material from any piece I came into as that lead WILL ultimately create a problem with you stock via corrosion and I have seen photo's of guns so fitted that had split stocks therefrom.

Far as the gun itself.........mine is a very well made piece, accurate with the proper loads and it is my go to piece for our Florida BP season.........I shoot only black and maxi balls myself it proved itself a keeper on it's first outing...........heavy, but gets the job done!

[Old Footman]

Dogrunner,

I agree with your points on the lead being there for recoil. Since you did remove your lead plug, how did you get it out? Drilling?

Old Footman

[dogrunner]

OF, as I recall the stuff was simply precast and fitted to the guns hollowed out section..........course my gun was new at the time and removing posed no problem....as I recall I then melted the stuff and used it for bullet material......if that weight is stuck you'll likely have to drill it for a fairly large thread wood screw and use that as a pull point... Mine had no adhesive or mechanical fitting as I recall but it was closely fitted.

As an aside, those are damned good guns and well fitted. Mine. at 50 yards will print the first shot low out of the right bbl, the left to the point of aim then after that first fouling round both rounds print within an inch of each other near point of aim.........thats with 90 gr's of 3f Goex and the maxi ball, lubed with TC's chicken grease.


Meant to mention that I also fitted mine with Musket nipples........lot's easier to handle in cold weather.......dunno if it helped ignition as I have never had a failure to fire in mine with the #11's.

[taco650]

OF,

I would suggest that you glue in a wood plug when you get the lead out to maintain structural integrity of the stock. It might add a little weight back to the stock but not much. Can't wait to see how it turns out when you're finished refurbishing this rifle.

[LAGS]

On some rifles that I drilled the stock to lighten it up a bit.
I would fill the void with Spray Expanding Foam to make the stock feel more solid.
Do not use the High Expanding foam.
And wrap the stock in masking tape when you are applying the spray foam.
I also used the expanding foam on Hollow plastic Stocks.
It made them feel more solid.
But voids left in the stock , could cause structural failures like cracks.

[Old Footman]

Working the stock. I used Goof Off and Citristrip to soften the paint which I scrapped off. Along with this and chasing the checking this took hours to finally get all the paint off the stock. You will notice the stain on the butt end, this was caused by a slip on recoil pad that was on the Kodiak. The owner painted the recoil pad, but not that section of the stock. When I was at the of shop of "725" he showed me a stock he did in red mahogany which really looked good, so I decided this will be the finish for the Kodiak. Click the pics to straighten them out.

303785
303786
303787
303788
303789
303790
303791
303792

Old Footman

[725]

Can't beat red mahogany on walnut! Just a beautiful final result.

[Old Footman]

Sometimes you just cannot figure out what some people do with their firearms and this is one of them. Here is the painted slip on recoil pad. Right now the stock has received some coats of red mahogany. The portion of the stock where this recoil pad was on will be a bit darker. I tried to sand it out, but it was still there especially on the right side of the stock. Looking forward on getting the cerakoted parts back from my dealer.

303812

Old Footman

[Old Footman]

The stock now has multiple coats of red mahogany and it's hanging up in the shop of "725". He has been helping with this and after the stock dries it will be rubbed out.

303857

303858

Old Footman

[Super Sneaky Steve]

This is turning out good! Keep at it!

[725]

Night & day! What a difference.

[Texas by God]

Gorgeous. A noble rescue!

Sent from my SM-A716U using Tapatalk

[GregLaROCHE]

Was that lead ballast original or a modification someone made? If it’s original, I wonder why you want to remove it. If you do remove it, be sure to put a good plug into the space to reinforce the stock.

[Old Footman]

You are right about plugging the stock "if" the lead can be removed. If the lead can be removed I will measure everything and have a plug made to fit the hole and glue it in place. Thanks for all the comments. Take care.

Old Footman

[Old Footman]

Some great news the "lead plug" has been finally pulled!! This afternoon I went up to the shop of "725" to pick up the Kodiak stock. "725" added some additional coats of red mahogany and it was hanging up in his shop to dry. The stock came out great, so the conversation came up on how we were going to remove the lead and the answer was to "drill". "725" suggested that we drill down deep enough to fit a lag bolt and try to pull it out. So between the two of us with me securing the stock and "725" drilling, he drilled 1 3/8" down into the bar and the drill bit dug into the lead which broke the lead loose from the stock fibers. When that happened he was able to pulled out the lead plug. The lead plug was 6 3/4" long with a diameter of .880" which weighed 1.6 pounds.

Following up on "GregLaRoche" comment "be sure to put a good plug into the space to reinforce the stock" and that's exactly what we did. "725" had a piece of hickory in his shop so off to the lathe he went. He made a great plug with multiple grooves so the Titebound wood glue would hold well inside the stock. I suggested we leave a 1/2" recess so I could place two spare stainless steel nipples in a very small zip-lock bag. I ordered some new ones the other day from Midway USA. Click the pics to straighten them out. Take care.

304149
304150
304151
304152
304153
304154
304155
304156

Take care,

Old Footman

[LAGS]

Good job guys.
B
Now you have more lead to cast up some Boolits to shoot.

[Old Footman]

Lags,

That is exactly what is going to happen. I'm planning on casting this old lead into .570 RB's with my Tanner mold. I want use those RB's to take a deer or two this season with the Kodiak.

Old Footman

[725]

Old lead is the best.

[Old Footman]

Stock is done, just waiting for the parts to be finished.

304230
304231
304232
304233
304234
304235

Old Footman

[Baltimoreed]

Looks much much better but I liked it better in #34, wasn’t as glossy.

[C. Latch]

I read here a fair bit but never post anymore. I have to make an exception and say that is absolutely a beautiful project you're working on. Nice work!

-Chris

[Old Footman]

Baltimoreed,

There is a bit of a shine from my shop lights from the last coat of linseed oil. Here are a couple pics outside in the sunlight. C.Latch, thank you for your comments.

304242
304243

Old Footman

[hawkenhunter50]

Nicely done. Much better looking now.

[Sasquatch-1]

Either way, shiny or mat, that stock looks great. Especially compared to the shape it was in.

[oconeedan]

You did a heck of a job! I am impressed.
I hope you kill something with it this fall.

[taco650]

Either way, shiny or mat, that stock looks great. Especially compared to the shape it was in.

Ditto! The previous color scheme was hideous IMO!

[ncmn]

Very impressive restore you have done, and it is great to see someone taking the time to do this.

[Old Footman]

FYI, I went up to the shop of "725" this afternoon and we casted up the lead from the Kodiak stock. I was able to cast up (35) .570 RB's from my Tanner brass mold. There was a fair bit of slag that was removed during the casting. Thanks again for your comments.

304299
304301

Old Footman

[dondiego]

Great story! I have pulled a lead weight from a shotgun stock but it sure wasn't that heavy!

[Old Footman]

FYI, I am still waiting for the parts to be cerakoted since the guy who does the work at my dealer came down sick with Covid. The rear sights on this Kodiak were rusted up good on the screws to the point I could not move them or make adjustments. They have been soaking for a few weeks now in a glass jar of transmission fluid and acetone (50/50). I was able to disassemble them and all the parts went back into the glass jar. I will give it a few more days and then I will clean everything up. I'm thinking of bead blasting all the parts and then cold blue everything with Brownells Oxpo-Blue.

304784
304785
304786
304787

I'm looking forward in getting the parts to finish up this Kodiak.

Take care,

Old Footman

[taco650]

Thanks for the update, will be excited to see the finished rifle and learn how well it shoots.

Stuart

[Old Footman]

I am still waiting for the cerakoted parts for the Kodiak, "but" I thought I would share a funny follow up to this Kodiak project. The family of the Kodiak owner who passed away brought to my dealer more rifles and shotguns to sell and guess what........................"they were all painted like the Kodiak". UGH! what was guy thinking when he did this. Well after some negotiations I decided to purchase the two .30-30 rifles. One is a Marlin 336 and the other a Ted Williams model 100 (Winchester 94). Since I am waiting for the Kodiak parts, I decided to start working on the Marlin 336. I will post this under "Lever Actions" on this forum. Drum roll please .........................on a couple of pics. Click on the pics to straighten them out :grin:

305124
305125

Take care,

Old Footman

[Old Footman]

Finally...........all of my parts were Cerakoted. The dealer did a good job on the matte black coating, but he had three of my screws fall through the screen in his bead blast cabinet. I had to wait an additional two weeks until I picked up the parts yesterday.

307038
307039
307040
307041
307042
307043
307044
307045

Old Footman

[725]

Nicely done. Eager to see it shoot.

[taco650]

Looks a ton better! Congratulations!

[missionary5155]

That is a fine restoration !
Now the fun of firing it !
Going to have to check our .72 Kodiak for lead ballast next time north.

[45workhorse]

Beautiful restore job.
Nice wood and color'
I like brown barrels and locks, but that cerakote looks good and will provide better protection to the metal.

[Shanghai Jack]

Ditto! The previous color scheme was hideous IMO!

Almost makes you want to have a separate forum for the world's ugliest guns.