Loading 30-30 Win for a Lever-Friend for the first time. Tips?

[VariableRecall]

I've got a friend that has a Winchester lever action chambered in 30-30, and I'd like to reload some ammo for him. I don't know how modern my friend's Winchester is, but I'd assume it was made sometime in the 1960's or a bit earlier.

I don't have any LRP's, projectiles, or any of his brass just yet, but I'd like to get a lay of the land on the cartridge and find out what works best for everyone else.

Looking at the load data I've discovered, Even the heaviest 170gn cast bullets in the load data are supersonic. Do you Gas-Check your projectiles for 30-30? or, is that being overly cautious?
I do have a lube-sizer, and hardball lead at about 18bhn that I could alloy softer if necessary. What would be your preferred flat point cast bullet for this application?

If I'm a little less ambitious and would want to pick up complete projectiles to load later, which ones have you found to be economical out of the bunch?

I have IMR 4198 as a rifle powder, and there appears to be no issue with using it for almost any load with 30-30, but do you have any other powder preferences?

I'd love to start a conversation here so I can start loading for him on the right foot.

[FergusonTO35]

My two 94's do great with the Lee C309-170-RF with an aluminum gas check sized to .310. I would start around 18 grains with the 4198 and work my way up until I find the best accuracy. My current load for them is 15 grains of the late great IMR 4759 for 1600 fps; basically .32-40 power level. Don't overthink this, the .30 WCF is a very boolit friendly cartridge.

[VariableRecall]

My two 94's do great with the Lee C309-170-RF with an aluminum gas check sized to .310. I would start around 18 grains with the 4198 and work my way up until I find the best accuracy. My current load for them is 15 grains of the late great IMR 4759 for 1600 fps; basically .32-40 power level. Don't overthink this, the .30 WCF is a very boolit friendly cartridge.

Why size to .310? does your rifle have less rifling than it used to? I plan on sizing to .308, as I want to reflect the diameter of factory ammo, but I'd like to know.
Do you think I could get away with not gas-checking my projectiles? what do you use to cut out the aluminum? I've yet to use gas checks as all of my cast loads so far have been subsonic.

[RickinTN]

Sizing 308 will probably result in leading. Cast bullets should always be sized .001 to .002 over bore size for best results. Better yet is if you size to the largest diameter the throat will accept. If you have or can find any 15 to 16 grains of IMR4227 is my favorite and is a good substitute for the now discontinued SR4759.

Good Luck,
Rick

[Winger Ed.]

I have good luck with a gas checked 170RN sized to .309, and use about 80-90% of the max. charge of recommended powders.
Either 3031 or 4198 has always done a good job in my old Winchester.

For rifles, being super sonic is sort of the nature of the beast due to the longer ranges they are built for.

[atr]

before you start producing multiple rounds check that the first several you load function in the action and seat properly in the chamber. On some tight throats the boolit might bulge the case just enough to keep the round from seating.
the 30-30 is a pretty forgiving case/caliber to reload for. I suspect you will have no prolems.
best
atr

[VariableRecall]

I have good luck with a gas checked 170RN sized to .309, and use about 80-90% of the max. charge of recommended powders.
Either 3031 or 4198 has always done a good job in my old Winchester.

For rifles, being super sonic is sort of the nature of the beast due to the longer ranges they are built for.

I'll pick up a Lube sizing die in .309 to split the difference, then.

Come to think of it, I already use .452 sizers for .45 ACP, so it makes sense to go a teeny bit higher in diameter for lead projectiles.

What BHN do you use with your 30-30 projectiles?

[popper]

you can't get subsonic in 30/30 with light bullets and rifle powder! Heavies and pistol powder. You can use 170gr PB and 2400 or unique to get 14-1700 fps to work. Above that GCs make it easier. Definitely you can get faster but not easily.

[VariableRecall]

you can't get subsonic in 30/30 with light bullets and rifle powder! Heavies and pistol powder. You can use 170gr PB and 2400 or unique to get 14-1700 fps to work. Above that GCs make it easier. Definitely you can get faster but not easily.

I'm planning on picking up a 2 cavity Lee .309 170gn Flat point mold simply for the value and the fact that most likely he will not be needing a very large quantity of 30-30, just enough for plinking and fun. I certainly have the ability to seat gas checks, but I don't have any at the moment. We aren't looking for high velocity or hunting with it, just having a good time at the range without having to pay outrageous prices for such a classic caliber.

I think i may just pick up some .30 cal gas checks and leave it at that, since I'd rather not nastily lead up my friend's rifle. The good thing is that I've experienced a lot less leading with my lubrisized projectiles so far, so that's a great sign of improvement going forward.

[toallmy]

Sizing the cast boolits at .309 might still be a little under size for best results .

[VariableRecall]

Sizing the cast boolits at .309 might still be a little under size for best results .

Looking through the Lyman catalogue, there are Lubrisizer options for .308, 309, and 311. Since the mold is sized to 309, it would also make sense to lube size the projectiles to the same diameter, to eliminate any variance in the casting process.

[dverna]

If you are reloading for a rifle you do not have, use jacketed bullets. There is too great a risk of leading and poor accuracy with cast bullets unless you play around a bit...sometime a good bit. And primers are too expensive to waste right now looking for a cast hunting load. With 100 bullets he will have his gun sighted in with 20 rounds and have 80 rounds of hunting ammunition for a cost of $35 for bullets. That is enough ammo to check the sights (6-7 rounds/yr) and hunt (2-3 rounds/yr) for 8+ years.

I would buy 100 quality 170 gr bullets, and use a charge about 5% below maximum for whatever powder you can get a hold of. 3031 is a good one but lots will work. 4198 is a poor choice as the pressure peaks too quickly to get best performance from a .30/30 with jacketed.

If you want plinking ammunition, and want to use cast bullets; or insist on cast for hunting, others will chime in.

[VariableRecall]

If you are reloading for a rifle you do not have, use jacketed bullets. There is too great a risk of leading and poor accuracy with cast bullets unless you play around a bit...sometime a good bit. And primers are too expensive to waste right now looking for a cast hunting load. With 100 bullets he will have his gun sighted in with 20 rounds and have 80 rounds of hunting ammunition for a cost of $35 for bullets. That is enough ammo to check the sights (6-7 rounds/yr) and hunt (2-3 rounds/yr) for 8+ years.

I would buy 100 quality 170 gr bullets, and use a charge about 5% below maximum for whatever powder you can get a hold of. 3031 is a good one but lots will work. 4198 is a poor choice as the pressure peaks too quickly to get best performance from a .30/30 with jacketed.

If you want plinking ammunition, and want to use cast bullets; or insist on cast for hunting, others will chime in.

He's not hunting with the lever action, he hunts with a 243 Win and a 30-06 rifle. When I get the chance I'm going to find FMJ projectiles in the grain weight that he wants to use. I've got dies for both, but he's yet to expend any .243 Win, 30-30, or 30-06 to give to me.

The lever action 30-30 is going to be for fun, and for the chance for me to try out his lever action as well. I just hope that I can economically allow for both of us to enjoy his stuff.

[VariableRecall]

With 100 bullets he will have his gun sighted in with 20 rounds and have 80 rounds of hunting ammunition for a cost of $35 for bullets. .

I've yet to see that good of a price for .308 hunting projectiles. I saw pack of Hornady 100ct 170gn hunting projectiles for about $65. Considering that they were also spitzer projectiles, they would not exactly be safe to use in a lever action as well. They could work nicely for 30-06, on the other hand.

[toallmy]

I hate to say it but I agree with post # 12 if loading for someone else's rifle with the way reloading supplies are currently , without having the time , components , and rifle to work out everything . I'd suggest going to midway and ordering a 100 ct box of 150 or 170 gr flat points 30-30 bullets .

[VariableRecall]

I hate to say it but I agree with post # 12 if loading for someone else's rifle with the way reloading supplies are currently , without having the time , components , and rifle to work out everything . I'd suggest going to midway and ordering a 100 ct box of 150 or 170 gr flat points 30-30 bullets .

Funny enough, looking at Midway USA, it's going to be less expensive for me to purchase a mold that can make as many projectiles I want, than it would be to pay 40 cents a projectile and get hosed in that manner.
I'm OK with casting and gas checking projectiles since I'd rather save the FMJ quality for the hunting rounds.

[Winger Ed.]

What BHN do you use with your 30-30 projectiles?

I don't know.
I try not to get all scientific and over think this stuff.

For non-magnum handguns-- since store bought loaded ammo has a lot of pure Lead swaged bullets for them,
I add just enough Tin & goodies to get a good fill out in the molds.

For rifles using a gas check-- I blend it up fairly hard with mostly wheel weights and a bump of 95/5 solder.

I don't have a thermometer either. I turn the pot up high to start off.
Then back off the temp until the frosty-ness stops.

I've been doing this since the 80s, and it has worked well for me.

[Winger Ed.]

We aren't looking for high velocity or hunting with it, just having a good time at the range without having to pay outrageous prices for such a classic caliber.



That's where most of us are.
If I didn't cast for my .45-70, and .45ACP, I couldn't afford to feed them.

However; you will probably want decent accuracy too.
Plan on that accuracy going up along with the speed to stabilize the boolit properly.
Just a wild guess--- but for cast, you'll probably end up a little under the max recommended published loads.

[VariableRecall]

I don't know.
I try not to get all scientific and over think this stuff.

For non-magnum handguns-- since store bought loaded ammo has a lot of pure Lead swaged bullets for them,
I add just enough Tin & goodies to get a good fill out in the molds.

For rifles using a gas check-- I blend it up fairly hard with mostly wheel weights and a bump of 95/5 solder.

I don't have a thermometer either. I turn the pot up high to start off.
Then back off the temp until the frosty-ness stops.

I've been doing this since the 80s, and it has worked well for me.

My approximate BHN that I cast for is about 12-14, as I cut Missouri Bullet's Magic Alloy with about 2/3 of the alloy's weight in pure lead. I've had good results with it so far. My BHN estimations are just using the pencil method, so it's not very exact either!

[RickinTN]

I'd rather save the FMJ quality for the hunting rounds

Full Metal Jacket bullets are not for hunting. Also any FMJ you might find in 30 caliber will most likely be spitzer bullets. I have to concur with a post above that your best bet would be to buy a box of appropriate flat or round nosed jacketed bullets. Powder Valley has good prices on bullets if they have them. IMR 4198 is an excellent powder for the 30-30, it just won[t deliver top velocities like some other powders. It would be good for a higher velocity plinking load.
Rick

[VariableRecall]

I'd rather save the FMJ quality for the hunting rounds

Full Metal Jacket bullets are not for hunting. Also any FMJ you might find in 30 caliber will most likely be spitzer bullets. I have to concur with a post above that your best bet would be to buy a box of appropriate flat or round nosed jacketed bullets. Powder Valley has good prices on bullets if they have them. IMR 4198 is an excellent powder for the 30-30, it just won[t deliver top velocities like some other powders. It would be good for a higher velocity plinking load.
Rick

I apologize for the wrong terminology regarding manufactured projectiles. I used FMJ as a way too general term. Obviously, actual hunting rounds would be soft-point to ensure effective energy transfer and ethical stopping of game. If it's going in a hunted creature, it's going to be soft point.

[Texas by God]

If he doesn't mind loaning the gun to you, you can check your reloaded cartridge for fit and function BEFORE you load a batch. If not, full length size a case then carefully seat and crimp the chosen bullet- without primer or powder. Give that dummy round to him to try in his 94. If it fits, proceed.
Personally I'd prefer him or her to observe and learn; then load their own shells on my equipment.
I've had the three Lee flat nose C309 moulds and they work just fine sized to .309" in my bolt action 30-30.
My old 94 30-30 shot the C309150F over Re7 or 4198 well and I took many turkeys with it using straight wheelweights.

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[indian joe]

I have had two 30/30's - both needed full length resized cases to function easily
That was after full strength hunting loads not paper plinking
I used winchester 748 powder and a cast gascheck 170 grain boolit
Used a Lee boolit size die at .309
If he's mainly gonna plink with it - tone things down some and shoot a plain lead boolit - as dropped from the mold - should be fine.

[ElCheapo]

Lyman 311008 works great in the 30-30. Good accuracy and low recoil = fun! It's a good hunting bullet too. Read about it here...
https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?435728-311008-works-for-deer-too!

[MostlyLeverGuns]

I would want the rifle in hand before loading for it. I would probably start with one of the 170+ grain flatnose bullets gas checked Lee, Lyman, RCBS, Accurate, NOE but sized to .310 to start, 4198, 2015, 3031, Reloder 7, H335, 748, even BL-C2 all work. The 30-30 is not fussy. Lighter bullets at lower velocities are good for fun, but for early success 'standard' weight and powders work well. In the 30-30, cast bullets will stand up to full power hunting loads. The .308 bullets will probably not work as well as .309 or .310, sometimes a .311 might add accuracy.

[scattershot]

301503

This load has worked well for me. It’s a Hunter Supply boolit, sized to .310.

You may find a Lyman M (two step) neck expander will help.

[VariableRecall]

301503

This load has worked well for me. It’s a Hunter Supply boolit, sized to .310.

You may find a Lyman M (two step) neck expander will help.

The die set that I picked up is a Lee set. It comes with a Lee Factory Crimp Die as well. I've had no experience with lyman dies yet, but I've heard they do well. My Lube sizer is a Lyman 4500.

[scattershot]

The Lyman M die is a two step neck expander tool, that allows for easier seating of lead bullets. A real help for seating lead bullets in the case neck.

[VariableRecall]

I would want the rifle in hand before loading for it. I would probably start with one of the 170+ grain flatnose bullets gas checked Lee, Lyman, RCBS, Accurate, NOE but sized to .310 to start, 4198, 2015, 3031, Reloder 7, H335, 748, even BL-C2 all work. The 30-30 is not fussy. Lighter bullets at lower velocities are good for fun, but for early success 'standard' weight and powders work well. In the 30-30, cast bullets will stand up to full power hunting loads. The .308 bullets will probably not work as well as .309 or .310, sometimes a .311 might add accuracy.

Do you gas-check your projectiles, as well?
It seems that the Lyman Lube Sizer die that I picked up is .309, as the other option was .311. Considering that the Lee Mold I picked up casts to .309, it does not seem prudent to lube size with a diameter that isn't going to provide a seal to fill the lube grooves.

[popper]

You may need to get into PC coating. Most 30/30s need 310-311. My Marlin leaded with 310 store bought. Get a 311 Lee sizer. Al GCs are cheaper. Try without using 2400 or Unique for plinker rnds. Full length size for THAT gun. I've never trimmed any 30/30 cases but who knows. Needle nose pliers will flare the 30/30 neck fine. Inset, twist couple times and done. Lee FCD after seating bullet.
I shake and bake PC, cooking on a hot plate with an old hi-temp plastic pan she gave me. Works without the lid but faster with. Stand bullets on base and cook. My oven collects dust on the shelf. 145g PB PC with unique @ 50 yds, about 1500 fps.
301506

[smkummer]

What everyone else says. I still have my pre-64 94 and it accepted .311 diameter 170 cast bullets with gas checks. But my sons 1972 94 work fine with .309 diameter bullets. .311 took some force to chamber but we were able to shoot all 50 rounds. With gas checks, you have more lee way with bullet hardness and bullet sizing.

Tell him you want the rifle in hand if your loading cast bullets. You want the outing to be a pleasurable fun experience. I am using unique and a 170 grain bullet for about 1500 fps. Very pleasurable and cheap to shoot. So…..you got primers?

[toallmy]

Going back to post 16 - the cost of a box of 100 jacketed bullets to load compared to the cost of a mold , gas check , lube or powder coating , sizing die , a couple different powders to try , and a half brick of primers .......
I'm not trying to talk you out of it , if you're interested in doing it for the experience it will be money & time well spent .

[VariableRecall]

Going back to post 16 - the cost of a box of 100 jacketed bullets to load compared to the cost of a mold , gas check , lube or powder coating , sizing die , a couple different powders to try , and a half brick of primers .......
I'm not trying to talk you out of it , if you're interested in doing it for the experience it will be money & time well spent .

I certainly am interested in the experience of reloading for this caliber for reloading sake! I may just get into powder coating as well! All I need is some harbor freight powder coat and a sacrificial toaster!

[gpidaho]

VariableRecall Here's just another line to think about if your rounds are just for plinking and you'd like to avoid gas checks. One of my favorite 30-30 tin can shooting loads uses the Lee TL314-90-SWC sized down to .310 (Tumble lube or powder coated) over a small charge of fast powder. I use Unique but just about any of the fast pistol-shotgun powders should work just fine. For a little more traditional load the Lee round nose flat point either in 150 or 170gr would be my choice this over IMR 4227 or similar burn rate powder. Gp

[VariableRecall]

VariableRecall Here's just another line to think about if your rounds are just for plinking and you'd like to avoid gas checks. One of my favorite 30-30 tin can shooting loads uses the Lee TL314-90-SWC sized down to .310 (Tumble lube or powder coated) over a small charge of fast powder. I use Unique but just about any of the fast pistol-shotgun powders should work just fine. For a little more traditional load the Lee round nose flat point either in 150 or 170gr would be my choice this over IMR 4227 or similar burn rate powder. Gp

I've ordered the Lee 170gn Flat Point mold, as well as the .309 Lube Sizer. I've seen that IMR 4198/3031 is a gold standard for the caliber, and thankfully, I at least have some IMR 4895 to put to use. I think it would be prudent to powder coat these projectiles as well. We aren't looking to reload immediately, we are just going to make sure that at some point we can make his rifle sing again.

[gpidaho]

I've ordered the Lee 170gn Flat Point mold, as well as the .309 Lube Sizer. I've seen that IMR 4198/3031 is a gold standard for the caliber, and thankfully, I at least have some IMR 4895 to put to use. I think it would be prudent to powder coat these projectiles as well. We aren't looking to reload immediately, we are just going to make sure that at some point we can make his rifle sing again.
As always, make sure to make a test round (dummy round or two) I'm a big fan of powder coating cast bullets but keep in mind that the PC changes the bullets dimensions and will enlarge the noses of some bullets to the point that the rounds won't chamber in some tight rifles. My Marlin 336 lever won't chamber a bullet with a nose greater than .301 and shoots bullets .309 on the bands and .300 on the nose just fine without leading. Some 30-30s are also finicky about over all cartridge length having a ball seat and not a traditional throat. You'll get it. Just do proper measurements and try the dummy rounds before you build the real thing. Gp

[elmacgyver0]

I let my friends shoot my guns with my reloaded ammunition, but that is as far as it goes.
I won't reload for other people no matter how good a friend they are.
I would allow them to use my equipment under my supervision in hopes they would catch the reloading bug.
Perhaps I'm a little too paranoid, but "Stuff Happens".

[john.k]

if I was loading first time for someone to go hunting with.....Id be using book loads and jacketed bullets....Too much can go wrong with first time cast loads ,and make him unhappy ,to say the least.

[ElCheapo]

You're in for a learning curve, but it's a fun one! 30-30 is an ideal cast bullet rifle. If you don't already have a copy, Veral Smith's "Jacketed Performance with Cast Bullets" is a great place to start. Tons of good info in there!

I recently loaded up some ammo for my Dad's Model 94 30-30. Using the aforementioned 311008 with plain old COWW alloy PC'd and sized to .310, groups were right at an inch at 50 yds. These were doing 2200+ fps with 18.5 grains of AA#9. This is a low pressure, low recoil load that works great on animals up to deer size.

Note; unless you want to exceed about 2250 fps gas checks are unnecessary when using powdercoated bullets provided your barrel is nice and smooth inside. Good luck!

[jreidthompson1]

If you want subsonic data

http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm

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[sharps4590]

You're in for a learning curve

Yep.

[Eddie Southgate]

I'd buy the .311 sizer while I was at it . It is what I use and it works in all of my 30-30 rifles. Depending on the alloy your mold may throw .309 and it may not . Most of my factory molds do not . The .311 fits and I get no leading . My rifles are 94 Winchesters made in 1912, 1964, and 1972. Smaller lead bullets do not shoot as well for me and do tend to leave a bit of lead in two of the three rifles. IMR 3031 is my first choice with IMR 4198 my second. I don't shoot a very hard alloy generally , wheel weights is about as hard as I go and for hunting I use something more in the range of 50% clip on and 50% stick on or pure depending on what I have on hand. Bayou Brass and Bullets has good copper gas checks that are usually a good bit cheaper than the other brands and they are combat veteran owned . Like someone already said , stay away from FMJ for anything with a tube magazine , that would dangerous and there is no benefit to shooting them anyway. You asked for advice, there is mine based on over 50 years of experience loading and shooting, not just something I read on the internet.

[Fishman]

I will add the idea of not sizing the brass too much. By that I mean, just enough. If the brass you receive is all fired in his gun, use a full length sizer and then set it to "just" set the shoulder back a touch. Don't set the die to bottom out on the shell holder. Many will say that levers don't have the camming power to seat a cartridge in the chamber like a bolt gun, and that is somewhat true. But that also doesn't mean you have to push the shoulder back a whole bunch. This will result in better case life which is somewhat important these days, and likely a bit better accuracy.

[FergusonTO35]

I've ordered the Lee 170gn Flat Point mold, as well as the .309 Lube Sizer. I've seen that IMR 4198/3031 is a gold standard for the caliber, and thankfully, I at least have some IMR 4895 to put to use. I think it would be prudent to powder coat these projectiles as well. We aren't looking to reload immediately, we are just going to make sure that at some point we can make his rifle sing again.

Good choices you have there. Pick up some aluminum gas checks from James Sage Outdoors ($30.00/1000) and put them on the base of the boolit prior to sizing. I use a pair of channel locks to make sure they are seated all the way before putting them into the sizer. I really don't know how well .309 sizing will work as I've always done .310 or as cast. Hint: these boolits also work really well unsized and dipped in Lee Liquid Alox. I would start with around 24 grains IMR 4895 and slowly work your way up looking for best accuracy. I use range scrap lead, probably 10-12 BHN. Unless you are getting close to jacketed bullet pressure, I think sizing and lube is more important than hardness.

As others have said, it may be prudent to try jacketed slugs first. Hornady 170's are $35.00 a box here locally and if the rifle won't shoot at least decent with these then you have a problem.

[VariableRecall]

Good choices you have there. Pick up some aluminum gas checks from James Sage Outdoors ($30.00/1000) and put them on the base of the boolit prior to sizing. I use a pair of channel locks to make sure they are seated all the way before putting them into the sizer. I really don't know how well .309 sizing will work as I've always done .310 or as cast. Hint: these boolits also work really well unsized and dipped in Lee Liquid Alox. I would start with around 24 grains IMR 4895 and slowly work your way up looking for best accuracy. I use range scrap lead, probably 10-12 BHN. Unless you are getting close to jacketed bullet pressure, I think sizing and lube is more important than hardness.

As others have said, it may be prudent to try jacketed slugs first. Hornady 170's are $35.00 a box here locally and if the rifle won't shoot at least decent with these then you have a problem.

Unfortunately, I don't have any options for 30-30 compatible projectiles locally. My local Sportsman's Warehouse, which is usually the best place to get reloading stuff, doesn't seem to have them in stock. Prices online for the same projectiles aren't great either. However, a Boolit Buddy has volunteered to gift me some projectiles to try out before I begin casting for them. I'll be certain to use this page as a reference as I begin my step-by-step journey to getting economical range experience with a classic.

[beefan]

Based on my experience with two 94 Winchesters and a recently acquired Savage 340, pay attention to and adhere to the overall cartridge length listed in the manuals. If too long the cartridge will not feed from the tubular magazine of the 94, and you'll have problems ejecting an unfired round from the Savage action. Just my .02 worth.

Good luck and good shooting.

[OverMax]

I use IMR 4198 too. Since I cast my own I either Check or paper patch. Reason for the G-check >is to stop barrel leading. Speeds above 900 fps will lead a barrel and flame cut a bullet base. When I >paper-patch for my 30-30 and 32 spec I hand-load a duplex powder charge for those two.

[15meter]

For whisper loads in 30-30(and several others) follow the link in this thread:

https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?345420-Whisper-loads-for-223-30-30-30-06-45-70

May want to print out the PDF. Seems to me that website has become static. When that happens, websites have a tendency to evaporate.

[FergusonTO35]

Unfortunately, I don't have any options for 30-30 compatible projectiles locally. My local Sportsman's Warehouse, which is usually the best place to get reloading stuff, doesn't seem to have them in stock. Prices online for the same projectiles aren't great either. However, a Boolit Buddy has volunteered to gift me some projectiles to try out before I begin casting for them. I'll be certain to use this page as a reference as I begin my step-by-step journey to getting economical range experience with a classic.

Check these guys out. I've ordered from them before and they ship fast at reasonable cost:

https://talltalesoutdoor.com/hornady-interlock-bullets-30-30-winchester-308-diameter-170-grain-flat-nose-box-of-100/

[yeahbub]

It's been noted that you're in for an education, which is true, but it'll be a fun and informative one. You have mentioned your intention to use cast sized to .309, which may work out, but there are considerations with cast which militate toward better results when they are fatter, part of which is chamber dimensions. With cast, boolit fit is king. Accurate alignment and support in the rear and up front are important for best accuracy. The hardest cast boolits are softer than the softest jacketed, so it's important that they get a straight start, hence, the suggestion by others of using a larger diameter than groove dimension. The largest cast boolits which will still chamber without drag will better fill and center the case neck in the chamber (support and alignment in the back) while the bore diameter nose (.300 or .301) will center the nose on the lands. In mine, this means .311 diameter driving bands and a .301 nose. To find those dimensions is the reason to have the rifle in-hand before test rounds are assembled. Since you won't be producing ammo that will have to work in many .30-30's, you can tailor your efforts to this one and precision results.

BTW, Win '94's and most lever-actions are rear-locking which exhibit more bolt compression and action stretch, so the case shoulders will have to be set back somewhat more often than with a bolt gun. Cast boolit loadings will postpone this in some degree, but if you're trying out a new cast boolit or experimenting with sizing diameters, be sure you can close the action on a case by itself without shoulder interference which can be mistaken for a too-fat boolit. I prefer a full-length-sized case for this, just to be sure.

Powder coat is an excellent way to have boolits which aren't dirt magnets and can be driven at increased pressures/velocities without needing a gas check. They are available commercially in various diameters, but I can't think of who produces them just now - someone here will know.

Good luck with it. Keep us posted as to your results.

[robertbank]

I have been loading plinkers using 10 gr of Unique under Lyman's 311041 in 30-30 without GC's for some time now. Fun load and cheap to shoot. I have used this same 10 gr load in 30-06 and .303Br using various bullets as well. I do believe you are going to find your .309 sizing die to be to narrow for cast bullets. I would size .311. You want a tight fit or you will experience gas cutting and leading. Your rifle, your money just saying. Out to 50 yards the 10 gr Unique load can be a winner.

The collective advice to pay attention to your OAL is critical or you will spend a lot of waisted time trying to fish out those to long cartridges from the gun. We all speak with some...... experience in this regard. LOL.

Take Care

Bob

[Land Owner]

In the lever action 30-30 you CAN use Spire Pointed bullets, cast and jacketed, PROVIDED you load one in the chamber AND NO MORE THAN ONE in the magazine.

[GhostHawk]

The Lee .314 truncated cone sized to .311 or .312 with a light coat of BLL shoots great at close ranges ie grouse and rabbit. Over 3 grains of Red Dot it makes about the same noise as a .22lr. Shoots to the sights out to about 25 or 30 yards.

[imashooter2]

I'll pick up a Lube sizing die in .309 to split the difference, then.

Come to think of it, I already use .452 sizers for .45 ACP, so it makes sense to go a teeny bit higher in diameter for lead projectiles.

What BHN do you use with your 30-30 projectiles?

As a general rule, there are far fewer problems from sizing too large than sizing too small. .310 is solid advice. You should take it.

[RickinTN]

I don't think anyone has suggested one but a Lyman "M" die is worth it's weight in gold. I wouldn't load any cast bullets without one.
Rick

[waco]

RCBS neck expander dies for me in lieu of Lyman M dies. Either way it is important to expand the case neck not just flare the mouth.

[FergusonTO35]

I don't think anyone has suggested one but a Lyman "M" die is worth it's weight in gold. I wouldn't load any cast bullets without one.
Rick

Yes, this is a necessity in any cartridge which is primarily loaded from the factory with J-words. You can usually get good results without it in a cartridge that traditionally uses lead bullets such as .38 Special and .45-70.

[redgum]

LEE C312-185 Sized to .311"
MP Molds 308 Hnt HP GC
https://www.mp-molds.com/product/mp-308-hunting-hp-gc/

[indian joe]

In the lever action 30-30 you CAN use Spire Pointed bullets, cast and jacketed, PROVIDED you load one in the chamber AND NO MORE THAN ONE in the magazine.

"loading for a friend" .....that would be outright lunacy!!!!!!

[atr]

friendship is one thing....loading ammunition for a friend is something else. I agree with indian joe.

[veeman]

FWIW, I say don't. Steer your friend in the right direction to help him buy his own reloading equipment and learn him how to reload himself. That's more than I ever got.

[indian joe]

friendship is one thing....loading ammunition for a friend is something else. I agree with indian joe.

I was referencing to the Land Owner quote "CAN use spire pointed boolits in a lever gun" doing THAT for a friend would be lunacy ...............................cuz you just know somewhere down the track - them pointy bullets gonna get loaded ina magazine ...........................he might blow his hand off when the magazine chain fires - maybe it never happens...................

Normal reloads that you tested properly in his gun should be fine

Never understood why people want to mess with spitzers in a 30/30 carbine ? the ballistic advantage inside 200yards is marginal - keep em for a scope sighted bolt gun I reckon.