At what point is it the alloy ?

[Wolfdog91]

At what point do you look at you boolits not casting right and say " hay something's wrong with my alloy"

[Taterhead]

Interesting question. Following for answers. Having only started casting in 2016, I'm comparatively new compared to many here.

I can say thus far that my casting problems have never been the fault of the alloy.

Begs the question... what's got ya wondering about your alloy?

[M-Tecs]

It's a process of elimination if you are not getting the results you want. Not that many variables. You can control alloy and mold temp so that normally is the starting point. Next is the mold venting. If it's a new mold that can be an issue. If it's a proven mold unless it dirty or over smoked that should not be an issue. Fill speeds can create issues also. If I still have problems I switch to linotype proven alloy. If I can't get that to cast it's not the alloy.

What issues are you having?

[Winger Ed.]

If it's contaminated, you can look at it and tell.
If it clumps up and looks like oatmeal--- it's the alloy.

Other times, you might just be using a wrong alloy-- too hard or too soft for what you want it to do.

If your alloy doesn't do quite right in the mold, and the mold is OK, it's usually too much or too little heat.

[justindad]

Not sure when it’s the alloy, but it surely is never me!

[Land Owner]

What makes you believe you may have an "alloy problem"? If they "look funny" as boolits fall from the mold, there are any number of reasons. MOST cast boolits WILL SHOOT, even wrinkled and frosted ones. Whether they will shoot accurately, or not, is an equation in MANY variables.

What are you trying to accomplish? Not knowing that, I only speculate.

If I may, find ONE alloy and perfect that. My preference is 49/49/2 percent - Pb/WW/Sn. It melts well, casts well (provided I heat things up sufficiently), provides a LOT of usable unwrinkled, unfrosted boolits, mostly for handguns, though by the thousands for testing / plinking / selling (maybe) in single shot 223 handi-rifles. For handguns I shoot for accuracy within 30-feet; for rifles, nothing past 200 yds...ymmv.

[Dusty Bannister]

If you have been casting without issue, and change to a different batch, then perhaps you can question the alloy. One way to check that is to try the same alloy in other molds that you know are capable of good casting quality. If they produce junk, then maybe check the alloy further.That is one good reason to work with as large a batch as possible. Also, use caution when making your batches and not just dump in "mystery metal" unless you like some interesting casting sessions. Alloy is not the first thing I look to when having troubles.

[Sasquatch-1]

I do not shoot high power rifles (only handguns and traditional muzzle loaders.) The longest range I usually shoot is 40 yards with handguns. So, with that being said, I am not overly concerned about percentages in my alloy. The biggest problem I get is wrinkling. When this happens, I try to make sure there is no oils of any type in the mold and if it still persist, I add tin.

[243winxb]

When things are not right after fluxing and casting, shut the pot down. Let the alloy fully cool.

Next, bring the pot temperature up VERY SLOWLY. Just till the alloy becomes liquid. No fluxing, or mixing allowed.
The oatmeal needs carefully skimmed from the surface and trashed.

Now turn heat up to maximum in Lee pot. Flux with 50/50 bees wax/alox. Vapor should catch fire. Clean dross off.
Start casting till bullets show frost, drop pot temperature a little. Allow mold to cool a little.

This has removed a high percentage of copper, that keeps pluging the bottom pour spout. (Babbitt alloy)


Other fill out problems- sprue plate hole to small. Hole in botton pour pot need inlarged.

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?media/casting-with-lee-molds.4127/full

More- https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?media/albums/casting-bullets.310/

[reddog81]

What are the problems you are experiencing? Without knowing what the issue is it will be hard to help.

If I can’t good fill out with a mold I try to cast faster to get the mold hotter or turn up the lead temperature. If that doesn’t work out I put more tin into the alloy as it reduces the surface tension of the alloy and helps the alloy flow.

[bangerjim]

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Please elaborate on the "problems" you are having. We cannot tell from afar.

banger

[Bazoo]

I have had an ornery batch of wheel weight alloy. I rendered it down in smaller batches and one batch just wouldn’t cast worth a darn. I’d get inclusions, and incomplete fillout. I got frustrated. I couldn’t figure it out over several casting sessions. So I finally thought maybe it’s the alloy. I poured it back into ingots. Then started a fresh pot. Problem solved. It cast like normal. I always add tin at the first sign of it being ornery and that always helps. But it didn’t help that ornery batch. I even posted about it here and got many of the vague responses you get.

The answer was to separate it and mix it an ingot or two at a time with good alloy until it was used up. I never figured out what was its problem, but I finally got past it and figured out it was indeed the alloy and not me.

If you’ve been casting fine and then all the sudden start having problems after topping the pot off, or stopping and starting again and refilling the pot, suspect an ornery batch of alloy.

[charlie b]

I have to say I've only had one alloy problem when casting. But, the only lead I have used is 100% lead sheet, wheel weights (in the old days before zinc and such), and purchased alloys (mostly Lyman #2). The 100% lead was mixed with the WW or Lyman alloy.

The alloy problem? Trying to cast pure lead :) And, yes, I knew it was going to be difficult. Just wanted to try it. Didn't work (poor fill out). After mixing it with a bit of WW it was fine. I shot a lot of pistol bullets that were 50/50 WW/pure.

[Bazoo]

I’ve found fluxing with beeswax to give the best lead pouring properties. Sawdust makes the lead somewhat sluggish, paraffin somewhere in between. Beeswax and 2% tin is the remedy for many a problematic casting session I’ve found.

[charlie b]

That 2% tin is the key.

[bangerjim]

Sn is your "leeeeetle friend" when having mold fill problems. (If that is your problem. You have not told us your specific problem yet.) It lowers the surface tension and allows free flow of the molten alloy into nooks and crannies of your molds.

I generally run at least 2% Sn in all my alloys, because it does a good job.....................and I have lots & lots of it stashed away.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

what point?
the point after you've mastered the alloy temp, pour speed/head pressure/mold venting, and dump rhythm (mold temp).
...and...
most alloy problems are dirty alloy, as opposed to contaminated (with undesired metals), so fluxing/reducing is all that's needed to fix that.

[Green Frog]

Before I could answer your question, I would have to know what it was about your bullets was indicating to you that anything was wrong. Assuming you are dealing with actual binary (lead-tin) or tertiary (lead-tin-antimony) alloy without significant contamination, you should be able to get a virtually perfect cast bullet out of virtually any decent (and properly pepped) mould with proper temps and casting technique. Now, whether it will be right in your specific gun is yet another proposition. More information, please!

Froggie

[rintinglen]

Lot of good advice here, but I have to say that alloy is the LAST thing I check if I am having Problems. I have most commonly found that I have oil contamination, if a new mold, or else my temperature was not hot enough for that mold at my cadence. Your alloy in the pot should be smooth, shiny almost mirror like, not lumpy, when you get done fluxing. If not, you may have a problem.

[Wolfdog91]

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Please elaborate on the "problems" you are having. We cannot tell from afar.

bangerWell definitely my .22 cal just arnt fing about right at all. My .30cal stuff is OK .. I guess but I'm not really interested in OK or good enough I want my casts from be as good as possible. I have a PID I'm casting only at 745-755 max I keep my molds pretty hot, I still need to get a lazer thermometer for them.... But the only thing I can figure is it's this lead I've just been practicing with. It's just some wheel weight stuff I made a while ago. It's been fluxed and fluxed melted and re melted.
But my question really goes beyond that and my little deal here honestly https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220615/c2227a40d35044df32b952d217fa964b.jpg

Sent from my motorola one 5G UW using Tapatalk

[tja6435]

I’ve found 22 cal molds need to be run VERY hot and about as fast as you can.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Them thar 22s are wrinkly.

Boolits get wrinkly when the mold isn't hot enough. This is a very common problem with 22 boolits, because that small amount of alloy doesn't transfer much heat to the mold. Are you preheating the mold? Mostly, you need to find a technique that works with your equipment, so you can cast at a faster pace, so the mold doesn't cool down between dumps.

I don't see any indication of a alloy problem in the photo of your boolits.



Well definitely my .22 cal just arnt fing about right at all. My .30cal stuff is OK .. I guess but I'm not really interested in OK or good enough I want my casts from be as good as possible. I have a PID I'm casting only at 745-755 max I keep my molds pretty hot, I still need to get a lazer thermometer for them.... But the only thing I can figure is it's this lead I've just been practicing with. It's just some wheel weight stuff I made a while ago. It's been fluxed and fluxed melted and re melted.
But my question really goes beyond that and my little deal here honestly

No need for a lazer thermometer, just cast until the boolits are frosty, then back off a bit. It can take lots of practice to develop a rhythm for each mold.

[Land Owner]

See "From Ingot to Target: A Cast Bullet Guide for Handgunners", Chapter 8, "Idle Musings of a Greybeard Caster….", paragraph "Heating the Sprue Plate." of this link: https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?110212-From-Ingot-to-Target-A-Cast-Bullet-Guide-for-Handgunners

Getting the sprue plate HOT before the alloy passes into the mold (and a little bit of tin) will preclude those wrinkles. I have cast THOUSANDS of 223 caliber boolits in 2-cavity Bator (aluminum) and 2-cavity RCBS (steel) molds. Getting the sprue plate HOT is the answer.

https://i.postimg.cc/W4K8nyJF/Zombie_Killers_[2].jpg

[GregLaROCHE]

Even with a PID, it’s a good idea to turn the heat up while casting until the boolits frost and compare your results at different temperatures.

[Sam Sackett]

Yep. I agree with the suggestion that you need to heat things up. Mold, sprue plate and pot. I use a hooded hot plate to heat the mold. Place the mold on the hot plate sprue plate down for 10 - 15 minutes at medium or above. Run the pot up around 775 - 800 if you have to. Then see what the results are and go from there. There is a happy spot in there somewhere!

Sam Sackett

[Lead pot]

It's not the alloy that makes a bad looking bullet. It's the quality of the mould or the way it's cast.

I have cast bullets using alloy's most wouldn't think of using. Aluminum, copper bearing babbitts, zinc as well as other no lead alloys.
They all will cast a good looking and uniform weight bullet. You just have to adjust your temperature and casting procedures.

[405grain]

Wolfdog91: I agree with the others that this is a temperature problem, not an alloy problem. The boolits are solidifying in the mold so fast that they aren't getting proper fill out. Even the "good" 30 caliber boolit in your photo has a wrinkle on it's nose. There's a balance between increasing the heat of the pot and getting a good fill out in the molds. At some point you might start getting the metal in the pot too hot and that can cause the tin to start oxidizing. In that case you'll have to flux more frequently to keep all the alloy ingredients in solution.

The molten alloy might not be keeping the mold blocks at a high enough temperature for good fill out. Heating the mold blocks and the sprue plate might give you a "run" of good casts, until the blocks cool down again and the boolits start wrinkling again. In that event you'll need to heat the blocks again. I'm wondering if you're using aluminum molds? Aluminum transfers heat much faster than steel or iron. This means that a set of aluminum blocks will both heat up and cool off faster than a set of iron molds.

I'm going to get a lot of stink eye looks and grumbling comments for this; but Lee molds have both smaller aluminum mold blocks, and thinner sprue plates than most of the other brands of molds. This means that they loose heat faster than molds by Lyman, Saeco, RCBS, as well as aluminum blocks by other manufacturers. I'm sure that a bunch of guys are going to educate me that they use Lee molds without issue, and I've had some pretty good success with that brand - but I've only used their 30 caliber or larger molds. Those little 22 caliber pills that your casting might not be able to keep that particular mold set hot enough. You could try some tricks to keep your molds up to temperature, but this might add a little more effort to your casting sessions. In my (very humble) opinion, I think you should try a set of iron molds in 22 caliber. I don't cast in less than 6.5mm, and I've only tried one set of brass molds so my experience with those is limited, but the bulk of my molds are Lyman and RCBS, with just a few Lee molds, so I'm far from an expert. What I have noticed though is that I've had much higher success rates, better fill out, and and able to produce higher quality boolits with less effort when using iron molds. As always: your mileage may vary.

[GregLaROCHE]

I have a lot of Lee molds. Some do seem to give better results than others. If you want to step up a level in molds, have a look at: https://www.mp-molds.com/ they are known for their hollow points, but you don’t have to use the pin to make them hollow points. They seem to be one some of the best prices today.

[Geezer in NH]

Frosty bullets are happy bullets. Never had a problem with them for accuracy they just shoot great. Don't care if my bullets are shiny and pretty just how the shoot.

Your 22's were cold need more heat get them frosty and they will shoot.

[canyon-ghost]

I agree, it's the temp. Since you 're doing it by numbers with thermostats and thermometers, I just want to add that until I got a Pro20 bottom pour, I had no control over temperature except manually.
Used Lyman mini-mag 8# and a ladle. I simply let it get the alloy hot and poured quickly to heat up the mold ( discarded any wrinkly ones). To cool the mold, I'd slow down and wave the mold around while it was open. That way, I learned to cast with a watchful eye and rhythm.

You'll gain a lot of experience around these guys!

Good Luck,
Ron

[wv109323]

Get a cheap hot plate from one of the box stores. $8-10 bucks. I pre-heat my molds on "medium". I flip the mold over and get the sprue plate hot also. If the mold is too hot the sprue will be liquid for a long time. Slow your pace down until it takes the sprue 5-8 seconds to solidfy the sprue.
Either mold or alloy is too cold.