Vintage Flintlock Shotgun

[StuBach]

Ok so forgive me as this is totally out of my wheelhouse.

My dad passed and I am trying to help my mom sell his remaining firearms. We have this old mantle flintlock s x s shotgun that we don’t have any clue about. I know they can range in value wildly and I’m trying to help my mom get the proper value, any chance you guys can assist?

Unfortunately I haven’t had a chance to inspect the firearm myself and she claims it has no markings on it for smith or manufacturer so my apologies on the lack of info but any assistance would be greatly appreciated.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220601/9049414ef5a236883912bedbb3f696c7.jpeg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220601/6a8064189ace8df7bfe72cebf829bd00.jpeg


The one in question is the shotgun on top but I wouldn’t mind info on the musket as well just for info sake.

Thanks in advance for the help.

[elk hunter]

First off the shotgun is percussion, not flintlock. Hard to tell who made it without seeing it in person. It would be very unusual to not be marked in some way. If it was made in the US it should have a makers name on it. If made in Europe it should have a makers name and or proof marks. Condition is everything to shooters and collectors. For a wall hanger condition is far less important. From the picture it appears to be larger than 12 gauge and reasonably well made which will add to the value. It really needs to be evaluated by someone knowledgeable.

The rifle is a Springfield trapdoor. Probably a model 1873 but may be an earlier 1865 or 1866. Caliber could be 58 rimfire, 50-70 or 45-70 depending on the model.

Sorry I can't be more helpful.

[Jackrabbit1957]

The shotgun is a percussion fired gun, values can swing pretty wide depending on condition. It appears to have Damascus barrels, may be a decent quality judging by the gold colored inlays at the breech. We need to see more pictures before trying to say what its worth. The lower gun appears to be a trap door Springfield. Again more pictures needed to take a guess at value.

[pietro]

.

Please accept our condolences on your loss.

A fuller inspection might go a long way towards determining value of both guns.

A lot of the value is predicated on "condition", as compared to new.

Use a good light to determine the bore sizes & condition ( a biggie), and examine the wood for any defects - it looks like the shotgun's forend is in far from issue condition.

Sometimes, if the stock (musket) or forend (shotgun) is removed, proof or maker's marks can be found stamped into the hidden areas under the wood.

The shotgun barrels appear to be damascus/twist that, while normal for the making timeframe, may in fact be unshootable (another value factor).

.

[indian joe]

I have the single barrel mate of that shotgun - 11gauge - barrel marking is faint "Manton London" in squarish script that leans forward - stock on mine has been busted at the wrist - I shot it in comp years ago a couple times using a quiet load of Fg GOEX powder - mine is a wall hanger except we not allowed to do that. The lock geometry on my gun is first class (a lesson for modern percussion lockmakers)

[Winger Ed.]

I have one similar to that.
To identify it, I had to search with the proof marks. There's a couple of sites that show at least a few hundred of them.
You just have to match 'em up. They'll list where and during what time period the individual proof mark was used.

The rifle sure looks like a trap door Springfield.

For the value--- first figure out exactly what you have.
Then check the gun auction sites and antique firearms dealers, and see what they're going for.

[StuBach]

Thanks all for the lesson and some reminders. Now that it has been mentioned I recall dad mentioning it was Damascus twist barrel and from a European manufacturer. She doesn’t live overly close so not sure I’ll have a chance to inspect before she wants to sell so I advised she take it to a vintage firearms place near where she lives for appraisal.

[GregLaROCHE]

There are quite a few of double barrel percussion guns for sale here in France, but the majority are 16 gauge. They sell from 150-500 euros. As was already said, condition is everything.

[sharps4590]

The Trapdoor appears to have a Buffington rear sight so, if that's original would make it an 1883, no?

There is probably proofs on the bottom of the shotgun barrels which could identify and probably date it to a range.

[Bmi48219]

I have the single barrel mate of that shotgun - 11gauge - barrel marking is faint "Manton London" in squarish script that leans forward - stock on mine has been busted at the wrist - I shot it in comp years ago a couple times using a quiet load of Fg GOEX powder - mine is a wall hanger except we not allowed to do that. The lock geometry on my gun is first class (a lesson for modern percussion lockmakers)

Why not?

[indian joe]

Why not?

Aussie safe storage rules are onerous in the extreme - if guns are stolen from your house "the system" is more interested in prosecuting the errant owner than catching the crooks, get caught transporting a loaded firearm and its jail or an expensive lawyer and a solid fine . Green party politicians driving this.

[elmacgyver0]

Who cares what the value is?
It would be a crime to let it out of your family.

[elmacgyver0]

Aussie safe storage rules are onerous in the extreme - if guns are stolen from your house "the system" is more interested in prosecuting the errant owner than catching the crooks, get caught transporting a loaded firearm and its jail or an expensive lawyer and a solid fine . Green party politicians driving this.

I guess the Aussies are leaning towards going back to being a penal colony.
Sad

[Bmi48219]

I guess the Aussies are leaning towards going back to being a penal colony.

We’re catching up fast.

[indian joe]

We’re catching up fast.

yeah I wouldnt get too cocky about it, if you guys dont get rid of the dems and a whole slew of rino's in november you'll be in the same boat quicker than you think.

[StuBach]

Who cares what the value is?
It would be a crime to let it out of your family.

No real family heritage here, grandpa bought one dad bought the other both as wall hangers. My brothers and I don’t have good location to house nor do we have any attachment.

We have other guns for the attachment pieces so I’d rather get some money for my mom.