have you been lied to? stolen valor

[farmbif]

its a common thing these days for some veterans groups or individuals collecting for many different causes. but the stuff that burns me up the most is the wave of phonies that buy milsurp garb get all dressed up with all sorts of metals and such that they were never awarded and claim to be something they are not.
have any of you come in contact with any of these fools?

[MUSTANG]

Yes. For those who served it becomes obvious quickly - for those who have not served; not so much. Some are very polished Con-Artists.

[cwtebay]

I've seen quite a few fakes, but the one who burned me personally was a client for a number of years that quietly advertised that he is a veteran of Vietnam. I offer significant discounts to any service member - past and present. He was in the reception area and another long time client came in that is in charge of a veteran's support group (specifically Vietnam, Falkland, and Grenada veterans) - name of Danny. He began quizzing this fella about his tour (s) and unit, etc. During his appointment, Danny let me know that the guy is either quite confused or a fraud - it turned out to be the latter. Apparently, he had been stealing valor for at least 4 decades, collected many benefits and more importantly, stole from those who have served.


Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

[Ickisrulz]

Are you talking about trick-or-treaters on Halloween?

[Electrod47]

Though I have never encountered one of these guys up close, except stories revealed on the news and the VA newsfeed about prosecutions relating to false claims. This is one topic that burns me up.

[beezapilot]

We were talking about that just the other day. I remember Adm. Mike Boorda, good man who did a great job as CNO- Rising from Seaman to Admiral. We'll never really know why he added to his awards, but he took his own life over it.

My CO at the time had everyone in the command's records screened and had a personnel inspection to verify that people were wearing the correct ribbons. I got dinged for not have my ribbons awarded for action in the Viet Nam war, he was a little angry about it and asked me why? Protest? Nope, they are in my record, but according to the dates I would have been 8 years old at the time of the event. Getting those OUT of my record took a very long time and a lot of effort. Someone else's stuff had landed in my record. The days before computers, I always wondered if it robbed him of benefits.

I was involved in an investigation, it was long and drawn out but NIS at the time had some persistent people in it, I'll hit the high spots. Master Chief in the Navy, quite a lot of service awards was spotted in a Marine Corps uniform, wearing a different name tag. Upshot of the investigation he was an admin type who was processing service jackets out of Viet Nam, he would steal identities and set himself up in the reserves, he had several and had managed to juggle things around to collect paychecks and benefits under different names. Don't worry.. they threw away that key when he went to the garden spot of Kansas.

[MaryB]

Once in person. I was with my nephew who is air force and we ran into some dude pretending to be a hotshot pilot with 20 kills and a chest full of decorations. After 4 questions my nephew lit into him big time, so bad the dude undressed and left everything but his skivvies. My nephew burned the fakes clothes when we got back to his cabin in Alaska. We had made a trip into Anchorage for supplies for the hunting trip and the guy was standing in front of a store trying to get donations.

MANY times online!

[dannyd]

There have always been Fake's read about how LBJ joined the Navy and got the Silver Star. One of his Biggest lie's of all.

As far as Admiral Boorda I think there was a lot more going on than a medal but the one time I ran into him he was nice enough to let me go to my rack and sleep instead of listening to his talk in the chief's mess.

[beezapilot]

Come to think of it Mike Blumenthal, the ATTORNEY GENERAL for the state of Connecticut, claimed he served in Viet Nam when he was running for senator.
https://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/18/nyregion/18blumenthal.html

No better than caging drinks at the bar.

[Winger Ed.]

I've only busted one. A Marine 'Viet Nam vet.' who was born right around 1960.
The book "Stolen Valor" is nothing but accounts of it, and some very famous people are listed in it with their cases.
One guy who was buried in Arlington was dug up and thrown out.
After the book came out, I think stolen valor was made a felony.

A common thread that runs through all the cases I've seen is that none of these characters was ever a cook, worked in Supply,
a truck driver, or mechanic, etc. They all claim to have been some highly decorated, super Rambo type.

[M-Tecs]

When the Chris Kyle movie came out you couldn't go to a bar without someone claiming to be a "sniper". When I would ask them what a KD range was, wind drift or reading mirage most didn't have a clue.

[dverna]

My closest neighbor, The Hermit, is a "Vietnan Vet". He has a hat proclaiming so. He was in the army during the conflict but was stateside for his tour of duty. He loves being thanked for his service.

He got **** faced one day and told me his story of being under fire during the civil unrest in Detroit in the late 60's.

[Kenstone]

Come to think of it Mike Blumenthal, the ATTORNEY GENERAL for the state of Connecticut, claimed he served in Viet Nam when he was running for senator.
https://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/18/nyregion/18blumenthal.html

No better than caging drinks at the bar.

What's more surprising is Blumenthal was elected, re-elected, and still sits in the Senate today [smilie=b:

Search utube for "stolen valor" to view hundreds of vids of "stolen valor" confrontations, posted by people who have made outing these phonies their life long mission.
jmo,
.

[jaysouth]

What's more surprising is Blumenthal was elected, re-elected, and still sits in the Senate today [smilie=b:

Search utube for "stolen valor" to view hundreds of vids of "stolen valor" confrontations, posted by people who have made outing these phonies their life long mission.
jmo,
.

It appears that democrats in CN have no shame. He is a crook, but he is THEIR crook.

[beechbum444]

years ago, I was with my dad on a fishing trip in Louisiana. We down Bourbon street one afternoon and a guy approached my dad and said" got any change for a Vietnam vet?......." My dad got quiet and looked at the guy funny, then asked what year he was born..........the guy stumbled a bit and shot out a year...my dad looked at him and said " you were to (Bleeping) young to be in Nam, I was there in 67 & 68......you weren't" its kinda weird when the guy with the real 1000yd stare meets a phony.....

[jaysouth]

i worked part time as a bartender for several years after I got back from VN in 69. I am told that there were 500 Navy SEALS who served in VN. While tending bar, I met at least 5,000 of them.

[samari46]

Don't remember if this was true but John Kerry got taken to task after several swift boat vets downright questioned his getting a medal for some deed and the guys said he'd never been with them. Frank

[Winger Ed.]

Don't remember if this was true but John Kerry got taken to task after several swift boat vets downright questioned his getting a medal for some deed and the guys said he'd never been with them. Frank

Kerry was there from Dec. '68, to Apr. '69 and was assigned to the SWIFT boats.
He was awarded a Silver Star, a Bronze Star.
After receiving his 3rd Purple Heart, he applied for and was granted an early return from Viet Nam.
According to some Sailors that served with him, he greatly embellished his actions.

[Kenstone]

Kerry was there from Dec. '68, to Apr. '69 and was assigned to the SWIFT boats.
He was awarded a Silver Star, a Bronze Star.
After receiving his 3rd Purple Heart, he applied for and was granted an early return from Viet Nam.
According to some Sailors that served with him, he greatly embellished his actions.

Yes that, and I recall he thru those medals away at a public war protest rally after his return from VN.
Could be wrong about that though, might have been someone else...

[Winger Ed.]

Yes that, and I recall he thru those medals away at a public war protest rally after his return from VN.
Could be wrong about that though, might have been someone else...

He did, and became a leader in the Viet Nam vets against the war too..... at least as long as he benefitted from it.
After he was in the Senate-- he didn't talk about that too much.

[bedbugbilly]

Seems to be a common ploy for some who "panhandle". My wife and I have seen it in a number of places as we travel back and forth to Arizona. Have also seen :handicapped" who sit in a wheelchair claiming to be disabled . . . until they get up out of the chair to take a smoke break. Those who claim to be veterans who aren't are the worst sort IMHO.

[Land Owner]

I know what I know. I know what I don't know. I served the USCG while this country fought in Vietnam. I have "global" memories, a medal, a service ribbon, and a DD214. I wasn't sent to Vietnam. The benefits and freedoms earned by my brothers in arms still give me pause today. I used the GI Bill toward an education after service. That I earned. I don't try to unravel someone else's convoluted story. I'm not "smart" like that. I don't care about them or their story and I'm especially not giving them charity. I am living my own life and seek no attention for Vietnam-era service, although I lived the days of "Sailors and Dogs Keep Off of the Grass". I didn't earn under fire the "blank check for freedom" patch, though I did write a "blank check" if it had come to that, and once, nearly got checked...but it doesn't compare in my mind.

[rancher1913]

as with everything, if something is rewarded it is turned into a money maker. with the flood of lucrative service charities comes the flood of scam artists looking to ride the coat tails.

[fatnhappy]

I don't rightly know how to tell this one. I used to work for the gas and electric company sub-contractor during the summers in the 90s when I was in college. So did my brother. We're both vets, he Marine, myself Army. One of the foremen was a Marine vet, Vietnam era draftee and generally a dope smoking low life. During conversations back then he told he spent his entire Marine Corp service as a lifeguard in Florida. He lived in a small town southwest of Rochester.

Fast forward almost 30 years. One of the places I hunt is a dairy farm in south west of Rochester. Standing around shooting the breeze with the owner and his buddies between drives somebody mentions Howie over at the Legion at 10 am because as he tells it "his PTSD is acting up."
Sure as heck.... it's the same guy. I said something to the effect that "what did he get naped with sun tan oil?"
He'd been telling guys for years he was a Vietnam vet which I very quickly disabused.

He is now thoroughly ridiculed in his rural small town to the point a guy who had no shame as the 10 am town drunk is too embarrassed to go to the legion.

[lightman]

I was in a concealed carry class with a guy that claimed to have been a Navy Seal. He was a soft looking Dough boy looking guy with a roll of fat around his waist big enough to make it difficult to draw his handgun. He had trouble figuring out how to make his Kimber work and could't hit the target at 7 yards. We pretty much laughed him out of class. Seals! They're everywhere!!!

[Kraschenbirn]

Yep, sure have!! And, one of the worst was Commander of a small-town American Legion Post with whom I'd worked back in the late '60s-early '70s. During the time he claimed to have been in Viet Nam, he was a Reservist, a quartermaster corporal, but thirty-some years later he was claiming to have been a Gunny Sergeant running a Recon Team out of Dong Ha. He didn't remember me from the old days and I never called him on his stories. Doesn't matter now cause he passed a couple years back but it still irks me to see that plaque behind the bar in the Post clubroom.

Bill

[KenT7021]

I believe that Kerry wounds were a result of his improper use of an M-79.Self inflicted.

[Winger Ed.]

I believe that Kerry wounds were a result of his improper use of an M-79.Self inflicted.

A Corpsman at the time said he fixed one wound with a band-aid, and Kerry insisted on getting a Purple Heart for it.
He seemed to have gotten what he came for in Viet Nam, and after 3 Purple Hearts,
you could apply to leave early- which he did after being in country for four months.

His deal; and it is what it is, but his actions also cheapen the decorations for those that really earned them.

[EMC45]

Seen tons of them. The wife and I were recently in Nashville for our anniversary and I commented to her that every bum I saw had a veteran/disabled veteran sign. Saw one that said "Navy Veteran". I almost asked him where he went to boot and A School.....

Another character used to come into the local hardware store when I worked there. He wore a BDU top with pins and flash all over it. Said he was a "green beret" at 16 and JFK put his beret on his head. Said he was the youngest Green Beret in history. He would often try to impress everyone with stories from Viet Nam, but I couldn't stomach it. Another younger fella that I worked with there was on and on about the guy and all his exploits one day when I told him his was a phony. I let my co-worker read "Stolen Valor" by B.G. Burkett. He got schooled real quick.

[akajun]

When the Chris Kyle movie came out you couldn't go to a bar without someone claiming to be a "sniper". When I would ask them what a KD range was, wind drift or reading mirage most didn't have a clue. HAHAHA yep
That Mirage is a hell of a car for tokyo drifting

[akajun]

My dad was in the Seabees in Vietnam in 68 as a surveyor/engineer and is quick to tell you he never fired a gun in anger. He has a knack for remembering maps, roads, territory layout forever and it transferred to his civilian life as a surveyor/civil engineer and on those issues he is never wrong. He can usually spot the phonies by talking to them about cities, roads, layouts, maps, etc. Ive never seen him call one out, but after we leave hell say that guys full of it.
That said IDK if any of you watch Don Shipley on Youtube, he was questioning a suspected fake Seal from Italy whose info didn't match up and Don was getting frustrated and short with him. However he did find the guys name but his class number was wrong. Listening to the rest of the clip i believe the guy may be going through early stages of Alzheimer's and was having trouble remembering everything. As our veterans age that is something we need to be aware of that they " important details" will be fuzzier than they used to be so it may not always be stolen valor as much as old age.

[jonp]

Several. When I was more active in Patriot Guard Riders we kept a sharp eye out and caught a few. Mostly it was right at the start of Iraq when everyone wanted to be a hero. One guy with us served during Vietnam and was a Vietnam Vet but he always took great pains to make it clear he was a Vietnam Era Vet and did not deploy.

[jonp]

When anyone mentions Stolen Valor I always immediately think of the King Of All, Nick Androvsky AKA "MSGT Soup Sandwich"

Dude showed up at his step sons graduation at Ft Benning dressed up like a Halloween Project. Even had an Antarctic Service Medal which you have to over winter to get and a SF "Shark Hunter" Dive Medal. Reportedly the Watch Sgt took one look and went into the OIC's office and said "Sir, you gotta come see this" after which MP's showed up to escort him off post. Stolen Valor is out there and guys wear ribbons for all sorts of reasons but it takes a special type of stupid to set foot on a military base like this guy did.

299706

[Walks]

I Don't say anything about when, where, what or why. Only other person in My family is my bil, air force. Our experiences were so different, there is Nothing to talk about.
IME, the people who talk about it, weren't there. If asked, I just say: "I was in the service" and nothing else.

[warren5421]

Ever talk to a Navy Vietnam Era Vet that worked supply for Cubin Exiles? Think 73-74.

[Winger Ed.]

Ever talk to a Navy Vietnam Era Vet that worked supply for Cubin Exiles? Think 73-74.

Closest I can come to that is I knew a 2nd Class Parachute Rigger when we were both at NAS Lakehurst for PR 'C' School in '77.
He'd been in about 6-7 years- maybe more, and had spent most of his Viet Nam war years at 'Gitmo'.
If he had any fond memories of the place, he never told me about any of them.

[cwtebay]

You know, I am starting another counterpoint post. Humble Valor.

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

[Winger Ed.]

You know, I am starting another counterpoint post. Humble Valor.

It will have to include one of my uncles.
During WWII. as a USN issue LtJG, he was very proud of the fact that while he was the Officer In Charge of the Library
at US Navy base Roosevelt Roads in Puerto Rico----
Largely due to his efforts, the Germans never conducted a successful invasion.

[cwtebay]

It will have to include one of my uncles.
During WWII. as a USN issue LtJG, he was very proud of the fact that while he was the Officer In Charge of the Library
at US Navy base Roosevelt Roads in Puerto Rico---- The Germans never conducted a successful invasion.Love it Winger Ed!

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

[Winger Ed.]

That'll be a long thread.
Here's another entry:

The comic George Gobel was on the old Johnny Carson show one time.
They were talking about some of the Hollywood types there who were veterans.

George told him that while he was a Flight Instructor in Fallon Nevada during WWII-
Not one single Japanese bomber made it through their defenses.

[akajun]

Ever talk to a Navy Vietnam Era Vet that worked supply for Cubin Exiles? Think 73-74.

HAHAHA Close, my dad was sent to Cuba after VN, he said he did a lot of the design and layout for many of the buildings and bunkers there as they were rebuilding the base. When he talks to my friends that were stationed in Gitmo for the War on Terror, they told him a lot of the projects he worked on were still in use even though he said they were not designed to be used that long. Swole his head up pretty good lol.

After Cuba they sent him to Maine, in the winter, and living in a mobile home. To someone born and raised in South LA, he said that was the hardest part of his service but he did kill some deer up there so he was happy about that.

[Larry Gibson]

There was something like 2,800,000 service members who actually served in the Viet Nam theater. Last censes 9,400.000 were still alive.......just sayin'.....

[Kraschenbirn]

There was something like 2,800,000 service members who actually served in the Viet Nam theater. Last censes 9,400.000 were still alive.......just sayin'.....

Uuuh, Larry, did you misplace the decimal point or, maybe, add an extra zero or two onto that census number?

Off-the-wall question: I did two tours; does that mean I'm counted twice in that 2.8 M number?

Bill

[cwtebay]

According to the VA's stats - 2.7 million served, 850,000 survive.
And Bill, your question is a very valid one. I've asked that same question for other conflicts as well and gotten vague responses. Looking at stats for conflicts such as Grenada make no sense, the number reported to have served from various countries would be hard pressed to fit on the island.

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

[farmbif]

how many actually were in Grenada? I read something about Grenada that said first flight in was 60 that included a seal team then 1000 marines.