9mm expander plug for cast

[Hickok]

I have been expanding my 9mm Luger cases the hard way, and just need advice on getting a proper expander-plug for 9mm cast oversize boolits.

Using a sized .357" 9mm boolit for my loads, I take my Lyman .357 magnum/.38 Special expander die and run it into the case, being careful not to go too deep, as it will bulge the case and prevent chambering.

I then take my regular 9mm expander die and flare/bevel the case just enough so the boolit will seat without scraping or shaving the boolit.

It would be alot easier and faster to have the proper size and length expander plug and do the operation in one pass.

My standard 9mm expander is .353" and the .357 Magnum/38 Special is .355" on my dies, but .357 magnum/.38 Special is longer then the 9mm.

Should I get a .357/38 Special expander and shorten the length for the 9mm case, or go with a .38 S&W expander (Which is larger) and hone it down to .355-356" for the 9mm cast boolit?

Or does anyone make/sell a expander plug expressly for over-size 9mm boolits?

[GBertolet]

I went the shortened 38 special expander route. Also, I made an oversized 9mm expander for my Dillon press. Unfortunately, most reloading expanders are made for jacketed bullets, so being overly snug is of no consequence. You got to figure about .001 springback, after expanding, making the fit even tighter. If your dies are RCBS, they do make a cowboy expander in 38 special, which is about .002 larger. That would be even better to purchase, and then shorten.

[Soundguy]

I've use a spare 38 expander in the past.. but also have used a universal expander. What I've found is that on the lead bullets.. as long as the mouth is flared enough not to shave.. the lower mouth can still be a hair tight and it's all good. the shaving is the bad part.

[Chuck Perry]

I believe NOE offers what you are looking for. They have custom expander buttons for the Lee Universal expander dies.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[Pine Baron]

i've had good luck with the Lee 38 S&W plug, but yes it does tend to go a little too deep and bulge the case.sometimes, however, knock on wood, it hasn't been a problem.

[toallmy]

I use a lee 9mm die , but it has a 38 smith& Wesson not 38 special insert in the die , it’s hollow so I can load with a lee disk powder measure . But as mentioned above NOE inserts are available in some very useful sizes .

[jetinteriorguy]

Either the NOE expander plug or a Lyman M die in 9mm.

[243winxb]

The RCBS 9mm die set i bought jan 2021 came with this. Has the M step. https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?media/rcbs-expander-m-type-9mm-strange-black-coating.3604/full

The RCBS Fl sizing carbide die sleeve keeps the taper in the sized brass. Not a carbide ring that sizes the whole case body the same diameter.

[Hickok]

My 9mm Luger dies are RCBS. The RCBS expander measures .353", but mine does not have the "step" as in the picture from 243winxb posted. My expander simply forms a bell/bugle shape to the case, a "flare".

To get the case expanded larger, I run it through a Lyman 38 special/357 magnum "M" die, as it mics .355". But I can't run the case too deep into the 38/357 "M" die, because it will bulge a 9mm case,...I don't get the benefit of the "M" die "step" , because it is made for the longer .38/357 case.

I then have to switch back to my RCBS 9mm expander die to get a slight flare to the case so I can start my boolit without shaving or mangling the boolit.

RCBS and Lyman have no available expander plugs for the cowboy dies or the 38 special/357.

I believe I will go with the Lee die and the NOE expander plugs....still cheaper than buying another complete Lyman 38/357 expander die and shortening the expander plug to use for 9mm.

Manufacturing and supply sure is messed up in this country since COVID !

[GWS]

The RCBS 9mm die set i bought jan 2021 came with this. Has the M step. https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?media/rcbs-expander-m-type-9mm-strange-black-coating.3604/full

The RCBS Fl sizing carbide die sleeve keeps the taper in the sized brass. Not a carbide ring that sizes the whole case body the same diameter.

Cool......that's good to know! RCBS is doing their usual. New, better than last years, products, no advertising to let any one know....baffling to say the least.

Wonder if those "M" expanders are included in other pistol calibers? They sure make progressive presses work better.

[MOA]

I just picked up the expander an the Lee universal die it fits into with just a click at NOE bullet molds.
Easy peasy.

[capo602002]

I'll second the NOE expanders. Have several and they work great. Good price also!

[725]

I've used the Lee Universal expander die w/o issue.

[HiVelocity]

Here's the link for what you need, sir.

https://noebulletmolds.com/site/product-category/bullet-casting-reloading/expanders/expander-plug-pistol/

HV

[Kenstone]

I use a lee 9mm die , but it has a 38 smith& Wesson not 38 special insert in the die , it’s hollow so I can load with a lee disk powder measure . But as mentioned above NOE inserts are available in some very useful sizes .

Yep, this:
https://www.titanreloading.com/product/lee-se1699-pm-exp-plug-38-sw/?search=Lee%20SE1699

https://leeprecision.com/pm-expan-plg-38-s-w.html

Drop-in fit to Lee 9mm powder thru expander die.
jmo,
.

[Hickok]

Thanks to each of you for the great information! I knew I could get hand's on experience from people on this site!

I have been doing the expanding for 9mm with cast the hard way for years.

I just sent out an order to NOE. :bigsmyl2:

[kevin c]

An alternative is to get member Lathesmith to turn you a custom expander.

[armoredman]

All i did was set the standard Lee expander/powder through die in slightly deeper for cast, then back it out slightly for j-words. Since it holds the power measure on the press, it's a one-two, expand, then charge.
No deep thought or precision measurements, as the bullet seater will take the flare out of the cast setting, and if I need to, with J-words I can use the dreaded Factory Crimp Die, which works well for me.
Of course, I am a mere hobbyist who doesn't load for match or precision use, just practice and fun.

[Taterhead]

Cool......that's good to know! RCBS is doing their usual. New, better than last years, products, no advertising to let any one know....baffling to say the least.

Wonder if those "M" expanders are included in other pistol calibers? They sure make progressive presses work better.

Yes. All the handgun sets since about 2007 (IIRC) have M style expanders. RCBS graciously retrofitted my older sets with M assemblies for free when I inquired about purchasing them. They are a better mousetrap.

Regarding the question in the OP, the RCBS 38 Cowboy expander plug is a good width for .356-.358" 9mm bullets, but it is too long. I just honed some length off the bottom going really slowly on my bench grinder. Not the prettiest job, but it works. The metal is fairly soft. The standard 38 sp plug is good for .356" 9mm, but also lmust habe some length removed.

RCBS sells the shanks separately, but they might just give you one. I've received a number of them for free for various calibers.

[GWS]

Yes. All the handgun sets since about 2007 (IIRC) have M style expanders. RCBS graciously retrofitted my older sets with M assemblies for free when I inquired about purchasing them. They are a better mousetrap.

Regarding the question in the OP, the RCBS 38 Cowboy expander plug is a good width for .356-.358" 9mm bullets, but it is too long. I just honed some length off the bottom going really slowly on my bench grinder. Not the prettiest job, but it works. The metal is fairly soft. The standard 38 sp plug is good for .356" 9mm, but also lmust habe some length removed.

RCBS sells the shanks separately, but they might just give you one. I've received a number of them for free for various calibers.

Mine are way older than that. I think I bought my oldest pistol die sets in 1972. ;)

When I bought my Pro 2000 progressive, (Obama's first January in office), I had to wait a year before RCBS started making "M" style powder-though expanders for the case activated Uniflow powder measure on it, giving me another station for a pistol bullet feeder:

https://i.postimg.cc/J4TPfSmJ/Inked152982_LI.jpg

Now they make an "M" style expander die for their .223 and .308 tube rifle bullet feeders (lfor which I made a collator for from files here on CastBoolits. Both products work super.

[brassrat]

The last I looked, M dies are scarce to nonexistent. This is for the last year. Luckily, I quickly got the proper one for 9mm and not using a .38 one, anymore. Strangely enough that fixed my 9 and .380 loading.

[jsizemore]

I had lathesmith make me one for my Dillon 550.

[nueces5]

I bought a custom one from Lathesmith, it works great on my dillon 550.
Almost in the mouth it has a 358 diameter ring that does its job very well.
I load 356 boolits and some go in effortlessly

[Hickok]

Can any of you tell me how fast NOE is when it comes to filling orders?

Just wondering, as I realize some places have a back-log.

[iflyskyhigh]

Just looked at the NOE page. Couple questions.

I read through the post and didn’t see the answer.

Why would you want this as opposed to the expander the comes in the powder through expander for the given cartridge?

I’ve been using that for more than a decade with great results. I do load development on my 550 loading with an electronic powder dispenser and the Lee PTE die. Then bulk load on my 650 with the Mr. Bullet feeder expander and it works great.

I followed the advice of another loader on the Enos forums and started opening up the case mount wider than I normally would, but even doing that with the Lee die seemed to work great.

What are the benefits of switching to NOE expander?

Second, can someone point me at the correct one?

Loading .356 coated. So would I want the .356, .357, or .358 to get correct flair?

Same question for my .402, and .452 cast coated.

Thanks felleras.

[Taterhead]

Just looked at the NOE page. Couple questions.

I read through the post and didn’t see the answer.

Why would you want this as opposed to the expander the comes in the powder through expander for the given cartridge?

I’ve been using that for more than a decade with great results. I do load development on my 550 loading with an electronic powder dispenser and the Lee PTE die. Then bulk load on my 650 with the Mr. Bullet feeder expander and it works great.

I followed the advice of another loader on the Enos forums and started opening up the case mount wider than I normally would, but even doing that with the Lee die seemed to work great.

What are the benefits of switching to NOE expander?

Second, can someone point me at the correct one?

Loading .356 coated. So would I want the .356, .357, or .358 to get correct flair?

Same question for my .402, and .452 cast coated.

Thanks felleras.

If you are set up to use a powder through expander (e.g. Dillon 550) then the NOE expander plugs are not really suitable.

Regarding sizing... firstly find the menu of pistol or rifle expanders as the case may be. Then you'll find them catalogued woth two dimensions. One is for the interior diameter of the neck. The second (larger) is for the diameter of the case mouth flair. Those dimensions should straddle the actual bullet diameter. The first giving the desired interference fit, and the larger some flair to get the bullet started.

[farmerjim]

I believe NOE offers what you are looking for. They have custom expander buttons for the Lee Universal expander dies.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

I like the NOE expander buttons.

[Kenstone]

Just looked at the NOE page. Couple questions.

I read through the post and didn’t see the answer.

Why would you want this as opposed to the expander the comes in the powder through expander for the given cartridge?

I’ve been using that for more than a decade with great results. I do load development on my 550 loading with an electronic powder dispenser and the Lee PTE die. Then bulk load on my 650 with the Mr. Bullet feeder expander and it works great.

I followed the advice of another loader on the Enos forums and started opening up the case mount wider than I normally would, but even doing that with the Lee die seemed to work great.

What are the benefits of switching to NOE expander?

Second, can someone point me at the correct one?

Loading .356 coated. So would I want the .356, .357, or .358 to get correct flair?

Same question for my .402, and .452 cast coated.

Thanks felleras.

Good questions.

The sole reason I use a larger diameter expander is over-sized cast/coated bullets were being swaged smaller (dia.) by the case when seating.
Most expanders sold expand a case for jacketed bullet sizes, in the case of 9mm, .355 dia. jacketed bullets.
A cast bullet any larger would be swaged down by the case.

The flare is of little consequence, but with an "M" expander, a 2nd dia. is formed at the case mouth to better guide the bullet into the case/less tipping over in a progressive, instead of that flare.
You can seat a measured bullet in a dummy round, expanded with you current expander, and pull it to re-measure it for any signs of swaging.
If there is none, um, nevermind...
:?
.