Excessive lead dross

[DaveW]

I was given over 600lbs of lead sheeting from a dental office, it was used to shield the walls of their pan x-ray. I melted about 6lbs of it down the other day and had a very confusing result. I was getting a never-ending amount of dross off the top. I would scoop it off, then more just takes it's place. The top had a gold/copper look to it that I haven't seen before. I thought this stuff was close to pure lead so I don't understand where all the dross is coming from. I'm not sure what temp i was running but I had my Lee pot on at level 7, I fluxed with a heathy amount of paraffin wax twice. I was able to cast 20 7/8oz lee slugs but they had imperfections because of the impurities in the lead.

I need some advice. Has anyone seen anything like this? Was I making some obvious rookie mistake, or is this just not good quality material?

Thanks

[JimB..]

I’ve assumed that it’s very close to pure. Does it look like big sheets folded up, is it very easily bent, scratched with a finger nail, etc? Also, is it covered in adhesive, bits of drywall, etc?

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

DaveW,
welcome to the forum.

The hotter the pot, the more dross is created.
What does the thermometer say?

Typically you want the pot around 100º above the liquidus temp.

[MrWolf]

Did you use any pine bedding or sawdust to help remove the junk? Using just wax will not do that from my experience. I also use a thermometer to know what temp I am working with.

[DaveW]

Thanks for all the replies so far.

Yes it is sheeting that is folded up, easy to bend and scratch with a fingernail. It has bits of drywall and some bits of tape and adhesive. Sounds like it is the exact type of material that you are talking about, JimB

I do not have a thermometer yet so I don't know my temp. It sounds like this could be my biggest issue. I was trying to get along until I built a PDI temp controller. I think I'll pick up a lead thermometer in the mean time and monitor my temp closely next time I cast. I was probably running the pot way too hot.

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[dondiego]

I run my LEE pot at the 7 mark on the dial. Should be OK.

[Retumbo]

Peraffin does not "clean" the lead.

Use pine shavings.

http://www.lasc.us/FryxellFluxing.htm

edit;

seems some x-ray shielding can contain 2-4% antimony

[JimB..]

Get a thermometer, and most important, get a dutch oven or stainless steel pan to do this work in. You get better access to stir and skim, work in larger batches, plus you keep a ton of junk out of the casting pot.

Save all that dross, it’s mostly good metal, just toss it in with your next big batch.

I flux with pine shavings and stir with a wood paint stick a couple times, skim the debris off and repeat, then last time I toss in a little bees wax and set it on fire.

[243winxb]

Lee pot at maximum. Flux. Bees wax lube should burst into fire. Now clean off surface. Drop dial to 8, cast bullets.

The slug mold needs pure lead & lots of heat. Pressure cast helps fill out. I had the 1 oz Lee.

[DaveW]

Sounds like step one is I need to get a thermometer before I go any further. I will try the pine shavings to flux as well. That link about fluxing was super helpful.

I've been looking at getting a pot and propane burner to do my initial processing. I just cleaned my Lee pot last night and it was a painful process, I never want it to get that dirty again.

I was afraid that my 600lb nest egg of lead was no good but i will use all of your suggestions and give it another go.

On a positive note, the slugs that I did drop shot very well. I was able to ring my 6"x6" gong at 120 yards on the 4th shot! I did some 50/50WW .458 boolits for my 45/70 and got a 4" group at 100 yards with iron sight (thats about as good as I can do without a scope). I saw some leading from those rounds but I'm pretty sure I'm undersized for my bore. That's a different topic for a different board though.

I've caught the casting bug and I'm having way too much fun with this. Thanks for the great advise everyone.

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[Retumbo]

Next, powder coating

[DaveW]

Next, powder coatingAbsolutely! I already have the setup for that too.

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[Sasquatch-1]

Put a propane torch to the dross you pulled off your melt. See how much liquefies. Pour whatever liquefies into an ingot mold of some kind. It is probably good lead. The real dirt should be like ash. This usually gets discarded.

[Land Owner]

Welcome to the Forum DaveW. Others have said - get a bigger pot - for bulk melting. Several Members offer half of a 30# steel propane tank, which will melt over 100#'s of raw materials, or you can carefully make one. Know that if you go this route, 100#'s of molten lead/alloy won't tolerate a flimsy base, presents hazards while pouring into ingot molds, is unforgiving when spilled, and is best done in a WELL-VENTILATED space (outside). Self-protection and SAFETY are your first priorities. Wear eye, hand, arm, leg, and feet protection.

Many here have seen gold and other rainbow colors on the surface of their melt. These are indicators of heat, constituents in the pot, and a CLEAN surface that has been fluxed and skimmed. A few zinc WW's in a 100# pot are insufficient to create a consequence. A LOT of zinc WW's, especially in a 20# pot, are OATMEAL. You don't want that.

Candles, crayons, and (more expensive) bees wax are excellent fluxes, particularly in 100# batches. BE WARNED, the heat of the melt WILL catch the wax ON FIRE, unexpectedly from waxy smoke, oxygen, and heat. Expect the unexpected. Know the known-unknowns. Beware the unknown-unknowns.

Sawdust is a cheap flux for 20# pots to keep constituents in solution, that with heat want to disassociate or comingle with air the melt-air interface.

It is not necessary to use a thermometer while melting lead and WW's into ingots. A propane turkey fryer heats the 100# melt in a 30# steel tank half. An "A" frame suspends the pot by chains over the fryer base/propane flame. When 100#'s are melted, copiously fluxed, and dross extracted, pour the remains into 3# ingots molds.

Sticking 3# ingots of known composition in a 20# pot is quick. Flux with wax again, skim off dross again (should be very little), add sawdust to the pot, and spout the melted alloy into a heated mold. Make boolits.
Ta da!

Your methods and equipment may vary.



https://i.postimg.cc/GtHCkGjg/IMG_0806.jpg



Pretty quickly your ingots will stack up...19 MAX in a steel ammo can is about all one can carry. Wear SHOES.



https://i.postimg.cc/gj4R0vtd/Ingots_002.jpg

[Bazoo]

If you’re around me, you can use my smelting setup if you BYOP (bring your own propane). I can provide sawdust from my wood shop, though it will be maple and ash mainly.

[Rich/WIS]

If you are closer to SE KY same offer as Bazoo.

[GregLaROCHE]

Like others have said, you need sawdust or similar to flux first and then the wax. When I make ingots from range scrap, I only use sawdust or equivalent. I flux with sawdust followed with beeswax in my casting pot.

[DaveW]

Thanks for the offers to use your setups. I doubt Iwould be close enough to any of you guys, I live in Canada.

I think not using sawdust or wood shavings is my biggest mistake so far. I was lead to believe that wax could be a replacement for sawdust. It's nice to know that most of you guys use both in your process. Good thing they are both easy to find. I'll keep at it and sort out the kinks in my setup.

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[Retumbo]

What part of Canada, it's kinda big you know

[oley55]

Thanks for the offers to use your setups. I doubt I would be close enough to any of you guys, I live in Canada.

Off topic but... this is a pretty nice forum that is mostly populated by really good folks. After you have been around a bit and feel more comfortable give consideration to adding a general location to your profile. You would be surprised by how many folks are near by who would be eager to offer help. This place loves to help new guys.

[Bazoo]

I use sawdust when rendering scrap into ingots. Then I use wax and flux again. And when in the pot for casting, I use beeswax.


I have smelted in my pot, and cast straight from it after a couple good fluxes. No issues but it’s less convenient. That with a dipper pot.

[farmbif]

where's the OP at? ive got bushels of red cedar shavings.
like others I use a cast iron pot to melt stuff down throw in a handful of saw dust, wood shavings and a bit of bees wax, mix well scoop ands trail the junk off the top then use a ladle or pour into ingots. only use clean ingots in casting pot

[JimB..]

where's the OP at? ive got bushels of red cedar shavings.
like others I use a cast iron pot to melt stuff down throw in a handful of saw dust, wood shavings and a bit of bees wax, mix well scoop ands trail the junk off the top then use a ladle or pour into ingots. only use clean ingots in casting pot
He’s up der in da nort.

[DaveW]

What part of Canada, it's kinda big you knowHaha. Yeah it's not a small place. Calgary, Alberta is my stomping grounds.

I know theres a good amount of casters up here too because they always get to the tire shops just before me and clean them out. Lol

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[Retumbo]

Haha. Yeah it's not a small place. Calgary, Alberta is my stomping grounds.

I know theres a good amount of casters up here too because they always get to the tire shops just before me and clean them out. Lol

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You can always hop on CGN and find someone close to give you a hand

[DaveW]

You can always hop on CGN and find someone close to give you a handI've never been a forum guy, just a lurker but I'm starting to come around. CGN would probably be a good one for me to get involved in. I need a new shooting buddy as well, my current one is getting flaky.

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