VW Beetles

[Battis]

Looking for opinions and experiences with 70s VW Beetles. My wife has always wanted one so we started looking around. I'm talking about a restored one, not one that needs alot of work. Prices seem to run around $10,000 for a decent one, and much higher for really good ones. Friends had them back in the day, and we drove them alot, but looking at them now...not so sure. I'm not talking every day use, or even year round, though, as I remember, they were good in the snow but the heaters were bad.
Ideas?

[Finster101]

There is no such thing as a VW Beetle that does not need a lot of work.

[Mal Paso]

The heaters are boxes around the exhaust manifolds powered by engine cooling air which then has to make it to the front without cooling too much. An iffy proposition as the vehicles age.

I grew up with John Muir and "How to keep your Volkswagen Alive", adjusted my valves every 3,000 miles and still managed to drop valves. Got really good at rebuilding..... They were fun, I think.

The real John Muir not the naturalist bum. LOL

[super6]

There is no such thing as a VW Beetle that does not need a lot of work.

I have had at least 20 buses and beetles over the years and Never paid more then 200$ for any of them.

[wv109323]

My family had a 1958,1961 microbus,1964, 1965,1969, and a 1972 or 3. The last one had much more power and with radial tires it handled very well. It was the regular front end and not the "Super Beetle".
Heater problems was rusted out heater boxes/ductwork or non working control cables. The heater was air blow over the exhaust manifold into the interior.
The down side is no cruise control or air conditioner. Parts and service availability may be expensive as time goes on.

[Jim22]

I would be surprised if one of them would meet any emissions standards. Then there is the safety question. No engine in the front to protect you in case of a colission. Instead of putting an engine up there they put the gas tank up front. Seems like every argument there was against the Corvair applies to the Beetle.

One thing, though. Parts should not be a problem. Beetles were built in Mexico until about ten years ago.

Jim

[Texas by God]

There is no such thing as a VW Beetle that does not need a lot of work.Truth. Like a Harley- something always shaking loose. My first car was a 67 beetle. Fill it up with oil and check the gas! A fun car for a crazy teenager ( guess who?)in the early 70s.

Sent from my SM-A716U using Tapatalk

[XDROB]

Floor rot, runing boards rotted. Heater vents down on floor near your feet rotting. Heater boxes (basically exhaust manifolds) rusted. I was and still not a fan of the Super Beetles. Couldn't modify the suspension easily. Original twin tube frt end are easy to work on. My last one had a 2100cc modified engine. Never dynoed it but estimated horses was around 180 to 200. Ran 14 inch wide radials and adjustable shocks to lower it. H as d sway bars frt and back. Handled like a slot car. Had a 40 Ford fiberglass front end on it. I tinted the windows by spraying tint on the glass and letting it run done the glass. Was not an easy or fun job. Tint film was not invented yet. That car was a BLAST to drive. I raced all my buddies in their Camaros, Chevelles with their big V8s on back roads. Pissed them off every time they couldn't catch me. [emoji1787][emoji1787]

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

[Electrod47]

There is no such thing as a VW Beetle that does not need a lot of work.
My thoughts exactly.
Owned 2 over the years. Strictly a novelty item in today's driving scenarios. It had its place and time. At the prices mentioned before, I think the novelty would have worn off.

[MaryB]

I would be surprised if one of them would meet any emissions standards. Then there is the safety question. No engine in the front to protect you in case of a colission. Instead of putting an engine up there they put the gas tank up front. Seems like every argument there was against the Corvair applies to the Beetle.

One thing, though. Parts should not be a problem. Beetles were built in Mexico until about ten years ago.

Jim

Probably exempt in most states... no emissions test needed.

[fastdadio]

Buy her a Mazda Miata and enjoy life a little more.

[Thumbcocker]

If you want to know what its like to be a passenger in a 1964 model that got totaled lm your guy. Short version it sucks.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[Finster101]

Truth. Like a Harley- something always shaking loose. My first car was a 67 beetle. Fill it up with oil and check the gas! A fun car for a crazy teenager ( guess who?)in the early 70s.

Sent from my SM-A716U using Tapatalk

Can't quite agree with all of that. The last bike I had to keep tightening things on was a shovelhead sportster. My 93 EVO and 08 Twincam I have had zero problems with except putting four compensators in the Roadglide till Harley finally built one right. Enough of my thread drift.

[Beagle333]

They're fun to drive, if you really like working on something a lot. John Muir's book helped me keep mine running. But you'll need at least one that runs and two more for spare parts. I don't regret owning any of mine, but I wouldn't do it now that I'm an older guy.

[hporter]

I'm not talking every day use

For a garage queen that is taken out on sunny days, as long as it's not rusted out, I can't imagine a cheaper car to maintain over the long run.

If that is on the bucket list for your wife, why not? I seems that they will only go up in value over time.

[Smoke4320]

A hundred Davidson shake something loose .. say it aint so

[Battis]

My daughter had a Miata. Didn't take long to get that out of her system, and mine.
Yeah, the VW would be a novelty item. Plus, I don't have a garage, or the desire to work on cars. I just sold my 1998 Chevy S10 because it needed alot of work.
We looked at a Super Beetle the other day. Even though it was in great shape, I think her interest might have waned a little when I pointed out the safety issues.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

If I had a hankerin for a Beetle, I'd look for a modern one that was 10 or 15 years old, with low miles.
Leave them vintage air cooled rear engine units for the mechanic/collector types.

Funny Story:
My Dad was a car guy. When I was growing up, he had all kinds of different cars/trucks, all the American cars of course, but also some foreign ones, including; Fiat, Saab, MG, Sunbeam, bug-eyed sprite, There was also some foreign (British?) jeep-type thing made for desert use (extra large fuel tank and large water tank).
ANYWAY, one of the cars my dad and I looked at for me when I needed a commuter car, was A 60s VW Beetle. We test drove it. Now, I am a big guy, and I was a big guy in 1985 when I graduated college, and my Dad was a big guy. We get into the Beetle and close the doors. My left shoulder was tight against the door window and my Right shoulder was tight against my Dad's shoulder. My dad said he was wedged in as well. We drove it and it had obvious engine problems and very little power. I told my dad, I guess the Beetle is out of the question. I always liked the 1973 Saab 99 that my Dad had, so I wound up finding a 1976 Saab 99 with low miles as a commuter car for my first real job after college.

[Smoke4320]

Saab 99 was a great car

[super6]

I had a 1968 saab station wagon at one time, The gay people Were all over it. Must have been a thing.

[Idaho45guy]

Just last month I picked up my dad's best friend from a shop where he was dropping off his `72 Beetle convertible. Beautiful old car. He was having the oil changed and all services done before listing it for sale on Craigslist.

He hadn't changed the oil in the five years he owned it. How many miles did he put on it? 100. That's it. Just a novelty car he kept at his Yuma, AZ home.

He listed it and sold it within a couple of days for $12,500. Crazy.

[Ickisrulz]

People used to drive VW Beetles all over as their only cars. Now they're dangerous and a novelty?

I wouldn't want one where I live, but they seem to be OK transportation.

[rancher1913]

the one we had growing up had light bars on the door pillar and they would flip out and up and flash for turns and the rear window was a little hole about 8 inches round.

[redneck1]

If the beetle wasn't a reliable safe car it for sure would have never made it to 22 million of them produced so take the nay Sayers with a grain of salt .

A good solid beetle doesn't cost a lot to keep running and maintained , parts availability will outlast you and and any car made today .
They do need kept up with , things like a working heater are important, not for the heat itself but because chances are if the heat doesn't work the cooling system isn't working properly either . a
Very important detail to keep up with if you want it to last .

[Wild Bill 7]

I rode in one beetle when I was in high school. My friend drove one and the first thing he did was make a u-turn and it made me dizzy. Never rode or drove one ever again. His older brother loved the buses, he was also a mechanic. He always kept a spare engine in the van with tools. If one engine ever broke down he would swap the engine and keep on going. He said it didn’t take long and it was easy for him because he did it so many times.

[ascast]

wow ! I have several, 2 -'66's, a '67, a '64, a '64 Ghia, a ,73 Thing and a 70 bus, not to mention a bunch out in the back. As redneck1 stated they are not death traps, even in head on collisions- no gas explosions ! too much TV maybe...I have driven several 100,000 miles in my '67. I worked the oil patch a few years from North Dakota to 4 corners and never had any trouble with the bug. That said- the heating systems is crap and will have to be upgraded-it is easy to do and cheap and works. Maybe install new heating, liki resistance heater elements in the air ducts. That will keep your windshield clear. The valves must be checked every 3,000 miles on a stone cold engine-the blower trick won't work. The brake system is also a dismal example of engineering;you need to adjust with valves or more often. Best to upgrade to all new disks all around. That is not cheap, but I would do it if I were really going to drive one daily. The emission thing is a nonissue. It is an antique. No one expects you to drive it daily.
Problem now is that the guys who knew those things are gone. All that is left are the hot rod types who think they know more than the Krauts who designed them and they will burn up your engine in 5,000 miles or far less. Finding a competent mechanic could be a real problem. I think you should go for it, but a good driver with solid body will start at $10k. best wishes on that

[.429&H110]

Fifty years ago my friend had a bug and teased me that I was too big to drive it. I got in it and drove it. I could not get out of it gracefully. I am two meters tall, back then over 140 kilos. YMMV.
Their ad was: "It will definitely float, but it won't float indefinitely. Steer around the big puddles".
I could definitely drive it, the bugs were very quick off the line, but shift to 3rd gear it's all done.

[Bmi48219]

I’ve owned several, they were good for the time. It would be a mistake to buy one and expect the performance, options, quiet ride, and a dozen other features we take for granted now. And as others have said they must be serviced every 3000 miles. Oil, valves, points etc. the manifold heat system worked great until the J boxes rusted, which didn’t take long if your state salts the roads in winter.
I wouldn’t want one for an everyday vehicle.
On the other hand I would like to own a solid VW Thing. Not that they were much more reliable or drivable, they just look so cool.

[Thumbcocker]

After the 64 was totaled and me and mom got out if the hospital a few years passes and we got another one. Dad had a large maker doo hickey and put labels on it. The labels read "Hitler's revenge".

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[Mal Paso]

Valve stretch was a real problem so high quality valves are a plus. The 1600cc Dual Port was the best engine, wouldn't mess with less. That 1600 DP in a beetle will flat fly. I was trying a new motor out on Lighthouse Flats doing over 90 when I passed my neighbor lady, CHP. I tiptoed around her for the next month.

[contender1]

Well, many, many years ago,, I had several VW's. I think over the years,, I owned a total of about 9-10 of them. I bought a few rough ones & fixed them easily enough.
I also had a GREAT mechanic & shop that could build them like I wanted.
I had one,, that I made into a homemade "Baja" type. It was a early 70's Super Beetle to begin with. It had the dual port 1600 engine,, with bolt on larger heads. It would flat out run. I was clocked in excess of 105 once on flat road.
It also had 2" bands added to widen the rear tire rims,, so I ran bigger tires. Plus I ran bigger tires on the front as well. A HP once told me it was the fastest bug he'd ever seen,, as he wrote my ticket. (That day was "only" 79 in a 55.)

Yes,, they have some issues when compared to more modern cars. BUT,, knowing ahead of time what to look for & how to overcome it,, or what to fix to make it better isn't hard. (Think heater boxes here. I upgraded mine & I always had heat.)

Lots of good info above,, but only you & your wife can decide if you really want one. Me? If I found another good one & the price was right,, I'd not hesitate to own another one.

[ulav8r]

F I tinted the windows by spraying tint on the glass and letting it run done the glass. Was not an easy or fun job. Tint film was not invented yet. [emoji1787][emoji1787]

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk
Bring back a great memory from a carwash. Guy a stall or two over was washing his car with the girlfriend/spouse sitting in the car. After washing the exterior, he opened one of the doors and started washing the tint off the inside. The girl got very irate. I got a good laugh from it.

[Gator 45/70]

Had a couple, Last one I pulled the engine out a 72 model I believe the 60 hp. one.
Carried it inside and sat it on the kitchen table. Overhauled it much to the then wife's pleasure.
Buddy and I built a 16x48 mud boat, Dropped it in there with no clutch in front of a Ramsey strait tooth gear box.
I built an intake for a Holley 2 barrel and installed this along with a Baja header turned around to the rear.
Thing would go thru 3ft. lily's or water so shallow the mud would be sticking out of the water.
Looked like a farmer had passed with a middle buster.
This was my duck hunting boat, Keep it for about 7 years, Sold it for what I had in it.
The wheel was a 10/12 with a cup, Thing would do 35 with just me in it

[trebor44]

Best part of the Beetle, it was easy to push start! Gotta, love that battery under the back seat!

[Smoke4320]

brings back memories.. had several .. had to laugh at the push to start comment .. Don't see many people pushing cars to start now ..

[Hickok]

"Road Roach!" :bigsmyl2:.......[smilie=s:

[Mal Paso]

Best part of the Beetle, it was easy to push start! Gotta, love that battery under the back seat!

If you ever see smoke coming from the back seat when someone sits on it, the plastic cover was left off the battery and the seat springs are shorting the battery.

[MaryB]

Friend had a bug in MN winters it sucked... I remember a trip of 35 miles at -5f with 4 of us crammed into it, our breath had every window so frosted we were using whatever was handy to scrape a hole to see thru. Only good thing was 4 bodies at least kept it sorta warm inside LOL

[bedbugbilly]

I never had one but had friends who had them - 60s models. As a teen, they were fun. Later on, my wife and I had a 1970 square back VW (station wagon). She enjoyed it but I finally sold it because it nickel and dime us everything we turned around. On a trip, the gas usage was nice but not a whole lot of room as far as I was concerned for a guy my size to ride in.

My wife always wanted a VW Beetle Convertible so we bought a new one in 2005. It was a disaster. It just stopped sever times and had to be towed to the dealer, then the AC didn't work so it had to go back, then the water pump needed tube replaced - all with less than 2,000 miles on it. When it went back to the dealer for the water pump to be replaced, their guy who did it decided to play the radio while he was working on it and somehow wiped out everything on the dashboard. We picked it up and on the way home discovered that the odometer had 00000 mies on it - so it went back and had to have a whole new dashboard put in it for some reason - yea, it was all under warranty but the hours of inconvenience were not worth it. It was always taken care of, housed, etc. but within the fires year, the convertible top started having issues - excessive wear to the fabric and she did not put the top down often as we live in Michigan - a few times in the summer ant that was it. we always took it to a dealer for service and it seemed like we always had a light that was out on it - usually one of the headlights. As the service manager explained it, they used a spring as a way of making a ground connection on the headlight and they would get weak and need to be replaced . . and of course they never had them in stock - they had to order it so it required another trip back. I was never so happy to get rid of a care in my life.

The olde ones - i.e. 1960s and 1970s - yea, they were "fun" but then I changed my mind when I started working Ambulance and Fire Rescue and we would get called for PI (personal injury) accidents where a VW Beetle was involved One of the first rescue runs I went on involved a classmate I had graduated with and his VW Bug - he was involved in a single car accident and he burned up in it in spite of our efforts to get him out - that was 50 years ago and I can still see it as if it were yesterday.

Yea . . . a lot of folks had 'em and drove 'em and they served the purpose in those days - an affordable car. I can understand the nostalgia of 'em like a lot of other cars but, personally, I don't know if I would want any VW Bug for an everyday car. My wife wanted her's in the worst way but I always worried about her - she drove it back and forth to her teaching job everyday - a 22 mile round trip. I wasn't worried about "her" driving - I worried about the "driving" of others on the road and her being in a "Bug". Fortunately, she grew tired of the mechanical issues as much as I did and after a few years we sold it and moved on to a SUV which was more comfortable, had more safety features and she liked it much much more.

[Battis]

I think nostalgia is the key word, as opposed to practicality or safety. Plus, as I said, I don't have a garage and in these Northeast winters, and summers, old vehicles don't do well unless garaged.
My friend had one in the 70s with a roof rack. Of course, one day, I just had to climb on the roof rack, and of course he had to drive away. A mile or so later we got pulled over, with me still on the roof. When the cop asked, what are you doing, we said that we were testing the roof rack to see if it would hold a canoe. The cop had to chuckle. I don't think that being a nitwit on a VW in the daytime was against the law back then.

[NY_Treeguy]

Looking for opinions and experiences with 70s VW Beetles. My wife has always wanted one so we started looking around. I'm talking about a restored one, not one that needs alot of work. Prices seem to run around $10,000 for a decent one, and much higher for really good ones. Friends had them back in the day, and we drove them alot, but looking at them now...not so sure. I'm not talking every day use, or even year round, though, as I remember, they were good in the snow but the heaters were bad.
Ideas?

Here in the Northeast I would expect to pay around 10K for a "good" not great one. In the 70's you had 2 options, the Beetle (Ball Joint Front End) or the Superbeetle (Strut Front End). Beetle is more desirable than a super. I would stay away from any car that has:

Fuel Injection, Autostick, Semi-Automatic Trans
Rusted out Jack Tubes, Rusted out Running Boards, Rusted bottom of spare tire well, Rusted heater channels, Rusted out battery tray under back seat, Rusted floors.

Rotted heat exchangers on the exhaust manifolds aren't that bad.

Any car that passes the above has either been babied and garage kept, no winter use, etc. or has already been restored. The former is rarer that the latter. A friend outside Buffalo, NY just bought one in Florida for about 10K and it needed tires and brakes but body was solid.

You will also need to find a VW shop that will work on air cooled models. These are also getting harder to find but still exist.

[starbits]

I had 3 VWs in my life. First was a 1960 camper. Dad was in the Army and we moved a lot, 9 times in 9 years during one period. With 6 of us kids motels were too expensive so we camped from place to place. By the time I was in high school I had already spend more than a year of my life sleeping in a tent. Mom was searching for toll booth change when she rolled into the semi in front of her maybe 5 mph. Dad took one look at the damage at that low speed and the VW was gone the next day. Sheet metal and the steering column wasn't any protection at 75mph.

Second was a 69 VW fastback. My brother and I would dig minerals from the mines in Gleason AZ about 16 miles east of Tombstone. The road from tombstone was a big wide dirt road that I would drive at 85-90 mph sliding around curves. Kids do believe they are invincible.

Third was a 72 bug with a baha conversion. Big tires on the front and bigger on the rear. Drove the heck out of that car. Drove a small very curvy road through the desert as fast as i could go. Missed a curve once and took out a big cholla, cactus spines were stuck in the rubber around the whole windshield. Found a hill that at 55mph or higher you would leave the ground. Bent the front axel doing that. Dropped a valve through the top of a piston, took an entire paycheck plus $20 to get it fixed. I still remember the first time it took $5 whole dollars to fill the gas tank. Gas had soared from 23 cents to 35 cents a gallon. I drove it to Aberdeen Md when I went into the Army. You would have thought I was driving Satan's vehicle the way they reacted. MPs escorted me off base and told I couldn't drive it on base. Maryland cops gave me a ticket because there was no engine cover, "the flywheel could come apart and injure someone". Yea he actually said that. I had planned to trade it in anyway for a pickup because of the axel, but not that soon.

Great memories.

[beezapilot]

Must have been a thing. Nah, the THING was the uber cool VW. (Just kidding, I know you knew that)

[Finster101]

Never had one. Had a girlfriend with one. I was very happy when they both left my life. Too many problems from both.

[Texas by God]

I'd been pushing mine to start it for a while but I had a date and needed it to work- so I spied an old 8volt tractor battery of Dad's and borrowed it for one night......it spun the hell out of that 6volt starter- but worked!

Sent from my SM-A716U using Tapatalk

[DocSavage]

I had a Beetle for a year and at one point the clutch cable broke had to start it in gear loads of fun. My uncle had several and as I recall the nuts and bolts were metric he had bought a set of metric sockets that had every size but 1 and that was 13 mm and guess what size most of the nuts and bolts were and he was too cheap to buy a socket and wrench that size.
This was the mid 70s no fancy auto parts stores just your local discount or hardware stores and their selection of metric tools were extremely limited.

[10x]

Had a 1959 Beetle, the transition year.
36 HP, air cooled It was not mechanically reliable.
Nor did it thrive on dirt roads. The engine cooling fins filled up with dust and baked on in 20,000 miles

36 MPG (imperial gallons at 60 MPH) Slow down to 45 mph and on level road with a tailwind it could make almost 50 mpg while holding up traffic.
Hills were a challenge.
I would like a mid 70s VW diesel Rabbit. If any have survived and are still drivable. Incredible mileage. handled well, and they had a good heater.

[ebb]

The sticker on the 1968 my dad bought brand new was $1863.00

[WRideout]

My ex-wife wife bought a new, orange, VW beetle in 1973 in Seattle WA. We drove that bug for at least fifteen years. Once she was in LA about an hour from home when the clutch quit working. I met her next to the freeway, put it in gear and cranked the starter, which also got the car moving. I drove it all the way home shifting by rpm's. When I had it apart, the hook that grabbed the cluch cable was worn through. My step-father welded on a new hook, and it lasted until we sold the car.

I also had an air-cooled VW camper bus that I loved. We filled it up with kids and took a road trip from SoCal to Spokane, crossed over the Cascades to Seattle, then down the coast camping along the way. When we moved to TN, it was just a little too cold to get very many BTUs out of the heater. Finally sold it in the 90's.

It had a habit of wearing out the boots on the drive axle u-joints. I got to where I could change out u-joints pretty fast, even in a parking lot on a road trip.

Wayne

[Bmi48219]

We were fortunate in that three immigrant German brothers started a VW repair shop in the mid-60s in our area. They were true mechanics that prospered providing good service at reasonable rates. They would explain repair procedures to my buddies and I and help us with used parts to do our own work. The owner, Gunther Senger, was always willing to share knowledge, and there shop was always full. He once charged an acquaintance 25 cents to correct a serious ignition system issue in a FI type 3 Fastback for replacing a wire that was shorting intermittently. He could have charged $100.00 and no one would have questioned it.

[MaryB]

My only foray into air cooled engines was a Corvair van... that thing was a heap. Belts always popped off the fan on top of the engine, it would overheat and die. Pull over, put fans on, wait for it to cool off then keep going. Drove that for 6 months then as winter started I dumped it for a Ford Courier pickup. That was a reliable little truck!

[super6]

Nah, the THING was the uber cool VW. (Just kidding, I know you knew that)

Bought my kids a thing toy when they were little, It would explode when it would hit some thing!:-o

[uscra112]

Never owned one. In the '60s many, many friends did.

Things I remember:

*We figured they would go 40k - 50k miles at most between engine pulls.

*Engine pulls were easy - jack it up, take out 4 bolts, lay a tire underneath and yank the exhaust pipes. Lotta engines were stolen this way.

*They WERE a death-trap in a front-end collision. Flimsy sheet metal crumpled like wet cardboard until that heavy front crossmember hit, then the whole car stopped in about 2 inches of travel and everyone inside hit the dashboard at speed, (no seat belts!). Friend hit a guardrail with his microbus. Had the presence of mind to pick his feet op as he hit, or he would have lost both legs below the knee.

*They would GO in snow, but they wouldn't STEER unless you filled the trunk full of sandbags.

*The distributor had one cam lobe retarded, because that one cylinder ran hot due to location of the oil cooler.

*A least one that I knew of filled the cabin with exhaust fumes due to a rusted heater box.

*They had the same dangerously bad-handling swing-axle rear end that Nader condemned the Corvair for having.

*The reason they sold so many was that they were CHEAP compared to American iron. No other reason.

I you gave me a fully restored one today I'd sell it immediately and buy a SAAB 93B. The 3-cylinder SAABs had their own set of problems, but they were a much better snow car and they didn't kill you in a front-end collision. Trouble is, there aren't any left. They rusted even worse than the Volksies did. *sigh*

[Mal Paso]

I had a split window, split seat '64 transporter for years. There was a bed with a real mattress and a built in ice box with a cabinet for dishes and canned goods. It was set to go camping at a moments notice. Usually the desert or Baja. And ya, I would get about 40-50,000 miles out of a build but the people I sold it to never had a problem so I'm sure it was my lead foot.

I was living near the San Diego Wild Animal Park at the time. I was coming down the mountain from Ramona and passed a '68 transporter pulled over in a poor spot. I circled back and asked if there was a problem. The van owner said he and his buddy were trying to decide, would I like a glass of wine? We introduced ourselves, had a glass and talked. After while I asked about the buss, he said the engine works but no power to the wheels. It was an IRS van and all the cap head screws holding the CV Joint to the passenger rear wheel had backed out but the boot had kept them from falling out. I had that fixed in a few minutes and we had another glass of wine. They were headed to Baja, Mexico would I join them expenses paid? Any excuse to go camping, right? About 5 days in he dropped #3 valve. I towed him to the beach near El Rosario, pulled the engine and put it in my buss. I had my VW sources down back then so I brought the engine back to San Diego, rebuilt the engine down to the crank and had it back in El Rosario in 3 days. We put the engine in, seated the rings and had a feast. I brought steaks from San Diego and they got some Lobsters from the locals. We each had a 12" frying pan so we made a steam chamber to cook the lobster. I had a good time and came home with a couple more bucks than I started with.

[redneck1]

In 1965 America ...
Most cars were considered worn out at 60,000 miles .
Crash safety was next to non existent , build quality was terrible .
And Ralph Nader was a piece of excrement :)

In 1965 people who maintained their cars understood that things like rings and valve jobs was an expected expense if they wanted to keep them running tip top .

Love em or hate em one thing they are not is a corvair..

[uscra112]

Um, my mother's 55 Ford two-door was still running fine when I began driving it at something like 120,000 miles. I drove it until I bought the first car of my own in 1967, a three-banger SAAB. As I mentioned earlier, it was a great winter car, but it had its' own set of quirks.

Dad bought one of the very first Corvairs in 1960. Only new car he ever owned. At around 100,000 it was leaking oil heavily, so he, (being an engineer) tore it down himself. Oil leak was pushrod tube seals. I remember him measuring everything measurable, and gloating that nothing at all was out of spec. I'm sure he put new rings in on general principles, but nothing else except seals and gaskets. THAT car came to me about 1972 or '73 when Dad ought a pickup, and it became my wife's car until one of my erstwhile "friends" broke the transmission input shaft running errands for her. The one annoying habit it had was breaking clutch cables. While Dad still owned it I became adept at starting it in first gear and thereafter shifting it without the clutch, to the amazement of my school chums.

Now that I think about it. I remember as a small child watching him do a ring job on a 1936 Buick that had been my maternal grandmother's car. That would have been about 1950, and I'm pretty sure it was high mileage. Mother claimed that it had been driven from New York to Lost Angeles (pre Interstate) several times before it was given to us. Gramma was a gypsy if ever there was one.

No, American iron wasn't all THAT bad until the late 1970s, when the product cheapening executives started cutting corners. In 1993 I took a job with a first tier supplier to GM Powertrain, and I got an earful from the mfg. engineers at Romulus, working on the block and head lines for the first of the Gen III V-8s. To their credit, GM listened to us, and we showed them the Daimler-Benz way of building a good engine. But the biggest factor they solved themselves - they fired the Logistics VP who had been buying the cheapest grade of pig iron for casting the blocks. Rebore interval went from under 100k to 250k miles almost overnight. I was there.

[rbuck351]

Yep, in the 60s/70s US cars had fairly soft blocks and heads. Most would go 100,000 or so if maintained. When no lead gas came out the valve seats had to be hardened as the lack of lead to cushion the valve/valve seat would beat the up in short order. I worked in an auto machine shop at the time and replacing valve seats with harder material was very common.
Better block material and fuel injection I think are the two things that are why cars are now going 250/300 thousand miles. Carbs, because of the accelerator pump and lack of a constant proper fuel mix through the entire operating range, tend to run rich most of the time. This causes gas washing of the cyl walls. That, combined with soft blocks, meant short engine life.

Rich fuel mixture also causes more unburned gas to get past the rings reducing the lube abilities of your oil.

IIRC Corvairs had 187 different places they could leak oil 24 of which were push rod tube ends.

If you run an air cooled VW very hard it will drop the #3 exhaust valve at about 50,000miles and maybe sooner. I have only owned one, a 36hp. It wouldn't get out of it's own way.

[waksupi]

I seem to recall one of the cylinders tend to over heat, and possibly ruin the engine.

Recalling my high school days, I can say that thirteen teenagers can fit inside of a VW.

[pete501]

My father had a 1957 split-window. I remember when he pulled over to take a picture of the odometer rolling over to 100,000 miles. My sister rolled our '64 bug on the freeway, Both her and her passenger were thrown in the back seat, saving their legs and possibly their lives. Dad sold his '57 right after seeing what was left of the wreck.

We did have a 36hp powered dune buggy in the early '70s. With no syncro for first gear, we would have to take the dunes starting in first gear. We could make tracks on any hill, but only if we made them coming down from the back side. Only dune buggy worse was powered by a Renault air-cooled. Corvair powered buggies ruled at the time.

Lots of good memories.

[MaryB]

Yep, in the 60s/70s US cars had fairly soft blocks and heads. Most would go 100,000 or so if maintained. When no lead gas came out the valve seats had to be hardened as the lack of lead to cushion the valve/valve seat would beat the up in short order. I worked in an auto machine shop at the time and replacing valve seats with harder material was very common.
Better block material and fuel injection I think are the two things that are why cars are now going 250/300 thousand miles. Carbs, because of the accelerator pump and lack of a constant proper fuel mix through the entire operating range, tend to run rich most of the time. This causes gas washing of the cyl walls. That, combined with soft blocks, meant short engine life.

Rich fuel mixture also causes more unburned gas to get past the rings reducing the lube abilities of your oil.

IIRC Corvairs had 187 different places they could leak oil 24 of which were push rod tube ends.

If you run an air cooled VW very hard it will drop the #3 exhaust valve at about 50,000miles and maybe sooner. I have only owned one, a 36hp. It wouldn't get out of it's own way.

Modern engines are built to a lot tighter tolerance too. I remember rebuilding a friends 1967 Ford 390 and the specs were pretty dang loose... we went thru that engine and tightened up the specs on everything and it used less oil than a normal 390, ran better, ran cooler, and lasted 120k miles before he burned a piston drag racing it. We didn't build it for drag racing and it was NOT setup for the heavy shot of nitrous he gave it! We had stuffed it in a 1964 Falcon so it was fast!

[Battis]

Reading the responses here makes me realize two things:
1. I don't want a VW Beetle
2. I know just about nothing about cars and motors. Although, I did swap out an engine once all by myself. I took the engine out of my lawnmower (push, not ride on) and dropped in a new one from Harbor Freight. I thought I was "Da Man."
Amazing info out there.

[Beerd]

Like almost everything else, there is lots of good & not so correct info out there on the net.
Check out the Vintage VW Club of America for the good stuff: https://vvwca.com/
..

[GOPHER SLAYER]

So many comments about Corvairs, I have to tell our story. In late 1959 my wife and I bought Corvair two door coup. It was red and beautiful. It was underpowered but did get 27 miles to the gallon. The fan belt did come off once, but I put star washer under the bolt that holds the belt, and it never came off again. The car never leaked oil. It did over steer. In 1962 we were going to Tuscon to visit my wife's sister. We were east of San Diego on the old highway 8. The area is hilly with canyons and lots of huge boulders. I was in the process of passing a VW when my wife said, "you're getting too close". I immediately made two mistakes. I turned the wheel too fast and too much and hit the brakes. I lost control, hit the small curb on the side of the highway and went sailing into space. I was going about 60. MY thoughts were, this it. We sailed over many boulders, a three- strand barbed wire fence and landed on top of a huge Man Senita bush, rolled over onto the only bare ground there and slid up to a large flat- topped boulder. I was unhurt. I pushed the car door up, climbed out a ran around to check on my wife. Her side of the car was pushed up and her seat had broken. I said," Honey, you have to get out". She said she couldn't move. I told her the car was on fire and she was covered with gas. It was not true, but it worked With, that she shot out of the car also unhurt. The wife of the man driving the VW was standing on the hill and asked if we were alright. I told her we seemed to be OK. With that she ran back to their VW and they split. The bugger had run me off the road. The car was a total but we were only sore for a few days. Our Guardian Angel was on the job that day. Several years later a friend loaned me a book titled, The Rise And Fall of The American Automotive Industry. One of the stories was about the Corvair. It explained that the Corvair as designed was a great car. It had wide tires, anti-sway bars to prevent the rear end swing. It also kept the rear tires from tucking under. Then the design was turned over to the Bean Counters. They decided, the car doesn't need wide tires, anti- sway bars. With that, the car was doomed. After Ralfh Nader's book came out, Chevrolet redesigned the Corvair and put back the wide tires, anti- sway bars. The car lasted until 1967 and became a real speedster but with low sales it was dropped from production. We made two trips across country with our Corvair with no trouble. There was a class action lawsuit against GM over the many accidents and deaths involving the Corvair, I should he joined in. All I would have to do is show the before and after pictures.

[uscra112]

Modern engines are built to a lot tighter tolerance too. I remember rebuilding a friends 1967 Ford 390 and the specs were pretty dang loose... we went thru that engine and tightened up the specs on everything and it used less oil than a normal 390, ran better, ran cooler, and lasted 120k miles before he burned a piston drag racing it. We didn't build it for drag racing and it was NOT setup for the heavy shot of nitrous he gave it! We had stuffed it in a 1964 Falcon so it was fast!

This is absolutely true. My part in the Gen III program was implementing German (Zeiss) coordinate measuring machines in place of the old mechanical gsges that had been used for machining process control since WW1. We almost instantly identified dozens of areas where the machine tool guys needed to do better. Needless to say they hated us, but GM held their feet to the fire and things got improved. Example: For generations, crank bearing inserts were chosen at assembly by the "selective fit" method, which was imprecise and error-prone but had to be done to get any engines out the door at all. Our systems could gage the crank bores in the block so well that GM was able to push the machine tool builders to improve, and eventually they got good enough that GM could dispense with the selective fitting on the assembly line. This while the EPA was pushing them to use 5W oil to reduce oil drag, which demanded tighter assembly tolerances than ever. Just one of dozens of stories I can tell. At this point GM and Ford make better blocks and heads than the Japanese even CAN, because the Japanese companies (except Honda) won't buy Zeiss gages. (Long story.)

[HATCH]

I am just gonna leave this link -> https://www.zelectricmotors.com/

if you have the money and your wife wants one - this is the way to go.

[Idaho45guy]

I had a split window, split seat '64 transporter for years. There was a bed with a real mattress and a built in ice box with a cabinet for dishes and canned goods. It was set to go camping at a moments notice. Usually the desert or Baja. And ya, I would get about 40-50,000 miles out of a build but the people I sold it to never had a problem so I'm sure it was my lead foot.

I was living near the San Diego Wild Animal Park at the time. I was coming down the mountain from Ramona and passed a '68 transporter pulled over in a poor spot. I circled back and asked if there was a problem. The van owner said he and his buddy were trying to decide, would I like a glass of wine? We introduced ourselves, had a glass and talked. After while I asked about the buss, he said the engine works but no power to the wheels. It was an IRS van and all the cap head screws holding the CV Joint to the passenger rear wheel had backed out but the boot had kept them from falling out. I had that fixed in a few minutes and we had another glass of wine. They were headed to Baja, Mexico would I join them expenses paid? Any excuse to go camping, right? About 5 days in he dropped #3 valve. I towed him to the beach near El Rosario, pulled the engine and put it in my buss. I had my VW sources down back then so I brought the engine back to San Diego, rebuilt the engine down to the crank and had it back in El Rosario in 3 days. We put the engine in, seated the rings and had a feast. I brought steaks from San Diego and they got some Lobsters from the locals. We each had a 12" frying pan so we made a steam chamber to cook the lobster. I had a good time and came home with a couple more bucks than I started with.

That's a great story! Epic memories!

[Idaho45guy]

So many comments about Corvairs, I have to tell our story. In late 1959 my wife and I bought Corvair two door coup. It was red and beautiful. It was underpowered but did get 27 miles to the gallon. The fan belt did come off once, but I put star washer under the bolt that holds the belt, and it never came off again. The car never leaked oil. It did over steer. In 1962 we were going to Tuscon to visit my wife's sister. We were east of San Diego on the old highway 8. The area is hilly with canyons and lots of huge boulders. I was in the process of passing a VW when my wife said, "you're getting too close". I immediately made two mistakes. I turned the wheel too fast and too much and hit the brakes. I lost control, hit the small curb on the side of the highway and went sailing into space. I was going about 60. MY thoughts were, this it. We sailed over many boulders, a three- strand barbed wire fence and landed on top of a huge Man Senita bush, rolled over onto the only bare ground there and slid up to a large flat- topped boulder. I was unhurt. I pushed the car door up, climbed out a ran around to check on my wife. Her side of the car was pushed up and her seat had broken. I said," Honey, you have to get out". She said she couldn't move. I told her the car was on fire and she was covered with gas. It was not true, but it worked With, that she shot out of the car also unhurt. The wife of the man driving the VW was standing on the hill and asked if we were alright. I told her we seemed to be OK. With that she ran back to their VW and they split. The bugger had run me off the road. The car was a total but we were only sore for a few days. Our Guardian Angel was on the job that day. Several years later a friend loaned me a book titled, The Rise And Fall of The American Automotive Industry. One of the stories was about the Corvair. It explained that the Corvair as designed was a great car. It had wide tires, anti-sway bars to prevent the rear end swing. It also kept the rear tires from tucking under. Then the design was turned over to the Bean Counters. They decided, the car doesn't need wide tires, anti- sway bars. With that, the car was doomed. After Ralfh Nader's book came out, Chevrolet redesigned the Corvair and put back the wide tires, anti- sway bars. The car lasted until 1967 and became a real speedster but with low sales it was dropped from production. We made two trips across country with our Corvair with no trouble. There was a class action lawsuit against GM over the many accidents and deaths involving the Corvair, I should he joined in. All I would have to do is show the before and after pictures.

This is one of the few Corvairs I would own...

298240

[ascast]

I understand Corvair rear axle might fall off if the rear end came up; like in a big pot hole or similar. VW's would not do that. Rear axle very securely attached to the rest of it. Very good car to roll down a 150' embankment while napping, or so says my friend Mark who feel asleep driving. He walked away with a bruise on his left head. No big deal. I am not sure I would go electric.

[Battis]

I like that electric VW, though I'm not an electric car fan. I didn't see a price.
Electric cars were actually made in my town in the early 1900s.
https://conceptcarz.com/vehicle/z8862/bailey-electric.aspx

[uscra112]

I like that electric VW, though I'm not an electric car fan. I didn't see a price.
Electric cars were actually made in my town in the early 1900s.
https://conceptcarz.com/vehicle/z8862/bailey-electric.aspx

Where is the battery in the electrified Bug? In front where the gas tank used to be?

[redneck1]

I understand Corvair rear axle might fall off if the rear end came up; like in a big pot hole or similar. VW's would not do that. Rear axle very securely attached to the rest of it. Very good car to roll down a 150' embankment while napping, or so says my friend Mark who feel asleep driving. He walked away with a bruise on his left head. No big deal. I am not sure I would go electric.

Gasp ... How dare you doubt Ralph Nader . Don't you know beetles are rear engine and air cooled so they are exactly the same as a corvair.
I mean heck ole pile o fecal Nader has such a stellar reputation that we can not doubt his word . Or for that matter anyone who invokes his holy name on any subject no matter how far off base it is .

For shame , for shame

[rbuck351]

Nader was a lawyer. That should say enough.

[GOPHER SLAYER]

I understand Corvair rear axle might fall off if the rear end came up; like in a big pot hole or similar. VW's would not do that. Rear axle very securely attached to the rest of it. Very good car to roll down a 150' embankment while napping, or so says my friend Mark who feel asleep driving. He walked away with a bruise on his left head. No big deal. I am not sure I would go electric. ascast, I guess we can assume that Mark's right head is OK. Just kidding.

[shooterg]

Had a lotta fun in a '66 Bug . Bought it for $30 with a broke motor, found a nickel in it, sooo $29.95 . Had friends heavy into Baja bugs and the dune biggies with shortened VW chassis , gave me a crank , got it line bored, threw it together and drove it for close to 45,000 , it was smoking, rebuilt again and drove about the same distnce before the crank broke - quite loud but drove it home . Somewhere in there, changed over to 12 volts, the 6 volt bulbs were quite bright for a while ! Tried to teach the girlfriend(now wife of 37 years) how to drive
a straight in it without much success . Good in snow until deep enough you started pushing it . Still have a crick in the neck from leaning head to see through the very small defrosted area on windshield . As above, engine swap was fast ! It was still in our woods here behind a neighbor's house - the fool let a brush fire get out of hand and torched it. I had thoughts of reviving it again for the grandboy to chase cows with . Oh well !