unburned 2400 in 44 mag

[45shootr]

I'm using 14 gr 2400 behind Lees' 215 gr sw in 44 mag cases. My barrel (44 super redhawk), seems to have unburned powder left. Is this a sign of what? I pan lubed the boolits with beeswax/crisco 50/50. This is more or less a plinking load. Thanx. Chris

[catkiller45]

Does it look like pieces of sawdust? I don't think it is unburned powder..I could be wrong..I used to see the same thing in my revolver...

[Gunslinger]

Are you sure it's unburned powder?

I ask because I once in a while use a powerfull load for my .357 using 2400. When I eject the casings, they have some in them, which I thought was unburned powder. I asked around and was told that it wasn't unburned powder but only powder residue - so to speak!

[AZ-Stew]

It's a sign you're using 2400. Very normal. Won't hurt anything.

If your load is accurate, there's absolutely nothing to worry about. Some folks don't like the idea that some of this unburned powder can get under the extractor star and cause difficulty closing the action. I've had this happen maybe twice in over 30 years. If you tip the barrel of the revolver up to vertical during empty case extraction, you shouldn't have that problem.

Regards,

Stew

[BruceB]

The most-likely cause of the unburned powder is simply that the load's pressure is too low to get the charge burning correctly.

Move the charge up to about 18 grains with that 215 bullet and you will see a vast reduction in the amount of powder left behind.

In fact, at your present charge level, I suspect that your velocities will be both low and erratic. What's your objective in using such a low charge? If it's a low-speed/low-energy load, there are literally dozens of other powders that will work better and at HALF the cost (six or seven grains of a quicker-burner versus 14 grains of 2400).

2400 is a wonderful .44 MAGNUM powder, and I use it exclusively myself for magnum-level loads in .357, .41 and .44 Magnums. When it comes to reduced loads, though, I like Unique or Herco, and others with similar burning rates.

[mike in co]

with my limited 44 mag loading/shooting, i would suspect underload/poor burn. look for a powder that can fill atleast 80% of the case(wiht boolit seated) and hit your velocity.

try 4227....

mike in co

( why shoot a 44 mag at 1000fps with a 215 ??.....try a 44 spcl)

[Hipshot]

It can be caused by inadequate bullet tention which is caused by an expander ball that is too large and/or not enough crimp. I had the same problem with a .45 LC Ruger when I was using LEE dies----when I bought a set of RCBS I no longer had that problem.

Hipshot

[fecmech]

I'm with BruceB on this one. You are 4 grains below the "start" load recommendation in the Lyman manual. They list 19 grs for about 950 fps as a start load, I'd guess your lucky if your getting 750 fps and probably not too uniform either. Save the 2400 for genuine 44 mag loads. For 900 fps try 7 grs of 231,or green dot. Nice, uniform, accurate.

[BruceB]

Having today off, I was puttering in the "shop" (shed") when I said, "Why not?" So, I loaded 10 rounds of .44 Mag/14.0 2400, corked with a 217-grain cast boolit. I'll try to fire these over the chrono tomorrow, time permitting. I have to go to work at 1630, so it'd mean an early start, what with leaving time for a nap, etc.

I'll fire five through each of a Super Blackhawk 7.5" and an S&W 4" 629. I expect the point of impact to be radically different from my regular loads, so it'll be just an experiment to see what velocity it gives, and how consistently.

"Watch this space...."

[HeavyMetal]

You are experincing the reason I do not shoot 2400!

Model 29 83/8 inch barrel, I tried all the above "solutions" more crimp, removed the expander button and just flared the top of the case, sized 429 430 431 &432.

End result? Fire six rounds and then turn the gun muzzle down over white paper and see 13 grains of unburned powder shake out of the gun!

Know how I cured the issue? bought 3 Lbs WW296 and 3 Lbs IMR4227!

[carpetman]

I don't like 2400 I have always experienced that problem with it. I much prefer unique or 4227.

[Down South]

I use 2400 in my 357 mag but I’m very close to max load with it. I have little powder residue and I mean little. You need to increase your powder charge. I use H-110 in my 44 mag.

[35remington]

4227 ain't exactly clean burning in the 44 magnum either.

Who cares anyway? I'd rather it shot good.

[45shootr]

I've settled on using 6.5 gr of Unique. I'm getting right around 900 fps. and good accuracy. 7 grains bring up the velocity to around 965 fps. and 8 1025 fps. I think the later two may be a little hot for cast bullets. I failed to chrony the 2400 loads.

[dale2242]

45shootr, now you have the right idea. Use faster powder for light to medium loads. I shoot10.5 gr Unique with 429421-245gr- for plinking. It chronys at 1000fps. I like 2400 for heavier loads. With 2400, it seems to like heavier charges, heavy crimp.and magnum primers. You will get less unburned powder with this combo.---dale

[mike in co]

I've settled on using 6.5 gr of Unique. I'm getting right around 900 fps. and good accuracy. 7 grains bring up the velocity to around 965 fps. and 8 1025 fps. I think the later two may be a little hot for cast bullets. I failed to chrony the 2400 loads.

maybe the limit of your boolit(alloy/hardness) but i have shot 255's at 1340/1350 from my super red hawk( water quenched ww).

mike in co

[45shootr]

I haven't checked the hardness yet. I wouldn't mind crankng' it up a bit. My guess would be the alloy I'm using is around 15-18 bhn. I don't know how much velocity that slug would take.

[fecmech]

15-18 bhn will handle anything you care to load behind it in a .44 mag out of a handgun. I run straight WW which is in the 12-14 range at 1300fps with no problems and good accuracy.

[45shootr]

Well, from that info I'm going to ramp up a tad.

[JW6108]

You are experincing the reason I do not shoot 2400!

Model 29 83/8 inch barrel, I tried all the above "solutions" more crimp, removed the expander button and just flared the top of the case, sized 429 430 431 &432.

End result? Fire six rounds and then turn the gun muzzle down over white paper and see 13 grains of unburned powder shake out of the gun!

Know how I cured the issue? bought 3 Lbs WW296 and 3 Lbs IMR4227!

I had the same problem with 2400 in a Super Blackhawk .44. I went to H110 and did not have nearly as much with it. It is virtually the same as WW296, which also has been clean burning for me.

[mroliver77]

Hmmm, I run lots of 2400 and see very little residue. I do use it for higher pressure rounds. Since switching to FWFL exclusively I have clean shiney barrel after firing most rounds.
Jay

[Mack Heath]

I'm using 14 gr 2400 behind Lees' 215 gr sw in 44 mag cases. My barrel (44 super redhawk), seems to have unburned powder left. Is this a sign of what? I pan lubed the boolits with beeswax/crisco 50/50. This is more or less a plinking load. Thanx. Chris


I won't comment on the low charge weight you are using. That has already been covered. However, even with full power loads, you will get as much as 30% of the charge weight left unburned when you work with 2400.

Years ago Handloader magazine had a great article written by a research chemist that worked for one of the big ammo manufacturers. He looked at improving the cumbustion of 2400 and which parameters were most effective. It was a very complicated, time consuming and very thorough experiemntal protocol. What he reported was that he found anywhere from 18% to over 30% of the charge weight was blown out the muzzle with 2400, regardless of the primer or bullet weight.

The article was entitled "Component Compatibility for Peak Efficiency", the author's name was Richard Underwood, and the issue of Handloader was Sept-Oct 1971, Number 33, page 35.

His definition of efficiency was the amount of combustion of the powder charge. The impetus for the article was that the company he worked for developed a match load for .22 Long Rifle ammo by finding a combination of components that achieved 100% efficiency. He questioned whether the same approach would benefit handgun ammo and looked at 2400 in the .44 Mag.

[45shootr]

Thanks for the interesting post. I'll stick to using 2400 in my rifle rounds.