Need some help

[Boerrancher]

I have a replica Sharps Cavalry Carbine. When I was shooting 300 gr half Jackets powered by 65gr of IMR3031, it shot fast enough and flat enough that I didn't have any problems. The problem that I am having now that I have started shooting the Holy Black, is that being a true reproduction of the original, the way the sights are made it shoots 12 inches high at 100 yds just like the originals with the Velocities of BP loads. My 77 gr load under a 340 gr boolit shoots about 8 in high at 100 yds, but does not shoot as well as the 405gr HB boolit with 70 grs pushing it.

Does anyone have any suggestions on an easy way to replace that front sight with a taller one? I am not sure how it is attached to the barrel. I know it is not part of the barrel as the barrel is round. I was thinking if I could find a front sight with a small dove tail I would grind the blade off of the sight that is on there now and cut a dove tail to fit the replacement sight into the sight block. My other option is to wrap up the barrel and sight block with damp rags and use a MIG welder to build up the front sight blade a bit making it taller. It would retain it's original look and may be the fastest way of doing it. Then once I settle on a load that shoots good I can file it down to where it is shooting a couple inches high at 100 yds.

I would like to here some feedback on these two options I have listed or give me some other option I haven't thought of yet. I was busting clay pigeons yesterday at 100 yds with both loads, I just had to Hold low. I could get use to doing this with this rifle, but it sure makes it a PITA to hunt with. Either load shot good enough to kill a critter with just as long as you remember to hold low.

Best wishes from the Boer Ranch,

Joe

P.S. 20 rounds and the fouling was not bad at all. No blow tube, no wiping between shots, and the 20th shot was still shooting well enough to bust a clay bird at 100 yds.

[Don McDowell]

Those front sights are likely sweated on, so if you weld it, you might get a quick lesson in silver solderin.:???:
JB weld will work sometimes to build a sight up. Accraglass might work well also.

Also you could if you're talented enough grind the sight blade off of that block, put in a dovetail there and then build your own blades.

[northmn]

I would have to see the set up, but I have dovetailed soldered very small sight extensions on a couple of C&B revolvers using 50/50 lead and needle files. They held. The old carbine loads were actually 55 grains of BP behind a 405 lead bullet to keep recoil down. The old aim for the belt buckle sights on original military guns is a PITA.

Northmn

[Boerrancher]

Thanks for the suggestions so far guys and please keep them coming. I am open to any ideas that you may come up with.

I tried a test load of 55grs 2FG behind the 405 HB, and I think it may be down enough to shoot only a few inches high at 100 yds. I was shooting at about 50 yds and it was just a hair high. I am hoping that this holds true out at 100 yds. I need to load up a box of 20 and head to the range to see how they will do.

Best wishes from the Boer Ranch,

Joe

[montana_charlie]

Here is an idea for modifying the sight arrangement you have now...in a way that allows easy changes in the future, and doesn't alter the 'look' of the current sight (much).

- Grind off the sight blade, leaving a cube-shaped 'block' on the barrel.
- Cut a fore-and-aft slot in the block...probably of a width equal to the existing blade...but can be some 'standard width' that agrees with the dimensions of commonly found steel.
- Tap the 'block' for a setscrew on one side.
- Slip a small, snug-fitting 'blade' of steel into the slot and lock it with the setscrew. Wouldn't hurt if the blade has a shallow 'dimple' where the setscrew hits it.

Shape the exposed portion of the blade to your specifications.

Sights with all kinds of shapes and profiles could be made...as long as each has the little 'tang' on the bottom to fit the slot.

CM

[missionary5155]

Good afternoon
For hunting .. I would slightly groove the front sight top in line with the barrel. Find a brass rod the diameter that best fits the sight patern you are looking for and Glass it to the top of the front sight. You can test fit the rod with super glue until every thing is perfect.
God Bless you. Mike

[cajun shooter]

I would try using a solid brass rod of the right diameter as Miss 5155 said but use JB Weld to attach it. I used this method on a Marlin for CAS shooting and it works quite well. Also alot easier to see. Joe are you using the 2F Graf's powder? I find it does work well but not as good as the Goex Cartridge.

[Boerrancher]

are you using the 2F Graf's powder? I find it does work well but not as good as the Goex Cartridge.

I know it doesn't seem to be as potent as the Goex 3F. That Goex 3F load I was shooting just stomps the living snot out of me. I would not have believed that 11 grains less powder on the 405 gr boolit would be that much more mild. 66 gr of the Graf's is a pleasure to shoot. 77 grains of Goex on the 340 gr is a killer and is not really fun to shoot except for the smoke and noise. That 77 gr load sounds like a large cannon going off here in the Valley, and at the Range.

I think I am going to pick up some JB weld and start there adding on to the existing sight, as that is the easiest. If that doesn't work then I will do something different until I get really PO'ed and order a Lyman globe sight of the proper height and silver solder it on. Then the rear sight will have to go, and a Lyman installed there, and then a Vernier site put on the tang. I will do all of this and then find that I can't make that barrel shoot so I will take it all off and order a barrel for it, 38 in long chambered in a 45-110 or 120 and be done with it.

Best wishes from the Boer Ranch,

Joe

[Bent Ramrod]

Boerrancher,

I had the same problem with my Garrett Arms Sharps Carbine. It's a very good reproduction, but I wasn't so sure that sight base wasn't sweated or brazed on rather than forged integral with the barrel like the originals. So I put up with the stingy little brass "blade" and the foot high hits at 200 yards until I couldn't stand it any more, and this is what I did. Your mileage may vary, of course.

I clamped the muzzle of the rifle in my lead jaw vise and took a short piece of brass rod, set it against the front of the brass blade and started very carefully tapping the other end of the rod with a small hammer. I was at pains to only hit the blade, not the lug. A few surprisingly light taps and the blade rose up and backwards out of its slot in the sight lug. I was able to work it mostly out this way and then grab it with pliers and pull it the rest of the way out. Apparently, it was only a press fit in the lug.

I then took one of those Marble's sight blades, a short one with the bead on top, and ran the bottom part over a file until it was (I figured) low enough and then on the sides until it was a tight fit in the slot. I was able to tap it in without bending the bead; if a little looser it could be Loc-Tited in. Now the thing shoots more or less to point of aim at 100 yards with the Lawrence battle sight. The sight picture looks much better and more definite, too. And it's not really intrusively noticeable when you look at the rifle.

The success of this trick hinges on how well that lug is attached to the barrel and how tight the blade is in its slot. If both are soldered, you might knock the whole thing off the barrel. But you may wind up doing that anyway to replace the sight, so this operation might be worth a try.

Just in passing, are you really using 65 grains of 3031 behind a 300 gr bullet? Elmer Keith's load for an 86 Winchester in .45-70 was, if I remember, only 53 gr of 3031 behind the 300-gr, and that was a pretty hefty load. Ken Waters tried 57 gr, but that was in a Siamese Mauser. What kind of velocities are you getting?

[cajun shooter]

The 2F will always be less than 3F in speed and recoil. That's why most people who shoot CAS use 2F in their revolvers and rifles. A 45 Colt round loaded with a full case of 3F will come close to that 1000 fps range. The same case with 2F will shoot in the 800fps range and be more pleasant to shoot. The recoil from a full case of 3f will put your body in the 44Mag class. Joe, I've never shot a 45-120 but have a friend who owns one. If your wanting to go to the VA shoot this bad boy off a bench! I'm so happy that common sense improves with age and you don't accept all DARES.

[Jon K]

Joe,

Are you sure you want a 45-110/45-120 on that little light Carbine? If don't enjoy it now with the 340/77 grains.........that's nothing next to what it'll feel like in a 45-110/120.
Maybe you need to find one to shoot before you make that decision to order.

Jon

[Boerrancher]

Joe,

Are you sure you want a 45-110/45-120 on that little light Carbine? If don't enjoy it now with the 340/77 grains.........that's nothing next to what it'll feel like in a 45-110/120.
Maybe you need to find one to shoot before you make that decision to order.

Jon

Jon,

If I eventually do build a 45/110 or 120, The only thing I will use will be the wood and the action. I will put a 36 in barrel on it to add some weight to it.

Bent Ramrod,

Yes I am shooting 65 gr of IMR3031 out of that sharps with a 300 gr half jacket. I have no idea what kind of velocity I am getting, I just know that it doesn't show as much pressure as that 77 grs of 3F with the 340 cast. I will tell you all what else I have done with that little sharps when I was younger and hadn't been through 5 shoulder surgeries yet. I shot a case full of 2400 on the 300 gr half jacket as well. I don't know what the wt of the charge was, as I would fill it full with the powder funnel and rake it off level with the mouth, and stomp the bullet on it. A friend of mine shot this in his Siamese Mauser, and I had just got that sharps and wanted to see how well made it was. 50 rounds later over the course of a month and a constant sore shoulder I got them shot up, with no changes to the gun.(Before and after measurements were made of the action with each shooting session)

I am sure that you can blow up a sharps design rifle, but I am not sure you can do it unless you obstruct the barrel. There is just too much steel to be compressed and stretched. As long as the brass holds up and doesn't turn a bunch of gas loose all at once, and as long as it is made of modern steel and heat treated properly it should be fine. I can assure you though that those days of loads like that are over. I don't shoot the 300 win mag anymore because of my shoulder and it was pipsqueek compared to some of the loads fired out of that sharps.

Best wishes from the Boer Ranch,

Joe

[Boz330]

Wow, my Lyman 46 shows 60gr as max and a compressed load at that. Velocity is 2100fps out of a 28" barrel. I shot 51gr. behind a 405gr Remington twice, in a Ruger #3 and unloaded the rest. My thinking was that if a 1200fps bullet would kill a deer in the 1800s it probably still would and I was right.
Joe, is there a gunsmith around there that could just dovetail your barrel and then you have the option to put what ever style sight you want on it. That shouldn't be that expensive to do. Heck if you were with in driving distance I'd do it for nothing, just to pick your brain about Boers. Gas here would be considerably more than what a smith would charge though.

Bob

[Boerrancher]

Bob,

I went the JB weld rout this morning. The blade is part of the block, and the Block is either silver soldered or pressed on the barrel. I am leaning more toward silver soldered. If I get frustrated enough, I will bring the Drimel tool into play and cut a dove tale or grind off the current blade and cut a slot in the block to make my own interchangeable blades. There are a couple of gun smiths in the area, but neither are good enough to hand them a $ 1,200+ rifle. They do alright with cleaning and mounting scopes. One is a good friend of mine and he use to call me in to do any metal work or fabrication.

I wish you were in driving distance not so I could have you work on my gun, but so I could have someone to shoot with. There is no one around here that is interested in the types of shooting I do. There are a few gun clubs, but they all went to shotgun and rim fire. I can't even find anyone interested in doing 100 yd high power target shooting, much less find anyone that wants to shoot cast boolits and Black Powder. Several of my friends are members of these clubs, and give me the strangest looks when I talk about cast boolits or black powder or worse yet combining the two with brass cartridges. They look at me like I am practicing black magic or something.

Best wishes from the Boer Ranch,

Joe

[Boz330]

Yeh I know what you mean. I can shoot out to 300yds here at the farm but it is a lot more fun doing it with like minded folks. I have to go Cincinnati OH or Friendship IN to shoot silly wets. It is a little bit of a drive but the company is good and the conversation understandable. Kinda funny how your interests change, I went from spray and pray close shooting to long and slow shooting. Quantity to quality. I still enjoy the other just don't do it to often.

Bob

[montana_charlie]

They look at me like I am practicing black magic or something.
Then, be sure you never mention harvest moons, thongs, or eye of newt...
CM

[Boerrancher]

I never got into the spray and pray, because Dad was a champion bench rest shooter. I grew up thinking that Sub MOA was normal and the goal was to get all of your shots as close together as possible. When uncle Sam picked me up out of high school and found out I could shoot I was writing my own ticket. Once I got older and became commissioned as a 2Lt, I figured out that I needed to not shoot so well... bad eyesight you know... and I got to spend a lot more time at home instead of in the field or at a school.

I still like to sit down at the bench and try to get them all into one ragged hole, or sit on a high ridge overlooking a large field and hammer critters that happen to venture into my line of sight. Being retired early and slightly disabled, I have to come up with new challenges. BPCR is one challenge that exercises both the mind and body a bit. There are many more variables involved, so it allows me to work on my problem solving skills and the ability to interpret the results from each load.

Thank you all for getting me hooked on this aspect of shooting. I can't wait until I get this Sharps shooting like I want it to so I can start on my 44-40 and 45LC rifles. I am looking forward to seeing how well those two rifles do, and what kind of velocities I can get out of them.

Best wishes from the Boer Ranch,

Joe

[Don McDowell]

Joe there's quite a number of folks not far from you that do a heck of alot of bpcr shooting. Jump over to bpcr.net, send kodiak a pm.

[Boz330]

I think you will find BPCR PLENTY challenging. It is just like bench rest with a few more wrinkles. It is fun though and addictive.

Bob

[Wayne Smith]

Joe, I'm getting 1400 out of a 44-40, 40gr Goex, 200gr Big Lube Boolit, Uberti Short Rifle with a 20" barrel. It's a blast!

[SharpsShooter]

I think you will find BPCR PLENTY challenging. It is just like bench rest with a few more wrinkles. It is fun though and addictive.

Bob

.....and I'll add this to it. Once you get addicted, you will find yourself looking more to BPCR than modern rifles. I only have a couple left that eat white powder. But I can't live without my Krag and 03 Springfield. ;)

SS

[Boz330]

I'm about even maybe slightly favoring BP long guns. I'd have to take a serious look in the safe though to be sure. While I've carried a modern cartridge gun in the field it has been mid 90s since I took a deer with one. Since then it has been 40-65, 38-55 .50 or .54 ML carrying the load.

Bob

[Boerrancher]

I think I am going to start with 70grs of 2F grafs on that 405 and work from there, now that I have got my sight fixed. I roughed up the original base and blade with sand paper and put a big glob of JB weld on it. After it hardened I started shaping it with the drimel tool, and got it the way I like it, and if my figuring is correct I should be about 2 in high at 100 yds, which is were I want to be. I also left the new blade a bit thicker than the original, as it makes it easier to see. Thank you all for the help. I never would have thought about JB weld and building it up that way. Now it is time to start looking for a tang sight.

Best wishes from the Boer Ranch

Joe

[Boerrancher]

I also forgot to mention that I now have a huge purple spot on my shoulder about the size of the butt plate of that old sharps from shooting those 20 rounds the other day. I have only had one other rifle do that to me and that was a Mod 99F savage chambered in a 284 win. I only fired it once and it left the SAVA portion of the word Savage tattooed on my shoulder through my flannel shirt and t shirt. I could also see which direction the screw slot was turned in the butt plate from the impression left on my shoulder.

I am going to have fun with this old sharps and the Holy Black. Anything that kicks that hard, makes that much noise, and bellows that much smoke has got to be one of the coolest things on the planet. I can't wait until this summer when the range is full of people and I drag that bad boy out. :twisted: I bet people will stand up and take notice when 70 grs of the Holy Black detonates in the Valley where the range is located. I can't wait.

Best wishes from the Boer Ranch,

Joe

[BPCR Bill]

Ahh, Joe. Another recoil guy! That brings back fond memories of my first Sharps, a 50-90 in a nine pound Buisness rifle. That rifle could leave some angry marks on a fella.

Regards,
Ibuprofin Bill

[Don McDowell]

Joe go take a look at www.sageoutfitters.com, and order one of those butt ugly slip on pads. It'll stop the purple collar bone business when shooting the military stocks. I put one on my 74 sharps rifle, but it was to late I was already weaned from shooting that thing prone for more than a couple of shots.