Can I melt tin out of alloy?

[mkj4him]

I have ingots of alloy given me years ago. Bullets I cast with it are very light weight. A 500 grain 45/70 mold will drop this allow around 280gr. I am thinking it might be pure tin or a very high tin content alloy.
When I remelted the bullets and brought temp to 450-500 I get a partial melt.
Since tin melts at 450 and lead at 621, would the partial melt be the tin in the alloy? Can I separate the tin from lead by just pouring off?

[dondiego]

Tin and lead create a solution that will not separate as you suggest. I have heard of some tin that is oxidized and can be skimmed off

[M-Tecs]

I have ingots of alloy given me years ago. Bullets I cast with it are very light weight. A 500 grain 45/70 mold will drop this allow around 280gr. I am thinking it might be pure tin or a very high tin content alloy.
When I remelted the bullets and brought temp to 450-500 I get a partial melt.
Since tin melts at 450 and lead at 621, would the partial melt be the tin in the alloy? Can I separate the tin from lead by just pouring off?

The weight and temp indicates you are correct on it being pure tin so you have no lead to separate even if it was possible. Tin has a much higher value than lead so saving it for future alloys would be my recommendation. That or trade it.

[farmerjim]

Any caster will trade with you with a multiple pounds of lead for one of tin.

[bangerjim]

NO! Sn/PB forms a eutectic alloy that melts at a different that either of the two metals and cannot be broken down by any normal "home-brew" method you can do.

Sn will oxidize at Pb melt temps, but not in large amounts.

Best bet is to send a sample to BNH on here (follow his directions!), get an IR shoot of the ingot content, and then sell it on here (with proof of IR shoot) for what you want.

Sn is a VERY expensive primary metal these days. You do NOT want to just destroy it to try and get a little Pb out of it.

banger

[dale2242]

I will bet there is any number of members here that would trade you pure lead for your alloy.

[Sasquatch-1]

Just my 2 cents, but it sounds like what you thought was lead was Pewter. If so in bullet form, they would be perfect for adding to lead when you are having fill out problems. But as stated by Banger Jim, have it analyzed to make sure.

[jonp]

Did you try a density test? Simple to try and will tell you if it's pure tin but won't identify any other metals or you can do this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rY9LcPj_eU8.

You don't need a Bunsen burner, you can use a regular propane torch, this will also tell you if it's tin or if tin is present. Different tests can be done to identify what else is present. Different metals will put off different flame colors.

[justindad]

I wouldn’t send an ingot of what is likely 90% tin off for XRF. I would assume it is 90% tin, mix it with lead so the tin content is twice what I would use, and send an ingot of that off for XRF. If the risk of assuming it is 90% tin is something you can withstand (i.e. no big deal if the assumption is wrong), then do that. If you cannot withstand that risk, then send a $30 ingot off for XRF.

[15meter]

I wouldn’t send an ingot of what is likely 90% tin off for XRF. I would assume it is 90% tin, mix it with lead so the tin content is twice what I would use, and send an ingot of that off for XRF. If the risk of assuming it is 90% tin is something you can withstand (i.e. no big deal if the assumption is wrong), then do that. If you cannot withstand that risk, then send a $30 ingot off for XRF.

Last time I did the send-off a sample for testing all that was required was a BB sized piece for the test. To reimburse for the time he was just looking for a pound of lead. you don't need to send a whole ingot of tin for the test.

[Winger Ed.]

Add the old ingots into more or less pure Lead to make the alloy you want.

[bangerjim]

It is STILL nice to know exactly you are adding, rather than just dumping mystery metal into a pot.

Send the sample off for testing to him. It is worth it to know.

I know the exact % of every primary metal that is in all my alloys. I get the scrap yards to do it (free) B4 I ever buy from them.

[kevin c]

^^^

I cast in volume and like to have the same alloy makeup across different batches for the sake of consistency. There’s no way I know to do that with scrap as the source of what bangerjim calls primary metals without analysis .

[GregLaROCHE]

I suggest sending it off to be tested. Then you won’t be guessing.

[Polymath]

For less than the price of a set of dies, buy a Hardness Tester. This is a must have tool if you are going to cast.
Over and over, I see the same question being asked. A mechanic would buy the tools need to do his work, why not a bullet smith?

[M-Tecs]

Not sure how a hardness tester would help for the OP's question. https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?9318-Brinell-Hardness-of-Tin

[dondiego]

For less than the price of a set of dies, buy a Hardness Tester. This is a must have tool if you are going to cast.
Over and over, I see the same question being asked. A mechanic would buy the tools need to do his work, why not a bullet smith?

I have been casting for over 50 years and have never used one.

[M-Tecs]

I have been casting for over 50 years and have never used one.

I have a couple. They do have their place for some applications like heat treating or maximizing hard alloys. For most applications they are of limited use.

I also have access to professional level hardness testers that are calibrated with certified standards. The commonly used hardness tester used by casters are not in the same league.

They are nice to have but hardly a necessity.

[dondiego]

I have been casting for over 50 years and have never used one.

To be honest, I never did do competitive long range shooting. I am a plinker who likes to shoot a lot with revolvers and most alloys do fine if the boolit is the correct size and I don't push it beyond 1500 fps. Those technical guys who are pushing the limits do need to know their stuff and I have never bad mouthed any one for doing such. I welcome them to do so. I don't even have a lead thermometer. If I can cast acceptable boolits with my alloy (and I have favored COWW for years....and any free stuff my friends gave me!) I saw no need for those tools for my purposes. I used that extra money that I didn't spend on a hardness tester and a lead thermometer to buy powder and primers..........I have a LOT of primers!

[dondiego]

how did I quote my own quote? I was responding to M-Tecs????

[Polymath]

Not sure how a hardness tester would help for the OP's question. https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?9318-Brinell-Hardness-of-Tin

For example: I went to an estate sale and picked up 30 lbs of unknown alloy. Tested it against a known alloy (a chunk of lead -free solder) Low and behold I had 30 lbs of pure tin.
What the deceased caster had done is picked up a lot of printing type set letters and bars and melted it to make bars. He passed without telling what he was up to. I have enough tin to make all the L2 I'll ever shoot and then some.

Even when I know the mixture I'm blending, I take a sample in a little ladle, test it to make sure it falls in the correct hardness range then get back to casting L2 ingots. It is simple accurate and quick.

I found range lead can vary a lot, so if I melt range lead, I do a test to see how much tin to add. I mark on the ingot the BHN of that batch.

[M-Tecs]

For example: I went to an estate sale and picked up 30 lbs of unknown alloy. Tested it against a known alloy (a chunk of lead -free solder) Low and behold I had 30 lbs of pure tin.
What the deceased caster had done is picked up a lot of printing type set letters and bars and melted it to make bars. He passed without telling what he was up to. I have enough tin to make all the L2 I'll ever shoot and then some.

Even when I know the mixture I'm blending, I take a sample in a little ladle, test it to make sure it falls in the correct hardness range then get back to casting L2 ingots. It is simple accurate and quick.

I found range lead can vary a lot, so if I melt range lead, I do a test to see how much tin to add. I mark on the ingot the BHN of that batch.

Unknown alloys are still unknown alloys. Hardness testing is an indication not an end all. With pure lead and pure tin alloys it may work ok if your tester is close to being calibrated. Once you start more complex unknown alloys not so much.

[fredj338]

If its all tin, which it sounds like, better off just getting pure lead & adding it to the tin. Pure tin is expensive, pure lead is pretty cheap.

[fredj338]

For example: I went to an estate sale and picked up 30 lbs of unknown alloy. Tested it against a known alloy (a chunk of lead -free solder) Low and behold I had 30 lbs of pure tin.
What the deceased caster had done is picked up a lot of printing type set letters and bars and melted it to make bars. He passed without telling what he was up to. I have enough tin to make all the L2 I'll ever shoot and then some.

Even when I know the mixture I'm blending, I take a sample in a little ladle, test it to make sure it falls in the correct hardness range then get back to casting L2 ingots. It is simple accurate and quick.

I found range lead can vary a lot, so if I melt range lead, I do a test to see how much tin to add. I mark on the ingot the BHN of that batch.

Type metal would more likely be lino, not pure tin. Still very useful in making a lead/tin/antimony alloy.

[M-Tecs]

Composition of type sets here:

http://letterpressprinting.com.au/page40.htm

[Rickf1985]

Composition of type sets here:

http://letterpressprinting.com.au/page40.htm

Good info! I saved that page in my files. I would love to see some printed info on the composition of the spacers. All of the spacers I used when I was in the printing business were soft or very close to it but I got some not to long ago that tested at 15bhn.

[Charlie Horse]

Just my 2 cents, but it sounds like what you thought was lead was Pewter.

This would be my guess. Did we ever find out what it was? Just curious.