How Do You Bury Guns and Ammo For Later Recovery?

[Liberty1776]

So I have a few "extra" guns that could be put in Deep Storage for later recovery, should that become necessary.

What's the best way to preserve a firearm and ammo if it's underground?

I have a 20mm steel ammo can that would hold a goodly amount of handguns and ammo.

But how to assure the handguns and ammo don't rust or corrode away?

Shrink-wrap each gun in a vacuum bag with a water/air absorber pack?

Wrap in an oil-soaked rag?

Traditionally, guns were covered with cosmoline, whatever that is. Can I spray on, say, Boeshield or some other protectant and trust it's good for several years? Smear them with grease? What kind of grease would be ideal?

And should the steel ammo can itself be inserted in a thick plastic bag before burying so the can won't rust away? Or painted with a more durable coating?

Is there an ideal container to bury? Something made out of polyethylene perhaps?

I may pour a concrete slab over the site to remember where it is, but also to disguise it as a walkway.

I see digging the hole, putting sand in it, placing the container, covering that with sand and then soil and the concrete slab. Hopefully drainage would be effective and keep the item dry.

I live in the Arizona desert, so it's very dry for years at a time. But we get serious rainfall every once in a while that soaks everything deeply.

[toallmy]

I going to sit back and watch this one:popcorn:

[kootne]

Heavy wall 8 or 10" PVC pipe with glue on ends. Oxygen absorbers. Or drill/tap for a fitting and get a refrigeration guy to vacuum pump it, recharge with an inert gas, nitrogen/argon etc. I think it will outlive us even if you sunk it in a lake.

[Plate plinker]

Never done it but I would think a vacuum bag or two in the before mentioned pvc tube would outlive your grandchildren and toss in some desiccant to boot. Don’t forget a treasure map for the kids to find it.

[salpal48]

Sounds like a Doomsday Apocalypse

[gc45]

Well, I remember this question coming up back in the Clinton days and here we are again. Don't get me going as I'll say something and likley get banned. The Feds know you have guns already and if it comes to that, heaven forbid, are you willing to die for your guns or give them up to live? Trying to lie about having guns will not work and these commies have many ways to make us come clean or be sent to a china labor camp to make apple cell phones....and why I won't own one..

[Ickisrulz]

I'm sure you've read:

"If it's time to bury them, it's time to use them!"

[Handloader109]

Unless you are a felon, or expect to become one, you are legal to own your guns, unless you have illegal guns.... Why hide them? No one is imminently coming to get them. I would
But the PVC is best option. Put a few desiccant pack un to scavenge the last bit of moisture and you will be fine. I would let someone else you know well be aware of what you are doing in case you leave the earth before you need them. I myself would find a safe place to store them above ground like in a storage facility or just have a secondary safe

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[Finster101]

If it comes to that I will just have mine put in the casket with me.

[ascast]

I like false walls myself, best in stone buildings. I like old refrigerators as well. They are cheap. Mouse proof, water proof. Lay them on their back, with drainage out and away. Paint with roofing tar ( great stuff ! ) cover with more plastic sheeting. Roomy, dry,cheap.

[MUSTANG]

Well......... This is how the North Koreans did it for "Caches" in South Korea for North Korean infiltrators over the last 70 years.

a. Pack the firearm in cosmoline or a heavy duty axle grease.
b. Wrap in a canvas/tarp/burlap & tie the wrap liberally with cordage.
c. Pack the wrapped firearm in an additional layer of cosmoline or heavy duty axle grease.
d. Place under a ledge and pack with back fill with rock and gravel. If necessary, dig a hole in ground that has good drainage and cover.


At least that's the way the Makarov pistol's, PPSH-41, Ak47, SKS, and Mauser Rifles were packed that General Vessey (Commander UN Forces and 8th Army Commander) had transferred to the US Marines at the Embassy in the late 1970's from a large cache that was dug up North of Seoul. I was a Sergeant at the time and because I was a "FireArms Enthusiast", A Qualified Armorer via the USMC Correspondence courses at the time, and did a lot of shooting at the Yongsan Range (Rifle and Pistol Club) in Seoul ; I got the nasty Job of cleaning all of them, rendering them inoperative (sure hated that part), and turning them into Wall Hangers at the Marine House. The cache was thought to be about 20 years in the ground when we got them. No rust.

[Winger Ed.]

Heavy wall 8 or 10" PVC pipe with glue on ends. Oxygen absorbers.

^^this^^

Also saturate the ground with Iron filings, and bury other steel items around to mess with & frustrate a metal detector.

[William Yanda]

^^this^^

Also saturate the ground with Iron filings, and bury other steel items around to mess with & frustrate a metal detector.

ooh, you are devious.

[Winger Ed.]

ooh, you are devious.

Nah,,,, I just used to read all the 'Bunker Buddy' articles
(they're called preppers now) that went around during the Clinton years.:bigsmyl2:

Also:
You need to bury the tubes vertically with your stuff wrapped in sort of a bag or sock, so you can dig a little ways down,
cut off the top of the tube and lift everything out all at once instead of trying to reach all the way to the bottom.
Being buried vertically also leaves a much small target for metal detectors.
It will look small, only a few inches in diameter, and won't scope out to the size & shape of a buried rifle.

And don't keep any of the left over pipe or caps.
It might give someone the idea to look for the rest of what, or where they came from,
or ask questions you don't want to answer.

[Misery-Whip]

The C in PVC is Chlorine, and will off gas. Chlorine is quite corrosive...ymmv

[JimB..]

The C in PVC is Chlorine, and will off gas. Chlorine is quite corrosive...ymmv

Chloride, and the smell in new PVC is from the manufacturing process, not the chloride.

[Winger Ed.]

The C in PVC is Chlorine, and will off gas. Chlorine is quite corrosive...ymmv


Hmm. Never thought about that. I figured it was all locked up in a compound like other chemicals do.
I know PVC smells when its new. I wonder if it would all be gassed out if the tube was a few months old.

[jimlj]

The C in PVC is Chlorine, and will off gas. Chlorine is quite corrosive...ymmv

The C is chloride. I have installed hundreds of miles of PVC conduit, and thousands of miles of pvc insulated wire. As far as I know none has gassed off enough to ever cause a problem.

[john.k]

PVC is stable unless it burns.........I cant see the point of burying stuff,99% of the time its lost until a machine digs it up,or a rainstorm washes out where its buried...........and I know buried money has a characteristic stink that every bank recognizes.

[kootne]

Just to be clear, there are no guns or ammo buried in PCV pipe containers in my yard. If you come here around wanting to dig, you can help me dig out my septic tank so I can get it pumped[smilie=l:. I did make one for a guy back sometime during the Clinton administration, he intended to cache an SKS and some shells on his ranch. A real ranch, several sections of foothill and mountains. He was pushing 70 then and I doubt if he is still alive. If he's passed, it will probably still be there til doomsday. I've been gone from that area for over 20 years and had forgotten all about that pipe container til I saw this post.

[Jimmynostars]

Don't forget to stash something to clean them all up with...

[dverna]

Interesting topic.

I have been thinking about it but see no need to do that yet...maybe someday. It gets less of a possibility as I get older. At 71 now, I do not see myself needing to bury guns to ward off government confiscation.

If the SHTF, I am where I want to be. The most likely scenario is looters drive me out of my place or allow me to leave if I give it up to them. Having a small cache of stuff to re-take my home would be necessary. In that case I am not worried about the cache being found by the "government". If I cannot take back my home, I am soon dead anyway. I live in the middle of nowhere.

I like the suggestion to use large PVC pipe. If you are looking at long term storage do not use lubed bullets in your ammunition. PC or jacketed will not affect the powder.

One other consideration, if you live in a place where the ground freezes, hide a hatchet in a tree. Steel or fiberglass handled hatchets will not attract porcupines...$10 at Harbor Freight or less at garage sales. It can be difficult to dig up your goodies without some kind of tool when the ground is frozen. If you are a Rambo guy the hatchet gives you another weapon.

[MrWolf]

I have about 50 fully automatic machine guns buried vertically in my front yard just past the wood fence The area is about 75' wide and about 100' deep. You need to look in every part of it. I put rocks all around to throw off suspicion.

[smilie=1:
Ron

[jdfoxinc]

Bury it under a pipe line.

[Parson]

When Australia first passed their confiscation laws, large diameter pvc suddenly became scarce. Good heavy coating of axle grease will keep the moisture or most anything else from damaging any metal

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

When I buried several handguns, ammo, and silver coins ...
ummm, never mind, those items were lost in a tragic canoe accident on the Rum River in 1992.

[RKJ]

This is out there but bear with me. Why not use the PVC sealed up watertight and everything greased up nice and toss them into your septic tank. It's pretty obvious, but I don't believe the casual looker would dig around in a septic tank. But then again....

[farmbif]

dont know if this might help. but I think it was in a John Wayne movie they dug up the rifles that were buried in a wood crate out in the desert.
if it worked for them it might work for you too.
dont know why you would want to bury a gun
but if I was thinking of doing something like that I'd be sure it was stainless gun.
although you can buy still preservative, works just like cosmoline. you dip in the steel and it pull it out hang it up and it will dry on a thick coat to protect steel
this is what I keep in the shop to preserve motor parts, gears, bearings and stuff

https://www.mscdirect.com/product/details/96823158

[GhostHawk]

I helped an uncle of a friend of mine for 2 days way way back. He was looking at a messy divorce and wanted to protect his collection.

Guns were oiled, slipped into plastic bags, stacked in a steel 55 gal barrel (top off) When he had stacked all he could stack, pumped some 10 to 15 gallons of new oil in. Sealed it up. I was not invited to the bury party. But I know it was out in the middle of nowhere. 1/4 mile from any building, shed, or tree.
I think you would have to walk many many square sections of land and no assurance that you would find it.

I have about 1/3 of mine in a 80's era avacado green refrigerator. Top freezer is all ammo. Fridge part had crisper drawers removed. (They had big holes cut in the front for access) and a board places across them. So ammo could easily be seperated into small caliber pistol, large caliber pistol, and rifle.

People walk by it, doors are open maybe an inch. Anyone says something I just say its too heavy to get up the basement stairs.

Once every couple years I'll grab a couple towels, some gun oil, and a chair. Give everything in there a little lube, and a wipedown.

If I was looking to bury on this property. Choice locations would be.

A outside under the Nat Gas meter. All that metal, of course they will get a false positive.

B Under the front porch. Other side of the wall from the water meter and shutoff.

C Under the front porch under a stack of old metal studs, rebar, etc.

I strongly agree with the well oiled, vacuum sealed bags in a PVC container school of thought.

Just sit and think about it for a couple of days. You'd be amazed with what you come up with.

If you have more than one property, that helps, a lot.
If you have a lake cottage or similar it could be good. As they are normally not occupied 365 days a year.

[country gent]

Another is if in a cold weather area is be sure to bury below the frost line and then some or the freeze thaw expansion will work of joints and containers. Cosmoline is normally heated and applied to the parts or in military scenarios dipped into. Greases work but over time have been known to harm wood and fiberglass's. Desicant packs will work also and in a sealed container wont absorb to the point of releasing moisture.

Purging air and moisture isnt hard to do welders do it all the time tig welding. in each cap drill a hole and glue a 3/8" - 1/2" tube long enough for a pipe cape to fit on. In the bottom run a hose and argon from the welder when sure its coming out the top end glue the cap on let flow go for a few minutes after glue cures then pull hose and glue last cap on.

Storing for emergency looks arnt important consider a coat of paint ( the bake on are very durable and long lasting) over the metal parts. Painted, layered in cosmoline, wrapped in vapor paper or greased canvass in a purged environment below the frost line should stay good and useable for several generations into the future. Ammo vacum sealed and dipped in cosmoline then wrapped in vpi or canvas the same. Buried below frost line will also lower the chance of condensation from temperature changes.

Burying isnt hard as a post hole digger will dig the hole and the tube can be slide in and covered. remember to remove the sod in a chunk and when filled replace and scatter the dirt out thinly when done. Best is to bury on second Tuesday of a month with out an r in it under a full moon With the north star viewing it.

[waksupi]

If you think you need to be burying guns, that is the time you need to be using them.

[Shawlerbrook]

A good coat of RIG sealed in a rust inhibitor bag and then in a milsurp mortar tube.
https://www.zerustproducts.com/products/firearms-ammo-weapons/vci-gun-storage-bags/
295988

[jimlj]

When I buried several handguns, ammo, and silver coins ...
ummm, never mind, those items were lost in a tragic canoe accident on the Rum River in 1992.

What is it with canoe accidents? I lost everything the same way on the Snake river in Idaho.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

What is it with canoe accidents? I lost everything the same way on the Snake river in Idaho.

it's the rapids, very dangerous !

[Liberty1776]

I knew you guys would not let me down!

As I initially said, I have "extra" guns that aren't on anyone's list that can be buried. There are plenty for more instant access, should that become necessary.

I like the idea of vertical PVC tubes. A simple post hole and it's done. Minimal exposure; easy to find; near the surface for access.

I do have a septic tank. There are plastic plugs at ground level in several places that were installed for reasons unknown. Cleanouts? Don't know. This subterranean storage tube would simply look like another part of the septic system.

The mortar tube is looking good, too.

[MaryB]

If you want to hide some in the house take an old water heater, split the outer metal jacket so it can be opened. Then on the inner tank part cut a door and weld on hinges and a way to seal it. Plug the pipes coming in or use them to exchange air through a desiccant cartridge. On the outside run pipes off the top into the wall to make it look like it is in use. Have it in a spot where it makes sense to have a water heater. Spare bathroom, laundry room...

Metal detector? The whole thing is metal! Add some lead in the bottom to make it heavy like it is full of water. Lead is also useful to cast boolits SHTF! So double duty!

[MT Gianni]

Gas meters for houses weigh about 4 1/2 lbs and are aluminum and neoprene. Not much magnetic in them at all. A riser will extend about 4 feet and transition to plastic pipe in most cases.
In one of my favorite Dick Francis books, To the Hilt, the hero is charges with keeping an item secure. Instead of burying it he camouflages it and attaches it to the underside of a stone carport. I have spent a lot of time trying to locate buried pipe, found plenty of junk and bottles not much else.

[Tracy]

Traditionally, guns were covered with cosmoline, whatever that is.

It's pretty much the same thing as liquid Alox.

Btw, you just left a record of your intention to hide/bury some guns. In case you didn't know.

[MUSTANG]

Bringing in a "Touch of Reality", and bursting the bubble of "My Buried/Hid Guns are Undetectable" :

Multi and Hyper Spectral Imaging example: [UtRL="https://www.umbc.edu/rssipl/people/aplaza/Papers/Journals/2013.GRSM.Hyperspectral.pdf"]https://www.umbc.edu/rssipl/people/aplaza/Papers/Journals/2013.GRSM.Hyperspectral.pdf[/URL]

Ground Penetrating Radar example: https://archive.epa.gov/esd/archive-geophysics/web/html/ground-penetrating_radar.html

Forward-looking infrared (FLIR) imagery example: https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/ADA434952.pdf

And - Radio Frequency Detection Devices through Objects -

Wallabot Examples: https://walabot.com
And married with a Smart Phone: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-83Ou9QciA


A previous life says "Danger Will Robinson" and about as far down this analysis and Rabbit Hole as I will go.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

I'm sure you've read:

"If it's time to bury them, it's time to use them!"


If you think you need to be burying guns, that is the time you need to be using them.

Definitely how I feel about it. If you need them they won't do much good, and if you're driven away from that locality you'll be unlikely to return to retrieve them.

Just some entertainment here -- when I had a gunsmithing business and customers of various types, this one fellow brought in an SKS that was just a blob of rust. He had buried it in a tube without any protection at all. Totally destroyed. But, as they only cost about $50 at the time he purchased a brand new one with the intention of doing the same thing. We had this "How to preserve" conversation. Next time I saw him he said that he had buried it and a case of Commie ammo on a hillside slope here in Oregon in the forest where no one would ever find it. The following year he said that he had gone to dig it up as he'd decided to sell it, but couldn't find it. A logging operation had taken place in the area and a logging road bulldozed in the approximate location of the burial site. All of the landmarks were gone, but he figured that it was on the downhill side of the road where all the dirt had been pushed over the road's edge, under perhaps 6-8 ft. of soil. Moral to the story is, I guess, that there's always the unexpected.

DG

[Idaho45guy]

This thread reminds of a news story I saw recently that gave me pause...

https://www.outdoorlife.com/fishing/florida-boy-goes-magnet-fishing-finds-two-rifles/

Somebody removed the serial numbers off of $10k worth of sniper rifles, attempted to preserve them and hide them in a river, and was successful for years, apparently.

Then an 11-year old kid and his grandpa ruin his plans.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Puts one in mind of the old joke about the son who was serving time in prison for bank robbery getting a letter from his dad complaining that he was getting too old and had too much arthritis to dig up the vegetable garden that Spring.

The son, knowing that all mail was read by the authorities, wrote back, "Be careful where you dig, dad, I buried the money in your yard. Pretty soon the FBI descended on the old man's property and dug the entire yard up, finding nothing.

The dad wrote "Thanks, son, it's ready for planting now."


DG

[Parson]

In response to the suggestion of septic tank, That’s where some of the missionaries I served with threw there’s when the government came looking, nobody was going to reach down there to get them

[Outpost75]

WW2 weapons caches we recovered in Italy in 2010 had small arms which had been dipped in light oil, the thumb ring of a wire saw slipped over the muzzle and laid lengthwise towards the butt. Entire weapon was then mummy-wrapped in coarse muslin bandage fabric and immersed in melted cosmolene, then pairs wrapped in shelter halves tied with paracord, being stacked in a Mk2 drop canister with ammo cans, medical supplies and cleaning gear which included galvanized tins of kerosene or diesel. After unwrapping the shelter halves the exposed ring of the wire saw could be used to cut open the wrapping and remove the weapons, which could be readied for use by wiping of the grease and clearing the bores with the cleaning gear provided. The BRENs, STENs, S&W Victory revolvers and No.4 Enfields were preserved in fine condition. The drop canisters buried in a churchyard.

[Tazman1602]

Bianchi blue bags then store where you wish…..

Well they used to be Bianchi…..


https://www.amazon.com/Victory-VCI-Rust-Prevention-Storage/dp/B07FDJ2DCG/ref=sr_1_2?crid=2PIBFQ60Q2WEB&keywords=Gun+storage+bag&qid=1644355272&sprefix=gun+storage+bag%2Caps%2C92&sr=8-2

https://www.amazon.com/Weapon-Protection-Zerust-Prevention-Closure/dp/B00PJ4QN12/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2PIBFQ60Q2WEB&keywords=Gun+storage+bag&qid=1644355272&sprefix=gun+storage+bag%2Caps%2C92&sr=8-1

Art

[Half Dog]

Sounds like too much work. I’ll just keep them locked and loaded.

[Lakehouse2012]

Reading this thread with lots of interest! [emoji3]

What if the time of year you need to dig them up, has 2ft of frost in the ground.....

I personally wouldn't bury. I'll stand my ground from anyone trying to take them

Sent from my SM-A526U using Tapatalk

[Bloodman14]

'If it's time to bury them, it's time to use them'? Exactly whom would you use them against? How does one determine who the first 'targets' would be? Where would you start?

[Gator 45/70]

Mine are in that pile of firewood out back that needs to be split first in order to recover everything.....

[Der Gebirgsjager]

'If it's time to bury them, it's time to use them'? Exactly whom would you use them against? How does one determine who the first 'targets' would be? Where would you start?

If you want to keep them, then against those who wish to take them. Or, that seems logical to me. Those who physically show up to confiscate them.

DG

[farmbif]

guess what. this kid and his gramps is gonna be reading bout all these canoe accidents and might just be heading that way



This thread reminds of a news story I saw recently that gave me pause...

https://www.outdoorlife.com/fishing/florida-boy-goes-magnet-fishing-finds-two-rifles/

Somebody removed the serial numbers off of $10k worth of sniper rifles, attempted to preserve them and hide them in a river, and was successful for years, apparently.

Then an 11-year old kid and his grandpa ruin his plans.

[Jedman]

If you live in a home that you own and don’t plan to move away from I would find a way to hide them above ground. Disguised somewhere in a cavity in your home to where you could get to them in short order if needed.
But beware, I put guns in odd places at home and go thu heck to find them and they are not even hidden !
My memory of hiding things and remembering the situation is very bad. You really need to make a plan and have a way to retrieve what’s hidden that you can’t forget.
For me this would be very hard and I would never bury anything of value.

Jedman

[john.k]

Once about 40 years ago,a whole fleet of dozers,loaders ,excavators ,compressors ,airtracks disappeared ,on finance co lease.......The stuff was nowhere to be found,any of it,so it was thought it had been buried ....the finance co reps hired a light plane and checked over about 10 sq miles every couple of weeks ...using a mineral exploration magnetic flux detector,they found the site of an iron deposit ,a helicopter landed on site with under ground detection gear,and by the end of the week ,the cops had the land cordoned off ,and digging had started.

[blackthorn]

If you want to keep them, then against those who wish to take them. Or, that seems logical to me. Those who physically show up to confiscate them.

DG

Those who show up to confiscate are just doing what they were ordered by some rotten old politician to do. Sort of like shooting the guy you caught sleeping with your wife----SHE had the option of saying NO! Pick your target.

[waksupi]

'If it's time to bury them, it's time to use them'? Exactly whom would you use them against? How does one determine who the first 'targets' would be? Where would you start?

I could imagine some agencies that have been an ongoing problem would be the place to start.

[Ickisrulz]

Those who show up to confiscate are just doing what they were ordered by some rotten old politician to do. Sort of like shooting the guy you caught sleeping with your wife----SHE had the option of saying NO! Pick your target.

"Just following orders." Let's jump directly to the Nazis here....

[Plate plinker]

Just remember Ruby Ridge and Waco. The past days prove they will do it. Be vigilant and safe.

[quilbilly]

All the other suggestions are good but if you have acreage, I would use one of the those plastic rainwater collecting cisterns with a screw on lid. They are water tight except for the entry hole and spigot. Most are 40" long so are fine for carbines. Bury it on its side.

[Lex]

I really don't think I would bury guns I would worry about rust and the government could find them if they want to anyway.