giants in those days (genesis 6.4)

[farmbif]

for those of you in the know i was wondering where exactly these giants were
and the sons of god came into the daughters of men
anyone, can put this in terms we can understand.

Gilgamesh?

[Winger Ed.]

A bunch have been discovered in the United states. Some as much as 15' tall.
In the early 1900s, the Smithsonian destroyed thousands of giant skeletons to 'preserve history'.

Do a quickie search for "Where are giant skeletons found".
A bunch of info and sites come right up.
And they've been found in various numbers pretty much all over the ancient world too.

Digging into ancient history-- and asking questions:
You'll find there's a lot of misinformation we've been told, and some pretty big gaps in human & the planet's history,
especially starting about 5,000 years ago, and going back from there..

[MUSTANG]

According to the King James Bible; David Killed Goliath. 1st Samuel Chapter 17.

Goliath was a giant, standing six cubits and a span tall. 1st Samuel Chapter 17, verse 4.


According to Hebrew scholars a cubit was the distance from the elbow to the finger tip. It ranged from 17.5 inches (short) to 20.4 inches (long). A short man or a tall man would have different "Cubit" measurements; so scholars believe the Cubit was standardized based on the "Rulers" elbow to fingertip measurement - as was the old "foot" measurement. Any way, we can assume that Goliath was a giant ranging from an 8 foot & 3/4 inches tall plus whatever a "Span" length was - to a height of
12 foot & 1/4 inch plus a "Span".




Based on "Scholars" timelines; David lived during the eleventh century BCE (Before Christian Era). That means we have written records of "Giants" walking the earth, and one can derive that they might be uncommon; but they were common enough that all the recordings in 1st Samuel do is give the "Facts" (Just the Facts Mam) concerning the size of Goliath - with no "Astonishment" about his size or his being a giant. This about 3,100 years ago.

In recent times, we see recorded that the tallest human was Robert Wadlow of the United States of America (1918–1940). He was 8 ft 11 inches. Almost a foot taller than the "Short Cubit" for Goliath; or about 3 feet shorter than the "Long Cubit" dimensions for Goliath.

[farmbif]

ok so, David lived about 1100 BC or somewhere around that time. I'm sure many of us have seen pictures of HUGE stone block construction around the world from a history that's just not taught in school. and wonder how could those huge stones be moved. well if you have a society of people 12' tall the stones maybe not that big.
and the epic of Gilgamesh was supposedly written somewhere between 2100 and 1200 BC so the timeline is not crazy
David definitely killed a giant named Goliath and the the Gilgamesh story has a bunch of historical proof and supposedly a huge being like 12' tall just like the description in bible of Goliath.
But for the Bible to reference saying that in "those days there were giants" and then too have historically writings about Gilgamesh and also historical pectoral evidence in reliefs and fired clay of the giant Sumarians.
I just find historical references in the bible that are proven out as historical archeological fact fascinating stuff.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

The sons of God = The Nephilim (fallen angels)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLalLQUwM9Q

[Winger Ed.]

I always figured Goliath had a thyroid issue and it made him taller and bigger than the norm. for his time,
the same way it happens once in awhile now.

I've been fascinated by the theory about when 12-15' tall people was more the norm.,
Or, as there is different races and ethnicities now, if there was a race of them way, way back in history.
As recent as 20,000 years ago, something happened almost as bad as the dinosaur killer asteroid.
It killed most of the people at the time.
The world before that was a totally different place than what we have today.

[Good Cheer]

for those of you in the know i was wondering where exactly these giants were
and the sons of god came into the daughters of men
anyone, can put this in terms we can understand.

Gilgamesh?

Alberino's book "Birthright" is well worth perusing.

[Ickisrulz]

Sons of God= Those descendants (probably spiritually) of Seth who lived righteously

Daughters of Man= Descendants (spiritually) of Cain who lived wickedly

These people intermarried (producing fallen humans) and any good that existed within the human race was swallowed up in wickedness. This pushed humanity even further toward the need to start over via the flood.

This explains it for me anyway. To suggest Angels married humans is not supported in the Bible. This is such a bizarre passage without any bearing on our faith, I just don't get wrapped up in it or think it is worth stressing over.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

To suggest Angels married humans is not supported in the Bible
I disagree.
I don't think it could be more clear that the Nephilim impregnated Human women. "sons of God" (this group of Nephilim) is also mentioned in Job 38. Also this group of fallen angels is mentioned in Jude 1, saying Enoch prophesied their coming.

[Ickisrulz]

I disagree.
I don't think it could be more clear that the Nephilim impregnated Human women. "sons of God" (this group of Nephilim) is also mentioned in Job 38. Also this group of fallen angels is mentioned in Jude 1, saying Enoch prophesied their coming.

As Angels are neither given nor taken in marriage, what would be the point of God creating them with human male biology?

Speaking of being clear, the Genesis passage is not clear on if the Nephilim are the offspring or the the fathers. Additionally, we are not quite sure how Nephilim should even be translated. This is not an issue where one can be dogmatic.

Genesis has some weird stuff in it!

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Weird stuff.
Is it weird that Cain's Genealogy is always listed separate from Adam's?

[farmbif]

well the Bible sure does say exactly
the sons of god came into the daughters of men.

and I'm sure different people have different ways of interpreting this one line

but then again there are different versions of the Bible, they were all written and edited by men, I dont think they let the lady folk do that there kind of stuff back then when this was all written down
and also what was written was most likely stories that had been passed down through the ages and then written down and compiled.

there's a whole other book to the Bible found in the Dead Sea scrolls that is not in any printed bible today and others of those scrolls are exactly what is in bibles we got today

[badguybuster]

Michael Heiser delves really thoroughly into this topic in the book "Supernatural". Its an excellent book about restoring the supernatural aspects of the Bible. The King James is not the most accurate version of the Bible. The NASB most closely resembles The Septuagent which is the Bible the Apostles used. The Bible doesnt say angels CANNOT have sex, it just says they dont.

[kenton]

According to the King James Bible; David Killed Goliath. 1st Samuel Chapter 17.

Goliath was a giant, standing six cubits and a span tall. 1st Samuel Chapter 17, verse 4.


According to Hebrew scholars a cubit was the distance from the elbow to the finger tip. It ranged from 17.5 inches (short) to 20.4 inches (long). A short man or a tall man would have different "Cubit" measurements; so scholars believe the Cubit was standardized based on the "Rulers" elbow to fingertip measurement - as was the old "foot" measurement. Any way, we can assume that Goliath was a giant ranging from an 8 foot & 3/4 inches tall plus whatever a "Span" length was - to a height of
12 foot & 1/4 inch plus a "Span".




Based on "Scholars" timelines; David lived during the eleventh century BCE (Before Christian Era). That means we have written records of "Giants" walking the earth, and one can derive that they might be uncommon; but they were common enough that all the recordings in 1st Samuel do is give the "Facts" (Just the Facts Mam) concerning the size of Goliath - with no "Astonishment" about his size or his being a giant. This about 3,100 years ago.

In recent times, we see recorded that the tallest human was Robert Wadlow of the United States of America (1918–1940). He was 8 ft 11 inches. Almost a foot taller than the "Short Cubit" for Goliath; or about 3 feet shorter than the "Long Cubit" dimensions for Goliath.

A span is the distance from the tip of your thumb to the tip of your pinky, generally standardized at 9 inches. But like all dimensions based on human size today's values are larger than they would have been in the past.

[MUSTANG]

A span is the distance from the tip of your thumb to the tip of your pinky, generally standardized at 9 inches. But like all dimensions based on human size today's values are larger than they would have been in the past.

Thanks for the info on a Span. Of course; If a person were 8 to 15 feet tall, that Cubit and Span might be significantly larger.

[Good Cheer]

The fallen ones are a generally neglected study.
Big thumbs up for Heiser and others.
Read Alberino's Birthright a while back.
http://i.imgur.com/wLGL0Fi.jpg (https://imgur.com/wLGL0Fi)
Good book.

[Good Cheer]

By the way, as a Christian do you study your enemy?
Deep inquiry and discussion of what you find will likely as not result in being called names by the agnostics and atheists of your acquaintances...
Just part of what you signed on for.:happy dance:

[farmbif]

ive been spending a bit of time reading more about some of this and decided to try and get a complete understanding of the epic of Gilgamesh which after all is the oldest written story or so it is thought to be. and it literally is written in stone.
it says that Gilgamesh was 2/3 god and 1/3 human. so could this mean that god sent more than one son to our earth.

[Winger Ed.]

Thanks for the info on a Span. If a person were 8 to 15 feet tall, that Cubit and Span might be significantly larger.

We tend to relate most things to our own education/experiences, and discount things that 'don't fit'.

Back in ancient times, the world was different than ours is now.
The air was different, the weather, the landscape, ocean levels--- everything.

There's evidence there were advanced stone age civilizations that navigated across the oceans
and traveled all over the world--- when there was ice on top of the Great Lakes about a mile thick.

If the earth is slowing down, it probably has been for a long, long time.
That would have made their days, and maybe even years shorter.
I've read well written things saying people might have lived hundreds of years then too.
Maybe not the same length of our years, but hundreds of theirs.
No reason to think people weren't different too.

There's a picture floating around of a guy wearing modern day clothes, who had dug up a human femur (Thigh bone)
in his yard in Michigan. The thigh bone looks just like ours do,,,,,, except it is about four feet long.

[farmbif]

there are some writings, again written in stone or fired clay tablets, that talk about kings before the flood ruling for like 30-40-50,000 years then after the flood some kings ruled for like 600 -700 years. and how long did Moses live?
I think there is a lot in the past we have little to no comprehension of.

[Winger Ed.]

some kings ruled for like 600 -700 years. and how long did Moses live?
I think there is a lot in the past we have little to no comprehension of.

Not sure about Moses. However-- He lived in comparatively modern history.

The guy that wrote the book about finding Noah's ark back in the 70s makes a very valid case
for Noah being about 600 years old when he started building the ark, the earth going through upheavals we can't imagine,
and that he lived to be about 900.

By our teachings, experiences, etc.... It's hard to wrap your head around that.

Or when the last ice age ended quite suddenly- some think from a meteor strike-
it rained basically all day- every day for about 100 years, and the sea level rose somewhere between 250 and 400 feet.
And the land under and around the Great Lakes is still flexing and pushing itself back up from
all the ice melting off the top of it.

[Johnny Diamond]

Very interesting topic, have wondered some of the same things since I was a child.

FINEM RESPICE ~ MEMENTO MORI

[Winger Ed.]

Very interesting topic, have wondered some of the same things since I was a child.

I made the mistake of going on youtube and putting 'ancient civilizations' into their on site search engine.
I was hooked!
There is hundreds of hours of old & new documentaries and other videos on the subject.

A favorite channel is 'Bright Insight'. It's by a guy who served over in the Middle East, videoed various ruins
while on active duty, and has gone back to sights where he served, and other places of the ancient world.

He filmed one place that went back probably before the Egyptians ruled the Nile.
He shows it while he was in uniform, and again--- after the Taliban blasted it into a pile of dirt.

He shows what he sees, or has been allowed to video, and asks some very interesting questions
about those places and the people who lived in and built them as he is narrating the video.

If you can find it-- read the book "Kon-Tiki" written in the 1940s or 50s.
It was written along with another book about ancient mariners.
In "Kon_Tiki" the author builds a balsa wood raft on the coast of S. America, and sails off into
the Pacific ocean. He was trying to figure out where people on the Polynesian islands came from.
He built the raft more or less from cave drawings, and images on old pottery.

When he finally came ashore on one island, the primitive people there weren't surprised at all to see him.
They came right out to help bring it in from the surf.
Their oral history told of fair skinned people with beards that would come back on rafts like his.

[Good Cheer]

The tall red bearded people came to North and South America many centuries before the Spaniards.
An early incursion I've read of seems to be about the time Joshua ran their stinky behinds out of the Levant.
Were those part of genetically sullied mankind? Or just some of them maybe? I see no reason to doubt it.

PS,
Speaking of these people, this reminds me of a topic I'm surprised isn't in the theological forum:
"Who is running our country?"

Yeah, I know, some would immediately have the knee jerk reaction of thinking that's politics.
But, no, it's not.

[GhostHawk]

Who's running our country? The ones Trump tried to get rid of. The multinational corporations, the Globalists, One world Government activists. The global warming lets fix it by taxing the rich idiots.

[Good Cheer]

Hi GhostHawk.
Was thinking along the lines of good and evil, thinking that we are in the front row seats of watching the machinery of the devil's global government being assembled. That we're in what is (at present at least) the super power of super powers being used to set it up.

[Johnny Diamond]

I made the mistake of going on youtube and putting 'ancient civilizations' into their on site search engine.
I was hooked!
There is hundreds of hours of old & new documentaries and other videos on the subject.

A favorite channel is 'Bright Insight'. It's by a guy who served over in the Middle East, videoed various ruins
while on active duty, and has gone back to sights where he served, and other places of the ancient world.

He filmed one place that went back probably before the Egyptians ruled the Nile.
He shows it while he was in uniform, and again--- after the Taliban blasted it into a pile of dirt.

He shows what he sees, or has been allowed to video, and asks some very interesting questions
about those places and the people who lived in and built them as he is narrating the video.

If you can find it-- read the book "Kon-Tiki" written in the 1940s or 50s.
It was written along with another book about ancient mariners.
In "Kon_Tiki" the author builds a balsa wood raft on the coast of S. America, and sails off into
the Pacific ocean. He was trying to figure out where people on the Polynesian islands came from.
He built the raft more or less from cave drawings, and images on old pottery.

When he finally came ashore on one island, the primitive people there weren't surprised at all to see him.
They came right out to help bring it in from the surf.
Their oral history told of fair skinned people with beards that would come back on rafts like his.I seem to remember seeing something on TV (in the 70s?)
About Kon Tiki.

FINEM RESPICE ~ MEMENTO MORI

[Johnny Diamond]

Hi GhostHawk.
Was thinking along the lines of good and evil, thinking that we are in the front row seats of watching the machinery of the devil's global government being assembled. That we're in what is (at present at least) the super power of super powers being used to set it up.Oh yeah GOOD N EVIL alright.

FINEM RESPICE ~ MEMENTO MORI