Happy 50th Jeremiah Johnson

[Kylongrifle32]

Picked this up a tractor supply just before Christmas. I'm 56 but I can somehow remember going to the movie theater and seeing the movie with my dad. Been a mountain man want a be every since then.
I have a knight 50 cal MK 85 that I hunt with during early muzzleloader season in September when the leaves are on the trees. But for late season ( December) I break out the T/C Renegade and leather possible bag. It's not a Hawken but it's close enough for my imagination. I will sit on the couch one night every year before season and pop a big bowl of popcorn and relive my childhood.

[Loudenboomer]

Can you Skin Griz! :)

[country gent]

Even bigger question is, Do you still have your Hair?????

[MUSTANG]

kylongrifle32; if I remember correctly - Jeremiah Johnson "Wanted a Real Hawken" too in the movie. I built my Hawken from a Kit back shortly before Jeremiah Johnson came out in the movies.

[Moleman-]

Great movie, watch it at least once a year. Don't know if I'd of headed into the mountains armed with a 30 hawkens. Good thing Hatchet Jack met that bear.

[hc18flyer]

You skin this one Pilgrim, while I get you a nuther in!

[Bad Ass Wallace]

Among my treasures is a Thompson Centre 54cal Hawkin and like others, I bought it after watching the movie.

https://i.imgur.com/SY6JH8Gl.jpg

[pworley1]

"Your mighty cocky for a starvin' pilgrim"

[fiberoptik]

Started my journey with bp as well.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[AntiqueSledMan]

Hello Kylongrifle32,

Wow, where has the time gone.
I can't believe it was 50 years ago when my best friend & I went to see that movie.
Of course when I purchased my first muzzle loader, it had to be a Hawken (Thomson Center).
Have since handed that rifle down to my son.
Of course now I will have to watch the movie again, unfortunately it's not as exciting as it was 50 years ago.

AntiqueSledMan.

[ScrapMetal]

Love the movie. Interesting little note, in Guns Magazine Special Old West 2022 volume #88 they carried an article on John "Liver-eating" Johnson (The Crow killing cannibal) whose life was put on screen as "Jeremiah Johnson". The story was definitely Hollywood-ized.

http://johnlivereatingjohnston.com/

-Ron

[sharps4590]

My oldest son literally wore out a VHS tape of that movie. 'Course I didn't discourage him. My first "Hawken" was a Lyman Great Plains rifle. Next was custom, 1850's correct, Gun Works Hawken. It compares favorably to the few originals I've handled.

[freakonaleash]

I saw that movie at the theater. One time was enough for me.

[pietro]

Don't know if I'd of headed into the mountains armed with a 30 hawkens.




In the 1800's, a muzzleloading "30 bore" rifle is the same as today's .54 caliber - certainly good enough to ride the river with.


.

[Kylongrifle32]

Strange coincidence.
After 20 years our 32 inch TV bit the dust. Been watching it black and white for 2 months. We went out shopping yesterday and came home last night with a 43 inch flat screen. Told the wife we should put the Jeremiah Johnson DVD in and got the stink eye look. Got it set up and watched a few episodes of Forged in Fire. Wife feel asleep about 11:00 pm so I started channel surfing. Was working my way up to the 300's where our movie channels are. Got to 299 Reelz channel and there it was Jeremiah Johnson about an hour into the movie.

[TNsailorman]

Definitely hollywoodized movie but intertaining. The story is based on several incidents but mostly as stated on "Liver eating Johnson". I don't believe anyone would call him a canibal to his face and live. Eating the liver of an enemy back then was a form of distain or disgust and practiced by more than just Johnson. As far as Robert Redford is concerned, he would be dead 30 seconds into a fight with the real Liver Eater. I read an autobiography about him and he was not someone you wanted to get mad at you. Of course in todays society he would be branded a muderer. He was or is buried in downtown Los Angeles, but it has been years since I read about him. james

[Digger]

Thanks for the input there TNsailorman ...
Curiosity peaked and I did a quick search and came up with this website , has bits and pieces of info on Johnson .
Interesting reading.
link:
http://johnlivereatingjohnston.com/

[TNsailorman]

Thank lyou for that link Digger. I foung it very interesting. Evidently the "autobiography" that I bought and read was more ifction than truth. There were many old mountain men that deserve reading about and I read everything I could get my hands on about them when I was much younger. I even bought a drawing from the Colorado museum of Modena's Hawken rifle and I made an exact rifle to the dimensions of that rifle. I won many a black powder match with it before I quit shooting in rifle matches. The mountain men were responible for the westward movement by reason of some of their tall tales which they loved to tell the "pilgrims". They called it "yarning" and they spread some good tales, especially Jim Bridger, maybe the best of them all. Problem was, that Bridger told so many tall tales that shen he spent the winter in the Yellowstone hot springs area that nodbody believed him when he tried to tell about those hot springs and bubbling guizzers. It was an interesting era and I still enjoy reading about it. james

[sharps4590]

John Colter supposedly saw Yellowstone first and for some time thereafter it was known as "Colter's Hell." I think Colter predated Bridger as a trapper.

I used to have the book "Crow Killer". It was a fun read but I don't know how accurate it was.

Johnson was exhumed and is now buried in Trail Town in Cody, Wyoming and, has been for over 30 years.

[Gunor]

In the 1800's, a muzzleloading "30 bore" rifle is the same as today's .54 caliber - certainly good enough to ride the river with.


.

I always wondered about that - thanks

[toot]

help. in what movie did CHARLTON HESTON star in with his son, I beleave his son,& and I remember the seen when he shot a charging INDIAN with his ramrod. didn't have time to finish reloading. I thought that was a real scenario that could have taken place. good thing it was a wooden one & not metal.

[sharps4590]

toot, that was "The Mountain Men" and Brian Keith co-starred with Heston. Heston's son, Fraser, was the director and as far as I know didn't act in the movie. Was a pretty good movie except for some of the language.

[Beerd]

Don't know if I'd of headed into the mountains armed with a 30 hawkens.


In the 1800's, a muzzleloading "30 bore" rifle is the same as today's .54 caliber - certainly good enough to ride the river with.


I always wondered about that - thanks


'cept in the Hollywood version is was a 30 caliber .

and after moving up to a 50 caliber the recoil always put Mr. Redford on his butt when taking a shot ;)
..

[centershot]

How does one derive .54 caliber from "30 bore"?

[Beerd]

30 roundballs from one pound of lead or 7000grains/30 = 233 grains each
a 54 caliber rifle might use a .535" roundball which is 230 grains

close enough for government work.
..

[fastdadio]

30 roundballs from one pound of lead or 7000grains/30 = 233 grains each
a 54 caliber rifle might use a .535" roundball which is 230 grains

close enough for government work.
..

Yup, I used to load my .58 with 20 gauge shot cups. So, a 20 bore she'd be..... Oh, and I just loaded Jeremiah Johnson on the Roku. Got my .58 Hawken out to fondle. Going to watch it soon. Maybe I'll stoke the old boy up with a heavy blank and make some noise tonight. Happy new year folks!

[country gent]

He acquired Hatchet Jacks 50 hawken when he found him dead.
Hatchet Jacks letter stated, I Hatchet Jack being of sound mind and broke legs hoped this was found by a white man and it was a good rifle that killed the bear that killed him. The 30 was a hawken that he brought with him.

What Im really curious about if the hawken company ever made a 30 cal or that was movie privilege

[MUSTANG]

"His name was Jeremiah Johnson, and they say he wanted to be a mountain man. The story goes that he was a man of proper wit and adventurous spirit, suited to the mountains. Nobody knows whereabouts he come from and don’t seem to matter much. He was a young man and ghosty stories about the tall hills didn’t scare him none. He was looking for a Hawken gun, .50 caliber or better. He settled for a .30, but damn, it was a genuine Hawken, and you couldn’t go no better."


I was unable to find any historical references to a .30 Hawken; all I found was they custom made to order rifles in 50's, 58's and other "Heavy" bullets.

I did find this from 1962:

293865

http://grrw.org/the-heyday-of-the-hawken/
As for me - Mine is an honest to gosh HAWKEN in 50 caliber; hand made (correctly stated hand fitted, polished, stained, shellacked, browned, and assembled by me from a kit).

[centershot]

30 roundballs from one pound of lead or 7000grains/30 = 233 grains each
a 54 caliber rifle might use a .535" roundball which is 230 grains

close enough for government work.
..

DUH! The shotgun "gauge" methodology never occurred to me!

[sharps4590]

In the Museum of the Mountain Man in Pinedale, Wyoming, there is supposedly a Hawken that belonged to Bridger. IF I remember correctly, it is a small bore rifle and I want to remember 36 cal. The Hawken brothers DID make more than just their celebrated Plains rifle. Remember, during their hey day they were located in St. Louis and there was a sizably greater local market than the one for the rifle that made them famous.

[barnabus]

Strange coincidence.
After 20 years our 32 inch TV bit the dust. Been watching it black and white for 2 months. We went out shopping yesterday and came home last night with a 43 inch flat screen. Told the wife we should put the Jeremiah Johnson DVD in and got the stink eye look. Got it set up and watched a few episodes of Forged in Fire. Wife feel asleep about 11:00 pm so I started channel surfing. Was working my way up to the 300's where our movie channels are. Got to 299 Reelz channel and there it was Jeremiah Johnson about an hour into the movie.

yep i saw it and watched it again too.

[Deadeye Bly]

I've watched it many times. It's all a Hollywood version of a small part of Jeremiah Johnson's life but I still enjoy it. It's hard to imagine the old mountain man as Grampa on the Waltons. I'll watch it again if I see it on TV.

[astrawn]

Always a good one to see. If you like this genre you might try the book “Mountain Man” by Vardis Fisher. Also, his cabin (Johnston) is available for viewing in Red Lodge, Montana, which happens to be at one end of the best driving trail in America, the Beartooth highway. I highly recommend both. Several regular mountain man gatherings to go to every year as well.

Have fun, and maybe see you there!

Drew

[toot]

sharps4590, I don't know what you mean about the language? cursing? thanking you for the reply.

[John Taylor]

Great movie, watch it at least once a year. Don't know if I'd of headed into the mountains armed with a 30 hawkens. Good thing Hatchet Jack met that bear.

There were probably more small calibers than large. Lead and powder did not come easy.
The book "Crow Killer" is about liver eating Johnson .

[poorman]

The book "Crow Killer"

https://archive.org/details/crow-killer

[trapper9260]

The one that taught Robert Redford how to live the way he did in the movie ,to make it look real , I got that guys book of how to live like that. I got it many years ago when I was small. It was interesting for what is all in it, I watch the movie and have it on VHS . I know Hollywood at time dramatized. It still was a interesting movie .

[ScrapMetal]

The book "Crow Killer"

https://archive.org/details/crow-killer

Thanks for the link. I'll have some reading for my "spare time" this week.

-Ron

[trebor44]

"Crow Killer", "The saga of Liver-Eating Johnson". Raymond W. Thorp & Robert Bunker, ISBN 0-253-11425-N, Indiana University Press. A entertaining read, one of several books on the subject. Definitely a rabbit hole....

[725]

Just bought a copy.

[Baltimoreed]

Great film. Watch yer topknot pilgrim.