Hollow base 44Army C&B conical

[ItllKeal]

Hello, I'm new to the cap n ball scene but I am experienced in black powder. I've always had excellent accuracy using Hornaday 50 cal hollow based conicals in my old knight LK93 inline. I'm left wondering if the hollow base conicals will be as accurate in the 1957 Bill Eduards repro Colt 1860 Army that I have acquired and enjoy at the moment. Any info as to where I can obtain some preferentially 160gr to 180gr range is greatly appreciated. Thanks.

[missionary5155]

Good afternoon
Welcome to Castboolits !
I have shot 200 grain HB conicals from 44 revolvers and can attest they are effective on live critters out to 25 yards. We hunt river bottoms and seldome need to shoot farther than 25 yards most shots being under 20 yards and 7 yards has happened often.
But I would wonder... if you are considering a hunting load why would you want to go so light weight unless you are thinking of bunnies and other light weight critters.
With corn crunchers of the larger types (East ILL-nois ) I prefer at least 220 grains as we want a complete pass through. And using 40-1 mix a HB is going to expand with that extra lead weight well appreciated to push that slug all the way through
But again Welcome to the good life of flying lead.

[Good Cheer]

Hello, I'm new to the cap n ball scene but I am experienced in black powder. I've always had excellent accuracy using Hornaday 50 cal hollow based conicals in my old knight LK93 inline. I'm left wondering if the hollow base conicals will be as accurate in the 1957 Bill Eduards repro Colt 1860 Army that I have acquired and enjoy at the moment. Any info as to where I can obtain some preferentially 160gr to 180gr range is greatly appreciated. Thanks.

You might be able to find one. Probably depends upon your chamber diameter.

Is the geometry of the cylinder and frame of your revolver going to give you a lot of leeway on boolit shapes you can get into position to seat into the chambers?
With the right dimensions you could choose from many different off the shelf molds.

Are the chambers of a diameter meeting or exceeding the barrel groove diameter?
Hollow bases may not be of benefit.

[ItllKeal]

Good afternoon
Welcome to Castboolits !
I have shot 200 grain HB conicals from 44 revolvers and can attest they are effective on live critters out to 25 yards. We hunt river bottoms and seldome need to shoot farther than 25 yards most shots being under 20 yards and 7 yards has happened often.
But I would wonder... if you are considering a hunting load why would you want to go so light weight unless you are thinking of bunnies and other light weight critters.
With corn crunchers of the larger types (East ILL-nois ) I prefer at least 220 grains as we want a complete pass through. And using 40-1 mix a HB is going to expand with that extra lead weight well appreciated to push that slug all the way through
But again Welcome to the good life of flying lead.

I have 220 gr Kaito conicals for hunting. I truly want the best accuracy that the revolver is possible of achieving. With the 300plus gr Hornaday slugs cut my grouping from 2 1/2" down to about 1 1/2" at 100 yes but you had to have the right touch compacting the powder to get it that close. Thanks for the knowledge.

[Castaway]

missionary5155, how much powder are you cramming under a 220 grain bullet? 30 grains of 3f only gives 850 or so feet per second with a 141 grain ball

[ItllKeal]

Do you know where I can purchase some of those. Thank you for your time

[ItllKeal]

I don't load past 27. It's a old gun and I carry it as a backup for my 50cal muzzleloader.

[ItllKeal]

You might be able to find one. Probably depends upon your chamber diameter.

Is the geometry of the cylinder and frame of your revolver going to give you a lot of leeway on boolit shapes you can get into position to seat into the chambers?
With the right dimensions you could choose from many different off the shelf molds.

Are the chambers of a diameter meeting or exceeding the barrel groove diameter?
Hollow bases may not be of benefit.

I would've never thought about that before having trouble with it and luckily for me they match perfectly in 5 of the cylinders. 1 is a micrometer larger not enough to see on the old-school mic I have but you can feel it. ALSO. My metallurgy skills are not very well at the moment so I'm not ready to start any casting just yet. I'm mainly looking to try them out first. Thanks again

[missionary5155]

Good afternoon
Sorry about the delay but work and so forth....
Hunting with an Uberti repro 1860 we use 3F Goex. Solid base FN our cast at home from 40-1. I am in Peru and away from my exact loading data so this is from my 71 year old memory.
Stated at 20 grains 3F and worked up until we got to 700+ fps with no more than 3" groups at 25 yards. We use one cereal box wad under the cast base. I think our final load was at 720 fps. Our final load is precompressed before seating the cast. We lube with Beeswax / Olive oil. Plus fill the space around the cast nose with lube after loading.
Again we hunt river bottoms and never have had to take a long shot over 20 yards. 10 -15 yards is the norm.
You will need to realize your revolver may not like a 220 grainer. Your revolver may not have the same tolerance to using 3F. Our cylinders have been reamed to equal diameters .001 over barrel groove. Cast are a tight cylinder diameter when loaded. Plus we do not shoot this load day after day. It is stout but we feel safe in our revolver. Our revolver will get fired with this load normally no more than 10 rounds per hunting season. 5 rounds to check zero and generally just one shot per corn cruncher. A few times 2 were fired.
If I thought I would need to shoot past 20 yards I would get out a Ruger Old Army. They will take much heavier loads and have longer cylinders.
Accurate Molds will make a custom mold to "perfect fit your revolver". Go to their web and take a look at .45-220w. Shortest 220 I know of.

[missionary5155]

Hello again
I just read you as yet do not cast.
I can recommend a feller out in Idaho who custom casts to our needs if possible. bullshop.freeforums.net
There are others and probably some members here.
I also read your later post about your revolver being "an older model". Is this an original old Colt ? If so stick with round balls and 2F. Get a new Pietta or Uberti for heavy loads.

[ItllKeal]

My gun is not a original 1860 Colt armybut it is a very rare BillEduards Italian 1957 repro. It's serial # is 9778. I don't load it heavy. I tried a 27 gr load once with a round ball and it functioned fine but I usually load 22 gr of xxx Pyro with 220gr Kaido "keith"style conicals or sometimes a .451 250gr hollow point traditions plinker round from a .50 cal sabot. It's weird but it works. My bore is.450 but I'm looking to get a remington 1858 target model for a real use. Thanks again

[ItllKeal]

Can you please send me his name and info. Thanks

[missionary5155]

Sent a Personal Message with the web address.

[ItllKeal]

Thank you.

[Castaway]

Itllkeal, unless your pistol has a brass frame, you’re not going to hurt your cap and ball stuffed to the max with black powder.

[Good Cheer]

As an illustration to address making boolits for percussion revolvers, this is an adjustable weight design developed from a .375 round ball mold for .36 caliber Pietta's. Don't have one for .44's. Not yet.
http://i.imgur.com/8frEPR2.jpg (https://imgur.com/8frEPR2)
It provides the positive shearing and seal needed. The spherical front provides the crevice around the perimeter to help retain lube. The cylindrical body slips into the chamber though being very close to the same diameter. It aligns itself in the chamber to assure the base is perpendicular to the bore. Adjustable weight allows you to try out multiple bullet weights to do whatever job is at hand, accuracy versus penetration. And, there's no reason you can't have both plain base and hollow base tips on the base plug.

[ItllKeal]

As an illustration to address making boolits for percussion revolvers, this is an adjustable weight design developed from a .375 round ball mold for .36 caliber Pietta's. Don't have one for .44's. Not yet.
http://i.imgur.com/8frEPR2.jpg (https://imgur.com/8frEPR2)
It provides the positive shearing and seal needed. The spherical front provides the crevice around the perimeter to help retain lube. The cylindrical body slips into the chamber though being very close to the same diameter. It aligns itself in the chamber to assure the base is perpendicular to the bore. Adjustable weight allows you to try out multiple bullet weights to do whatever job is at hand, accuracy versus penetration. And, there's no reason you can't have both plain base and hollow base tips on the base plug.

Where did you pick that up at I'd I may ask

[ItllKeal]

May I ask where you picked that up. Thanks again

[Good Cheer]

The work was done by Erik at hollowpointmold.com.

[ItllKeal]

The work was done by Erik at hollowpointmold.com.

Thanks again

[ItllKeal]

I spoke with Erick and he gave me a quote. Anyways , how is their quality

[warren5421]

ItllKeal your gun should be a direct copy of a 1860 Army made in Belgium before the Italian made guns started hitting the USA. All parts should exchange direct with a Colt 1860. I would use loads advised for the Colt 1860