Alloy frame on 5" 1911

[376Steyr]

In the flood of Black Friday internet ads, I spotted a deal on a full-size 1911 with an alloy frame. Said pistol was a "Kimber Custom LW Night Patrol 45 Auto (ACP) Luger (sic) 5in Black Pistol - 7+1 Rounds." Since I firmly believe in "Always yield to temptation, you may not get a second chance" I soon had one in my possession. Factory trigger pull was quite decent, surprisingly so, and when I field stripped it I was delighted to find it was not cursed with a firing pin safety system. Per my digital kitchen scale the assembled Kimber is six ounces lighter than an all-steel 1911 that I had laying about, but in the hand it feels even lighter.

Notes:
1. It comes with a full-length guide rod (heresy!) and the exposed edges of the recoil spring plug are sharp enough to make use of a bushing wrench (supplied) necessary.
2. The bushing to slide fit is the tightest I've ever found on a factory 1911. I needed the wrench to turn the bushing, and judicious use of a plastic mallet to remove it from the slide.
3. Barrel to bushing fit is more than adequate, with just a bit of "grab" as the bushing is pulled off.
4. The front strap is smooth, and seemed even slipperier than usual, perhaps due to the frame's black finish. I swapped the supplied Houge rubber stocks (which came in Cthulhu Green) for a set of Pachmayr wrap-around Combat grips, and now the pistol hangs on to me.
5. Barrel rifling terminates abruptly at the chamber mouth, as per current industry practice. I'll probably get this fixed.

What's it good for? Pretty much anything my full-size Commander (4 1/4 inch barrel) can do, this should do better. With a longer sight radius, extra weight at the front to hold down muzzle flip, and no worries about lost velocity from a shorter barrel, I'm expecting great things from this combination. I have an original Milt Sparks Summer Special IWB holster in a box someplace. I'm going to dig it out, find a can of plinking ammo, and get this critter broken in. :)

[contender1]

I have a few Kimber 1911's. My first one was a normal full sized one, and my second is a Ultra Compact. The Ultra has an alloy frame as well. I carry it daily,, and the finish doesn't hold up the best on the alloy. Kimber has offered to re-finish it, but I'm waiting until I feel I can let it be gone a while to do so.

My full sized Kimber,, well, it was a very nice feeling, tight & good looking gun. Novak sights. NIB purchase. First mag was fine,, but the second mag of ammo I immediately started having the hammer follow the slide issues. I fired about 60 rounds of mixed practice ammo, and it went back to Kimber. Apparently they had a problem with some of the castings of hammers & sears,, as they replaced them.
When it returned,, back to the range,, and while the hammer didn't follow the slide,, (at that time,) it was WAY off. At 25 yds,, I was getting good groups,,, BUT,, they were 10" low & 4" left. Now,, I shoot USPSA competition, and the ammo I was using at first was a mix of practice ammo. I switched to my match ammo, and it did the same thing. 10" low & 4" left. NOT GOOD.
A few calls to Kimber,, a new barrel & bushing,, and still the same problem. THEN,, at about 300-325 rounds,, the hammer followed the slide again. Talk about an unhappy camper,, and spent some serious time on the phone with Kimber. I finally gave up getting the answers I was seeking,, so I had the gun slide milled & all to install an adjustable rear sight, and matched up a fiber optic front. Plus,, I had a custom fitted hammer & sear installed.
Since that time,, that gun has not had a single hick-up,, shot hundreds of matches, shoots to center, and is a fine handgun. But the initial build,, left a bit to be desired.
Now, my Ultra Compact,,, out of the box new,, and it shoots to point of aim, hasn't given me any issues, (except for the finish wear,) and as I mentioned,, is my daily CCW handgun. Did I mention I actually won the Compact at a Friends of the NRA event? I spent $130 on a live auction item,, and got a ticket on the Kimber. I was drawn for the win for the Ultra. I figured it was Karma for the first issues I'd had with Kimber.

[DougGuy]

5. Barrel rifling terminates abruptly at the chamber mouth, as per current industry practice. I'll probably get this fixed.

It's really annoying that this trend caught on industry wide. Used to be every 45ACP barrel you see for a 1911 had some freebore in the throat before the rifling.

Officially, SAAMI drawings show the leade ins to the rifling running right down to the chamber mouth so they can't say it's not within SAAMI specs, as the drawings specify a 2 degree 35min angle to the leade ins (which is actually fairly abrupt as this results in a 5 degree included angle). And then right there next to this figure, is listed .4520"-.0030" for jacketed bullets, and .4530"-.0030" for lead boolits.

We all know that the specified OAL cannot be met with .452" and .453" boolits, so that is a direct conflict of mathematical dimensions describing an impossibility to achieve both dimensions listed, at the stated OAL.

SAAMI was formed in 1926, and I personally have not seen a 45 caliber 1911 barrel with no freebore older than the last 20 or so years. They may exist, but I have not seen even one example. All those older barrels had some bit of freebore before the leade ins, and we never had failures to go into battery because the boolits were jammed into the lands unless it was operator error at the loading bench. I just don't get it.

[RJM52]

Found a Kimber Stainless Lightweight in 9mm a few months ago...didn't look like it had ever been fired. Have only had the chance to fire it a couple of times but the accuracy is great. The trigger pull was crisp but a tad heavy at 5#...had a local smith bump it to just under 4#...

Nice gun with nice balance...Bob

[Bmi48219]

…My full sized Kimber,, well, it was…… I finally gave up getting the answers I was seeking,, so I had the gun slide milled & all to install an adjustable rear sight, and matched up a fiber optic front. Plus,, I had a custom fitted hammer & sear installed.
Since that time,, that gun has not had a single hick-up,, shot hundreds of matches, shoots to center, and is a fine handgun. But the initial build,, left a bit to be desired.

contender1, you’ve got a heart of gold. I’d have sworn off Kimbers forever if that happened to me.
IMO Kimber used to be a reasonably affordable, quality 1911. About the time they got real popular (and started jacking up prices), the quality I liked them for started sliding.
No way they could have test fired it after fitting a new barrel and bushing without noticing 10 inches low.
Glad you caught a break with the Ultra Compact, you deserved it.

[contender1]

Thanks for the kind words. Here's a bit more to the story.
Initially for my troubles,, with the hammer following the slide,, when discussing things with Kimber,, they offered to send me a couple of free mags for my troubles & shipping expenses.
When the gun returned,, no mags. So, I contacted them,, and was told; "Look under the foam padding in the case." well, I did, and no mags,,, BUT,,, I did find the old set of hammer & sear parts,, WITH a note. It said; "Customer modified parts, should pay for repairs." I was actually on the phone when I found this. I about blew a fuse. I firmly, yet politely told the guy in NO uncertain terms that I had NOT touched the parts prior to using the gun or anything. He calmed me down saying to ignore the note & promptly shipped me the mags.
About 2 years later,, at SHOT,, I went to the Kimber booth,, and found the guy I'd dealt with. He remembered me,, and explained that Kimber had gotten a "bad batch of parts where the metal wasn't properly heat treated." I said; "That explains the crappy hammers & sears,, now what about the seriously low/left issue?" He had no excuse. I told him what I had done to the gun to PROPERLY fix the issue. Adjustable sights took care of things. It still cost me an additional $150 for the gun to have them done. But,, that gun is actually very dependable now,, and has many thousands of rounds through it since I corrected their mistakes.

[376Steyr]

Up to now, I've avoided Kimbers. About 15 years ago, after waiting years until I could afford a Kimber, I was standing at the gun counter getting ready to plunk down $1200 on one of their compact variants. Then I (with the salesman's permission) dry-fired it and found it had the grittiest, heaviest trigger pull I had ever encountered on a 1911. I wasn't just disappointed; I was insulted by it. I remember thinking "If they can't get the trigger right on this expensive gun, what else is wrong with it?" I handed the pistol back to the clerk and walked away. Was it just one bad apple? Maybe, but it cost Kimber 15 years worth of potential sales to me.

[charlie b]

I would just hope they use a different alloy than Colt did on their LW Commander. The frame is really nice for carry, but, it is basically worn out for range duty. I keep it cause it is nice to carry and shoots well enough for EDC. If I want to shoot a lot at the range I get out my steel frame 1911. It is a bit 'tight' but shoots little groups. It will also start to jam up on one of our windy/sandstorm days.

Sent from my SM-P580 using Tapatalk

[Green Frog]

A light weight aluminum alloy frame on a full size gun is an interesting concept. Over 30 years ago I built one on a frame then available called the “Ranger”. I played with it for a short time, both as a 45 and as a 9mm (by changing ejectors and slide/barrel assemblies). It worked reliably and presented no immediate problems, but as with many of my projects in those days, I quickly tired of it and went on to other things, so I can’t comment on long term reliability. That said, I wouldn’t plan on campaigning any light weight handgun long and hard. YMMV.

FYI, I started a thread on this forum within the last six months. It might be worth your time to look it up. Also, on a more positive note, somebody (perhaps Skeeter?) did a 10,000 round durability test on a light weight Commander in 45 ACP IN THE ‘70s or early ‘80s and it “survived” but was showing wear, IIRC.

Froggie

[DougGuy]

I will offer one more opinion on Kimber. Based on barrels that have come into my shop, I saw ONE with a super nice highly polished throat.

The others that have come in for throating have been on an even par with Para USA barrels. Not much of a compliment but truth be known, there it is.

[RJM52]

"FYI, I started a thread on this forum within the last six months. It might be worth your time to look it up. Also, on a more positive note, somebody (perhaps Skeeter?) did a 10,000 round durability test on a light weight Commander in 45 ACP IN THE ‘70s or early ‘80s and it “survived” but was showing wear, IIRC."

I remember that article and may still have it around here somewhere....as to "wear" it cracked the frame right above the slide release pin hole...but kept right on running.

Coltalloy, according to shooting guru Chuck Tayor, was a alloy of aluminum and titanium. Taylor shot almost nothing but 1911s and said he saw more cracked steel frames in his time than aluminum. Have no clue if Colt is still using the same alloy but my 1952 Commander in .38 Super has pushing 10K rounds in the 27 years it was carried every day and after 7K rounds still made a one ragged hole ten round group at 10 yards.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/gallery/80/full/56921.jpg


As to Kimbers...bought a .38 Super ProCarry HD when they first came out...could never get it to run. Sold it to a friend who knew of the problems and he wanted to see it he could make it run...after it became apparent there was something way out of spec he shipped it back to the factory who destroyed the gun and sent him a brand new one...this one runs fine...

Besides the 9mm lightweight I just bought, have had a Stainless Target II since 2003...ZERO issues. Bought one just like it in 10mm about 5 years ago and ZERO issues... Turned them into multi-caliber guns and no matter what barrel or slide were on them...zero issues.

https://www.1911forum.com/threads/four-caliber-stii.777762/

As to a bargain...Kimber came out with a 10mm long slide Stainless Target Series I gun without the firing pin safety...before the crud hit they were selling for $900 on the auction sites... I picked up a used LNIB one for $750 locally...it rings an 8" gong at 100 yards...that's the same price one usually pays for a RIA....

And every manufacturer has guns that should have never passed inspection...it is how they take care of the problem is what counts...

Bob

[MostlyLeverGuns]

I've been carry/shooting an aluminum ParaOrd P14/45 since the 80's, thousands of rounds, 'cheap/bulk' ball or 200gr SWC/5.5gr HP38 with a few +p 230 Corbon. Still my first pick for back country, no problems with the lightweight alloy frame, even with the alloy frame, a 1911 gets heavy with 14 230's loaded.

[Don Purcell]

RJM52, I remember Chuck Taylor telling about the Lightweight Commander and if memory serves either he or a friend of his had a Lightweight that was bumping 30,000 rounds and still going but that was probably 35 years ago.

[Noah Zark]

Several years ago in a semi-local fun shop I found a used blued steel Kimber Custom II TLE with 3-dot sights for what seemed a particularly low price for a used 1911. I gave it a thorough going over and was even permitted to disassemble it for inspection. I found no causes for alarm and purchased it.

The Kimber turned out to be a solid performer at the range, producing nice, tight groups with flawless reliability. Two things happened; I had decided to downsize to several Dan Wesson and Colt Competition Stainless 1911s in 45, 38 Super, and 9mm, and I let a friend who was thinking about a 1911 45 shoot the Kimber. He did VERY well with it, and hounded me to part with it. Since it was superfluous to the DWs and Colts, it went to its new home, where it continues to please my friend with its performance.

Noah