311008 works for deer too!

[ElCheapo]

Last season I shot a doe with a 170 grain Lyman 311041. The bullet went behind the left front leg and out the far shoulder, dropping the deer instantly. I thought I might develop a load with the 120 grain Lyman 311008 that would be effective on deer and not bruise my girlfriend's shoulder. After some load development I settled on 18.5 grains of AA#9 with a Rem. 9 1/2 primer and a PC'd 311008 for slightly over 2200 fps in my Marlin 336. Accuracy was 1 1/2 to 2 inches at 100 yards, and POI was the same as my 170 grainers.

Fast forward to last Thursday. I spied a small buck bedded under some pines at around 75 yards. Taking a rest, I was able to pick a spot on his shoulder as low as I dared and sent a 311008 his way. At the shot the deer flipped over on his back with his legs in the air, then rolled onto his side. After a few seconds he tried to stand up but only his back legs were working. I thought about shooting again, but his back legs soon collapsed. He struggled a few more seconds and then remained still. As I approached him I could see the bullet hole exactly where I had aimed. I field dressed him and discovered that due to the angle he was lying at I had only hit one lung. No doubt if I had been able to hit both lungs he would have expired more quickly. I hung him up in the barn until today, and after work I got busy removing the hide.

I was expecting to find the bullet inside the deer somewhere, but such was not the case. I found the 120 grain bullet had gone straight through both shoulders, leaving utter devastation in it's wake. Holes through the shoulders were impressive, with chunks of broken bone and thumb sized holes through the meat. Entrance hole in the hide was about 3/4 inch, and the exit hole on the other side was a half inch. I was impressed! Not a large deer, but with limited time to hunt during our peak season at work I was thankful for the meat. I feel this load is entirely adequate for deer at woods ranges, and recoil is light.

I have yet to recover my cast bullets from an animal, and I'm not sure if I'm getting any expansion with my PC'd COWW alloy, but I like the results I'm getting on game! :mrgreen:

[todd9.3x57]

congrats!!!!!!!

[Camba]

Good shooting.
Thank you for the narrative and data.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[GooseGestapo]

I’ve got the Gaschecked version of that bullet.
Works great in .32H&R mag up to .30/06.
Also Lee 113gr FN version.
I’ll have to give them a try.
32.0gr of RL15 runs them @ 2,200fps!

[Winger Ed.]

Before casting for rifles- I'd always loaded SP from Nosler, Sierra, and Hornady.
The first deer I shot with a cast .30 cal 170RN, I was amazed at the wound channel.

Then I realized why all those rifles made for quickly killing dangerous African game animals were all RN or FP.

[BunkTheory]

Before casting for rifles- I'd always loaded SP from Nosler, Sierra, and Hornady.
The first deer I shot with a cast .30 cal 170RN, I was amazed at the wound channel.

Then I realized why all those rifles made for quickly killing dangerous African game animals were all RN or FP.

And i realized first time i watched Ghost and the Darkness, that most of those big game rifles fired projectiles that had the same ballistics as some anti tank rifles from world war one, and had the same impact energy as yugo hitting a brick wall at 30mph

[ElCheapo]

These bullets were water quenched out of the mold and then PC'd, which lowers the hardness to around 10 or 11 BHN. I could also make up some with half COWW and half pure lead, but I wanted to test for expansion with the PC'd COWW bullets. I don't think I got much if any expansion, even after hitting bone.

[William Yanda]

IF....the goal is less kick, why not explore lower velocity with the same boolet?

[kbstenberg]

Bullet placement is the important concern.
That said. Just my 2 cents. My concern with a lighter weight bullet. Is that the impact is less with lower weight bullets.

[kbstenberg]

Bullet placement is the important concern.
That said. Just my 2 cents. My concern with a lighter weight bullet. Is that the impact is less with lower weight bullets.
I agree with the last post. Tailor the bullet to a slower velocity.

[ElCheapo]

Been there, done that. No thanks. You do get a reduction in recoil, but different velocities give you different points of impact. So you have to re-sight in your gun every time you want to use a different load. That's why I settled on 2200 fps. Both my 120 and 170 grain bullets hit the same place. Two recoil levels but the same POI. Much better IMHO.

[ElCheapo]

Bullet placement is the important concern.
That said. Just my 2 cents. My concern with a lighter weight bullet. Is that the impact is less with lower weight bullets.
I agree with the last post. Tailor the bullet to a slower velocity.

Not really. My starting loads with the 170 grain bullets were 1800 fps, and even at that velocity they have more recoil than the 120 grainers at 2200+. I would need to go slower than that to get the same felt recoil, and there is no way they would excede or even equal the "impact" of a bullet going in excess of 2200 fps. Ask yourself if you would rather get hit by a fastball delivered by your kid or by Nolan Ryan. Of course that's not a valid comparison because the difference in velocity between the two bullets would be over 400 fps, but hopefully you get the point.

Given equal velocity, the heavier bullet will give you more penetration assuming they are made of the same alloy. Whether that's useful on a whitetail deer is up for debate. I have used both and gotten nearly identical results (complete penetration and very quick death of the animal).

I was very pleased with the penetration and killing power of the 311008, but with a sample size of only one there is definitely room for more testing. Still, initial results were very promising.

[Mk42gunner]

I can't really say I'm surprised the 311008 killed a deer. Whitetail deer really aren't hard to kill, as long as you hit them right. I am a bit surprised that it went through both shoulders and exited.

Even more interesting is that you have two widely differing weights with similar POA/POI. I may have to try this myself.

Robert

[dverna]

Good write up and data.

I read somewhere that RN and FP bullets are used against large dangerous game because they are less likely to veer off course as they penetrate large bones and deep into flesh/muscle. I cannot confirm or deny...others may be able to. In any case, the stories my friends tells about hunting dangerous game in Africa a couple of times have always ended with shots at ranges under 100 yards...thus the ballistic advantage of pointy bullets is moot anyway. BTW, having seen a few “marksmen” shoot offhand, I imagine a prudent PH would not risk a wounding shot by his client at too far a distance while his anus is too puckered up to pass even an uncooked stick of spaghetti.

[725]

Good for you on an ethical kill. I like your reasoning and your success. A skillful hunter / shooter can do more with less if mature patience is applied. Passing on a less than perfect shot is a test! I had the great good fortune to go the Africa years ago and I took my .308. I got the scoffing advise that my "lady's" gun wasn't enough gun, but everything I shot died with one round, and all those were DRT except the warthog. He ran a good 50 yards. It even went all the way through a massive eland. Your light weight bullet does the trick.

[cwlongshot]

Good job! Not surprised at all. Plus you have surpassed the second velocity point and much better results occur. Generally I like my cast 1800 ish max as I generally have easier time finding a good accurate loading. I am satisfied with preformance at this velocity. But 2200 is better no doubt!

All around good job!! Merry Christmas

CW

[ElCheapo]

Good job! Not surprised at all. Plus you have surpassed the second velocity point and much better results occur. Generally I like my cast 1800 ish max as I generally have easier time finding a good accurate loading. I am satisfied with preformance at this velocity. But 2200 is better no doubt!

All around good job!! Merry Christmas

CW

Thanks! The 311008 has a nice big meplat. An oldie but a goodie!
https://www.tdpri.com/media/20211214_181704.47924/full

[19112TAP]

I load the 31133 HP PC which is just the HP version in my 30-30 and have had great success in the 1700 to 1800 range. The accuracy I get is great and the performance has been good on deer, even with a HP the pedals will peel off as I have found some pieces in the wound cavity but I still get complete pass threw on the deer I have shoot and the wound channel is pretty impressive.

[missionary5155]

Good afternoon and Congratulations !!
Seeing a bedded corn cruncher in the pines says alot about your hunting abilities. And it all paid off.
I will take a FN cast any day.

[ElCheapo]

Good afternoon and Congratulations !!
Seeing a bedded corn cruncher in the pines says alot about your hunting abilities. And it all paid off.
I will take a FN cast any day.

Thank you, and I totally agree. What I have experienced using FN cast bullets in my Marlin 1894C in 357 mag, and now the 336 in 30-30 has convinced me they are the deadliest bullets available. If your bullet has a good sized meplat expansion is unnecessary.

[skeettx]

Speed kills, well done, well done
Great postings
Mike