Big Bore Calibers

[ILostMyGoat]

Hey everyone,
First time posting and I hope this is the right spot.. I am searching for some advice and insight on a new big bore, straight wall, lever rifle cartridge. I will be casting, and reloading for this caliber with the main purpose of hunting. I am from the north east where straight wall cartridges are legal so that’s my interest in this style. I’m open to any cartridges that meet the requirements above. When marlin finally starts releasing the new rifles I plan on purchasing one. What are y’all’s advice on what specific caliber? 1-Reloading components variety?
2- Casting components variety?
3- Best ballistic choice? (Max max would be 200 yds)
4- I don’t want to get something so unheard of I can’t find any ammunition or components but also I don’t want to get the average run of the caliber.
5- Absolutely any other insight you would like to offer to assist with a decision.
Thank you guys and I look forward to talking with y’all.



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[cwtebay]

Welcome to the forum!!
I am quite sure that you will get a plethora of answers on this subject!
As far as straight walled, I am drawn to the 45-90 in the 1886 Winchester. I see that you are hunting the NE US so it could handle everything that is available there to hunt. I like this cartridge over the 45-70 because it is a bit less run of the mill, and offers performance enough to be impressive. It does give up a little in the category of bullet choices.
I really like the 405 WCF in the 1895 Winchester because of the awesome power and range of loads that can be safely handled in that platform - from pistol weight screamers to 400gr solids.
But I don't know if it qualifies as straight walled in every state.

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[gumbo333]

Get a Henry 45/70. Really a nice lever gun. You can load mouse fart loads that are great for rabbits or squirrel to loads for bison, moose and grizz. Those mouse fart loads can be extremely accurate and addictive for little $$$. I'll never shoot a bison, moose or grizz but I'm ready. Really fun whitetail rifle, little noise, little recoil. Might pop a coyote or fox too.

[Winger Ed.]

I'm a big .45-70 fan.
200 yards with it is no big deal once you learn the drop rate and are good at ranging it.

Its got plenty of power for anything you'll see up there.
In the Black Powder days--- When the Army was considering buying it and the trapdoor Springfield,
their research proved it could accurately and consistently take a man off a horse at 1,000 yards.

I've killed a few deer with my Marlin at 100-ish yards.
None took another step, and with a 405FP, it leaves a wound channel about the size of a baseball.

[brass410]

wishin for a 38-55 to go with its big brother 45-70, both straight walls and capable at 200yds, can beloaded with the black magic or choke choke new fangled smokeless (probably be obsolete by the time I get done typing) OH yes and availible in lever action

[Wheelguns 1961]

Does your state have a case length limit? Mine does, and it makes the 45-70 illegal. The 45-70 is great, but if you have a case length limit, the 44 magnum would be a good choice.

[Bazoo]

444 marlin. Uses 44 mag bullets, and specific 444 marlin bullets. It is just odd enough but sometimes available as factory, when times are normal.

[gwpercle]

I would vote for the 45-70 ...lots of information , load data , boolit moulds that have been proven , cases are available .
My number 2 choice would be 38-55 ... less recoil but still a fair amount of proven data , moulds and cases .
Both of these have taken their fair share of game and would be fun to work with .
Gary

[Cast_outlaw]

44 mag and 444 marlin are both modern cartridges 444 fits the obscure but available category but a 44 mag in a rifle and with cast it seams to be a match in power with the 444 another option would be 45 long colt

[45-70 Chevroner]

My vote would be for the 38-55. Case's are plentiful and molds for it made by almost all mold companys. It is plenty powerful enough for anything you will encounter in the lower 48. I have a Marlin Cowboy with a 25" octagon barrel. It loves loads from mouse fart to teeth rattling.

[GregLaROCHE]

For what you want, the 45/70 cartridge is at the top of the list. I like the idea of 45/90 and may get one some day, but if you want to find ready to shoot ammo, you want a 45/70. I can tell you from experience, that a 45/70 will kill a big grisly, even with trapdoor loads. They used to be the only thing available on a shelf.

[Bad Ass Wallace]

L to R 38/55, 40/65, 45/70, 50/70 and 577 Snider (with 22 Hornet for comparison)

https://i.imgur.com/0b7mFCpl.jpg

Any of these would suit your requirements!

[charlie b]

What are you used to? The bigger cartridges can kick like a mule in a light hunting rifle. Yes, they can be loaded to pipsqueak and anything in between, but, then you are shooting at .44mag or .45 Colt levels. So, why not just go with a .44mag like suggested above. .357Maximum would be a nice alternative as well. Plenty of power for a 200yd shot.

If you don't mind the heavy recoil, then by all means, get one of the old black powder cartridges and load it up with smokeless.

If you want different, then it just depends on what you can find.

[tmanbuckhunter]

I'm a 45/70 guy thru and thru, and will get into a fist fight with someone over the virtues of the 45/70 cartridge. With that being said though, the 444 Marlin has an edge and stands out in one aspect, ballistics. You can still shoot a 300-350gr bullet as long as your rifle will cycle it, at roughly the same speeds a 45/70 could shove a 300-350gr bullet. The longer .432 bullet will have a higher BC, shoot flatter, and buck the wind better. I also find my 444 has much less felt recoil than my three 1895's with comparable bullet weights and velocity, and I don't know why. The only 45/70's I own that I can comfortably shoot 60+ times in a day now is my trapdoor and my CPA 44-1/2.

If Ruger re-releases the Marlin XLR line especially in 444, I will be first in line.

[ABJ]

All the above suggestion's will work as well as 350 Legend. for simplicity the 44 mag or 45-70 guns are plentiful and will have lots of choices from different mfgs. If you want to send big for caliber bullets to long distances the 45-70 or 38-55. If you just want an easy to cast, load and shoot the 44 mag. The 44 mag can also be downloaded very easy to 44 special velocities with lighter boolits.
Tony

[Wayne Smith]

For shooting in the NE the 44Mag or 357 Mag or Max will do all you need. Put one of these in a single shot rifle and challenge yourself. With the 44 Mag or 357 Mag you can get a companion revolver as well.

[MOA]

Get a 38-55 and never look back.

[murf205]

What are you going to hunt with the new rifle? How far are your average shots going to be? I am in the same camp with the non mainstream cartridges but you better check the availability of brass, and suitable powder.

[murf205]

What are you going to hunt with the new rifle? How far are your average shots going to be? I am in the same camp with the non mainstream cartridges but you better check the availability of brass, and suitable powder. By the way, if you decide on a 44 mag, the Henry's have a very desirable 1-20" twist rate.

[murf205]

What are you going to hunt with the new rifle? How far are your average shots going to be? I am in the same camp with the non mainstream cartridges but you better check the availability of brass, and suitable powder. By the way, if you decide on a 44 mag, the Henry's have a very desirable 1-20" twist rate. Apologies for the double post

[Bigslug]

At the moment, it looks like the new Ruger/Marlins will be .45-70, with .30-30 to follow. The 1894 in .357 and .44 - - maybe .45C - - would likely be next. The excellent but less mainstream .38-55? Who knows when, if ever?

.45-70 is common, easy, and extremely capable with a lot of options that range "from tactical to nuclear"

[Frosty Boolit]

I use a 45/70 and I love it! Sometimes I start daydreaming about a .375 Winchester and flatter trajectories though. I'm not 100% sure but I think that's nearly the same thing as the .38/55

[MOA]

I use a 45/70 and I love it! Sometimes I start daydreaming about a .375 Winchester and flatter trajectories though. I'm not 100% sure but I think that's nearly the same thing as the .38/55

Yes. The 375 and the 38-55 are very similar. The 375 is much higher in pressure. They say you can shoot a 38-55 in the 375 Winchester if you could chamber it but I think the 375 chamber is too short. But if you shoot a 375 Winchester in the 38-55 bad things will happen.

[alamogunr]

Quite awhile back, Paco Kelly wrote an article that included the .375 Win. He used 38-55 brass because he could get more powder in the case due to thinner brass thickness. Also, he mentioned something about case length. I don't remember much else about the article.

The only thing I remember for sure about Paco's articles was that he liked to push the envelope.

[MostlyLeverGuns]

I'd go with the 45-70. In today's world a Henry unless I found a Marlin at a good price, 2ND choice - 444 Marlin, Marlin and Winchester 94's are out there, I've got an early Marlin(no button safety). I like the 45-70 better for elk but with the right bullet the 444 is good also, little difference on deer/black bear. My 444 1-38 twist is very accurate with 300 grain bullets at 2100 fps. 38-55 or .375 Win is the next step down, both good with boolits. Handgun cartridges - beyond 100 yards I would pick a 44 Mag or 45 Colt. The 45-70 and 444 are solid 200 yards plus cartridges, maybe the 375 Win and 38-55, past 150 yards the 44 Mag and 45 Colt are a stretch. Starline makes good 444 brass but in backorder right now.

[white eagle]

45-70 is an obvious choice then there is the 444 Marlin( which I am in the process of acquiring )
handle anything the world has to offer the 50 Alaskan would be a fine choice
to many to list and the list is extensive
maybe a 405 Winchester trips yer trigger

[OFFSHORE]

As mentioned above. . .you haven't said if you are in the 1.8" case length area or not. That being said. . .the 45/70 Govt. and 444 Marlin are AWESOME cartridges and will be tough to beat - IF - you can use the cartridge length. You also did not say if you're willing to wildcat or not. . .if so, the sky is the limit! If you are going after factory or common loadings the 445 Super Mag, 44 Mag, 350 Legend, 357 Maximum are all great whitetail cartridges, but for the 200 yd. mark I would stick with the 445 SM and 350 Legend in the heavy bullet weights. Cast bullets will be your best friends in what you are seeking. Many rifle choices out there from Marlin, T/C, Winchester, Henry, Ruger and custom shops. . .research and take your pick. Good luck and happy hunting.

[Jeffrey]

I like my 444 Marlin. It and the 45-70 are so close ballistically that the target won't know the difference. A quick check at Midway USA shows 45-70 ammo available, 444 Marlin not available. If I were in the market, ammo availability would be a determining factor.

[MOA]

I'm still sold on 45-90. Then you could shoot either 45-70 or 45-90.

[shootinfox2]

293326 Enough said!

[charlie b]

Roflmao

[Cast10]

Welcome to the forum!!
I am quite sure that you will get a plethora of answers on this subject!
As far as straight walled, I am drawn to the 45-90 in the 1886 Winchester. I see that you are hunting the NE US so it could handle everything that is available there to hunt. I like this cartridge over the 45-70 because it is a bit less run of the mill, and offers performance enough to be impressive. It does give up a little in the category of bullet choices.
I really like the 405 WCF in the 1895 Winchester because of the awesome power and range of loads that can be safely handled in that platform - from pistol weight screamers to 400gr solids.
But I don't know if it qualifies as straight walled in every state.

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How’s the recoil on that rifle/caliber?

[MOA]

How’s the recoil on that rifle/caliber?

Since I believe in this case we are mainly speaking about the 45-90 it's not a round commonly found on the shelf of your local sporting goods store this will be a handloaded cartridge. You can load a 45-90 with less recoil than a 45-70 standard velocity cartridge or I can load a 45-70 hotter than a standard 45-90 velocity with subsequent heavy recoil. Load it hot or not.

Load it as hot as you can handle or need for your required need while keeping accuracy in mind.

[pworley1]

The 375 Winchester is a pleasure to shoot, and will get the job done.

[cwtebay]

How’s the recoil on that rifle/caliber?Recoil is pretty stout when you shoot full house loads with the curved buttplate. Using a Limb Saver slip on makes it downright pleasant though. I tend to load most all of my big game caliber rifles with both full hunting loads and then plinking / small game loads.

What I find very odd is that the new 1886's are / were available in 45-90 but yet Winchester did not manufacture new ammunition for the chambering. I can only surmise that it's to reduce the liability of using new manufactured ammunition in original 86's - but I obviously don't know that for sure.
After I get through with my 50-70 and 44 American project I am replenishing my 45-90 stock and will try and post some video of my sons shooting it.

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[DougGuy]

The Ruglins are getting GREAT reviews, and as said in numerous ways in this thread, the 45-70 does it ALL, Components and load data are easy to find, affordable, and you got the Ruger customer service which IS the best in the industry. Plus, they are made in Mayodan, NORTH CAROLINA!

[fredj338]

In a modern lever gun, I think the 45-70 is hard to beat. Cheaper brass, good ballistics to 200y. I have a Marlin GG, 2x ler scope, very accurate to 200y, about as far as I would push that.

[jonp]

If your from the far North East like I am and moose with bear is in the picture at the ranges you might expect I can't disagree with a 45-70

[jonp]

"maybe a 405 Winchester trips yer trigger"

It sure does mine. Teddy's Big Medicine is one of my grails

[Doog-Meister]

Have a few .45-70's

The Marlin 1895 shooting 400 gr J-word projectiles at 1750 fps is deadly accurate, and responsible for a couple of elk. However, that much punch is brutal on the shoulder at the range.
HR1871 and a sharps that shoot 400, 450, and 500 gr boolits equally well. Being a single-shot is not limiting. Hit something soundly and you don't have to worry about a 2nd shot anyway.

For more pleasurable shooting, get a .38-55 and use the Lyman 375449 mould.

[1006]

If I did not already have a 375Winchester, I would check out the 450 Bushmaster fired from the Ruger American Ranch bolt action. I do not believe there is cheaper solution with the same capability. Plink with 45ACP slugs, hunt with 250 grain bullets at 2200FPS from a 16 inch barrel—according to my Hornady Load Manual.

[Daekar]

If this will be a dedicated hunting rifle that's not going to pull double-duty as a plinker, then 45-70 is a no-brainer as long as it's legal where you want to hunt. With the right components you can balance performance and recoil so you don't get beaten up by it. 444 Marlin is a great alternative but is less common, and might be lower on Ruger's list of production priorities as they get the lever gun line up to speed.

If you're going to use this as a fun gun in addition to hunting, I would get a 357mag or 44mag. You can load both with lighter bullets and lower velocities for plinking ammo and the 357 in particular will be cheaper per round. 357 is also easier to find a diversity of companion revolvers in than the 44mag, but it might not knock down a deer with as much authority.

[veeman]

I'm a big fan of my 1876 in 50/95 wcf, 350gr FN with a case full of black powder. Big Smoke, Big Boom, Big Smile!