Casting A Song Dog

[Johnch]

Just after dark my cats came to me to protect them
As I could hear a Coyote calling behind my house

So I grabbed the AR15 , a 20 round mag loaded with ammo , a mouse squeak call and a challenge coyote call and headed to the ditch line

A 1/4 mile walk in the cold air

I had just gotten dropped into the shallow dry ditch when I heard a coyote call about 400 yards away
Either in dad's woods or close to the edge of it

So I made sure the Pulsar Thermal scope was on and on 3X
Racked the bolt to load a round and took a few deep breaths
I then as quite as possibly put the bipod onto the ground just out of the grass along the ditch facing the woods
I looked , but couldn't see any warm spots
But there is tall weeds and grass all along the East side of the woods to hide a coyote or it could be in the woods

So I blew on the coyote challenge call and looked again
For 20 or so seconds nothing
But then at about the North end of the woods I saw something warm heading my way

It was a Coyote and it was headed right at me
I had the Lee C225-55-RF cast out of Lino , powder coated and GC ed in Winchester 223 cases , Rem 7 1/2 primers and IMR 4895 powder
Loaded at just over 2400 FPS
Not the load I had planed on using for coyote , but that load was what the rifle & scope were sighted in with
So I knew had to be sure to make a good shot as there was a good chance the first shot was the only one that would be moving slow or stopped

Well when the coyote got to about 100 yards I blew softly on the mouse squeak call
As I hoped the coyote would stop at about 100 yards out as the rifle saw sighted 1" high at 100 yards

Well the coyote did stop at about 75 yards and turned slightly
I held about 1"... maybe 2" or so over the belly line and aimed at the shoulder on my side

At the shot I lost sight of the coyote for a second
But I quickly found it again in the scope , flopping on the ground
Most likely about right where it was when I pulled the trigger

I had bagged a nice adult male coyote
The bullet had hit about right on the front leg bone / shoulder joint
A nice 22 cal hole in and a slight ragged exit hole , so I am guessing the bullet may have started to tumble

I will skin it out in the morning
Then flesh & stretch the hide , unless my friend I hunt with has time to do it as he is a LOT quicker than I am
Not sure what the hide will be worth , but I am trying to control the coyote population if I can

I am guessing this was the local male coyote
So the female will have to find a new mate , unless I get a chance to harvest her also

John

[cwtebay]

Nice work!!! Gotta love the thermal!

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[Three44s]

The mate will be coming around and in its grief can give you even used odds on harvesting her as well.

Coyotes in that situation issue what is known as the “lost mate call”.

Three44s

[PaulG67]

Well done John

[CastingFool]

Good job! Loved the story! I know there are coyotes around my place, I've shot 2 while deer hunting, but no way to shoot them in the dark

[Silvercreek Farmer]

Good work!

[popper]

How well do you like the thermal scope? ATN or Pulsar I've been looking at. Got a BO that would like it I think.

[memtb]

Nice.....Congrats! One of the many benefits of “living with the animals”......as in, “not” in a city! :bigsmyl2: memtb

[Johnch]

How well do you like the thermal scope? ATN or Pulsar I've been looking at. Got a BO that would like it I think.

I like it
At the 400 yards the coyote was just a warm spot in the scope
Closer , I can see all the details well
The main body is the warmest , but I could see the legs just fine

I bought the Thermal scope for hog night hunting , coyote and crop damage deer hunting
I still need to do some Hog hunting with the scope , but the other 2 it has worked great

John

[popper]

What model did you get?

[Johnch]

What model did you get?

Pulsar XM30 3-13x

I got it used for just over $1400
But it looked to have never been mounted into rings
So as for right now I feel I got a deal ( Hope )

John

[missionary5155]

Good morning and Congratulations !
That was a good read and I appreciate your time typing it up. Another good yote has gone along the singing trail.

[cherokeetracker]

Good shooting John. WTG

[Johnch]

I was told today that a Male and Female Coyote were killed by another local farmer
He called me to see if I wanted them to skin out for the hides ...YES I did

He owns a farm along the same creek that is on the far side of Dad's woods
About a mile up stream on the other side of the creek
He told me he saw them just after first light , hunting in his CPR ground along the creek line
So he drove the tractor into the CPR field hoping to get close
He said he got to about 60 yards from them when the coyotes stopped and looked at him on the tractor

He told me 3" Federal Premium #4 Buckshot out of his 11/87 took care of them
I skinned them out
3 pellets hit the male and 2 hit the female coyote , not sure if he shot 1 or 2 times
Not idea of what choke he had in the 11/87
But my #4 buckshot reloads pattern better IMO

But still at 60 yards 1 #4 buckshot pellet hit each of them in the lungs

John

[wmitty]

I love coyote stories with happy endings. They ate my cat several years back, and I have not forgiven them.

[Smoke4320]

Congrats. The only good coyote is a dead coyote

[Three44s]

+10!

Three44s

[Thin Man]

wmitty, my story is exactly the same as yours. Our cat is gone but the pain remains. If I were in the woods and saw a yote and a 12-point buck in the same view, I would give the buck a free pass.

[Grayone]

I was told today that a Male and Female Coyote were killed by another local farmer
He called me to see if I wanted them to skin out for the hides ...YES I did

He owns a farm along the same creek that is on the far side of Dad's woods
About a mile up stream on the other side of the creek
He told me he saw them just after first light , hunting in his CPR ground along the creek line
So he drove the tractor into the CPR field hoping to get close
He said he got to about 60 yards from them when the coyotes stopped and looked at him on the tractor

He told me 3" Federal Premium #4 Buckshot out of his 11/87 took care of them
I skinned them out
3 pellets hit the male and 2 hit the female coyote , not sure if he shot 1 or 2 times
Not idea of what choke he had in the 11/87
But my #4 buckshot reloads pattern better IMO

But still at 60 yards 1 #4 buckshot pellet hit each of them in the lungs

John

Good that the damage was minimal but enough to put them on the ground. Up close and personal with a shotty can leave them a ragged mess. Good thread!

[fatnhappy]

One of the places I hunt is a friend’s organic dairy farm.

If you spot a coyote and don’t immediately make an earnest effort to kill it, you’ll be asked to never return.

[warren5421]

I live outside Indianapolis near the airport, in 5 years I got 300 coyotes, last 2 years have only seen 5. I raised Morgan horses for years and most of the yotes were shot when foaling season was going. They were shot with .22, .44 WCF, .45-70, .223 and .308. Today what few I have seen stay outside the fence line. It's funny as they have learned I don't shoot on the outside of the fence.

[GregLaROCHE]

Nice to hear your stories. How much can you get for a coyote pelt these days?

[Wolfdog91]

Nice to hear your stories. How much can you get for a coyote pelt these days?

Depends where it's coming from but hear the boys out in Montana are getting $75 for top lots but that's on the upper end

[Wilderness]

On this side of the Pacific we have dingos. Some are the real thing, while others are crossed up with domestic dogs. The worst are the pig dog crosses. The real thing have their uses but are deadly on sheep and not appreciated around small calves either.

Dingos predate small pigs. A recent set of game camera images was of a dead cow and her visitors - a sow with suckers, a couple of boars, another mob of adult pigs, and a dingo. When I first imaged the sow at another location she had 11 tiny suckers. At her first appearance at the cow she was down to five and thereafter was losing one every couple of days. In my last shot of her before they ran out of cow she was down to just one. I am surprised that she kept coming back - must have been hungry. She was in poor condition. Many of the mobs on this property were devoid of suckers or nearly so. A mob or 15 or more big adult pigs with no suckers says something is going on.

Normally, when a dog turns up at a carcase, the family pigs abandon it for good, though the lone boars will stand off even a pack of dingos.

My (game camera) efforts at defining pig behaviour for shooting purposes, e.g. arrivals at waterholes or baits, are frequently disrupted by a dingo moving in on the action. Such dogs are a nuisance and are asking for trouble.

On the urban fringes, dingos clean up wandering cats and small dogs. In the bush they contribute environmentally by mopping up feral cats and especially (introduced) foxes. In rural settings, leaving a working dog tied up at a kennel is a bad move. Working dogs thus tethered may be attacked and killed - better to house them in elevated cages when they have to be confined.

Among my landowner benefactors, the only good dingo is a dead dingo, although personally I am prepared to be ambivalent. Shooting a dog usually generates multiple Brownie points.

A good trick to know for our dogs - and it may work for yours also - is when one runs off, get loaded and on to the dog, then howl. Usually they stop and look around. Keep the howl going as you squeeze the trigger.

If dealing with a pack, and they are not yet on to you, try for a double (or better) on the first shot. Chances are, one of the two will have enough enough left in him to blame his neighbour and put in the teeth. The ensuing fight should give you a couple more chances.

[GregLaROCHE]

Depends where it's coming from but hear the boys out in Montana are getting $75 for top lots but that's on the upper end

I remember when they were only $15 in Alaska, but a wolf was $2-300.

[Johnch]

Nice to hear your stories. How much can you get for a coyote pelt these days?

I was told a prime pelt from a large male will be $50
The Females pelts will be about $40

But Ohio Coyote are smaller than the ones out west

John

[ChristopherO]

I was told a prime pelt from a large male will be $50
The Females pelts will be about $40

But Ohio Coyote are smaller than the ones out west

John
When I was calling coyotes regularly years ago a pelt handler in NY City shared that our mid-west coyotes are mainly good for cuffs and collars, whereas the prime western dogs on the northern regions are the hides that the garments are made from. Thus, they command the better price.

I've shot much larger coyotes in SW Ohio than I have seen or heard of in the west. Pelt quality isn't on par, though.

[wmitty]

Wilderness;
I thoroughly enjoyed reading your comments regarding the dingo! Sounds like a tough critter and I laughed at the idea of one attacking the other after being wounded…definitely not coyote behavior. In hunting the ‘yotes here, we yell or whoop to get them to stop running and look around for the source. They do go into neighborhoods and work over the small dogs and cats. My hunting partner is a veterinarian, and claims they hang around cattle to eat the after birth (sp?) rather than the calves, but we still shoot them; a couple of ‘Em ate my cat several years back, and I have held it against the whole bunch…

[Wilderness]

Wilderness;
I thoroughly enjoyed reading your comments regarding the dingo! Sounds like a tough critter and I laughed at the idea of one attacking the other after being wounded…definitely not coyote behavior. In hunting the ‘yotes here, we yell or whoop to get them to stop running and look around for the source. They do go into neighborhoods and work over the small dogs and cats. My hunting partner is a veterinarian, and claims they hang around cattle to eat the after birth (sp?) rather than the calves, but we still shoot them; a couple of ‘Em ate my cat several years back, and I have held it against the whole bunch…

WMITTY - Thanks. Yes I think the afterbirth would be the main game. The cows as a mob are pretty vigilant, and can be an aid to hunting also, doing everything to point out the dog short of shouting "here he is".

A cow on her own has a more difficult time, and I have shot dogs while the cow stood over the calf fending them off. The group more at risk is the mob of new weaners separated from their "responsible adults". A pack of dogs will pull on a weaner. As for carcases, the first night or two are of most interest to the dogs as a scavenging opportunity. Beyond that, the visits may have more to do with what else might be there. They call by molasses feeders also, no doubt for the same reason, and do waterhole runs without drinking.

A tactic I have observed is for them to come in to the water at full gallop hoping to catch a wallaby unprepared. Early morning waterhole watches can be quite productive.

An acquaintance shot a dog at a carcase and left it there. A day or two later a large boar came in, saw the dead dog, and went down on him with his shoulder. No love lost there. Wonderful things, game cameras.

This is my first attempt at attaching an image. I spoiled an early morning wait for a pig on a waterhole by shooting this bloke instead. As you can see, not much in the way of fur. Bad Ass Wallace had a better example of a cold country skin under a Martini .25-35 in a recent post.

293929

[cwtebay]

Not sure who is getting $75 in Montana. We've been in the neighbourhood of $60 for prime and down from there.
If you have someone in mind that will give seventy five bucks..... you let me know, pretty sure I'll fill his order.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220102/5da9da9414a6d6d347b090feb5e4ecca.jpg

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[cwtebay]

Wilderness;
I thoroughly enjoyed reading your comments regarding the dingo! Sounds like a tough critter and I laughed at the idea of one attacking the other after being wounded…definitely not coyote behavior. In hunting the ‘yotes here, we yell or whoop to get them to stop running and look around for the source. They do go into neighborhoods and work over the small dogs and cats. My hunting partner is a veterinarian, and claims they hang around cattle to eat the after birth (sp?) rather than the calves, but we still shoot them; a couple of ‘Em ate my cat several years back, and I have held it against the whole bunch…I believe your hunting partner. Can't say I've ever heard of a coyote taking a healthy calf.

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[Three44s]

I believe your hunting partner. Can't say I've ever heard of a coyote taking a healthy calf.

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Our coyotes need to read “that memo” ...... “do not take a calf”?

Indeed, coyotes not only take calves but now and then they help deliver the calf as its coming out.

Moreover they can also chew on the mother cow’s private parts and cause her destruction as well.

Three44s

[Jim22]

I have a bit of trouble with those who think predators follow rules. The only rule that is supreme is hunger. Animals - or people - who forget that die from hunger. Nature makes a hard life for predators. It also makes a hard life for victims. The reason there are more deer than cougars, coyotes, wolves, or hunters is that deer create many offspring.

If I were a predatory animal I would have my 'Rules' for finding food. If I wanted to live I would also take advantage of sick, old, baby, or calving animals. If found they would be a free meal.

The value of the fur makes hunting predators profitable. Their intelligence also makes it challenging. That may change in the future but I still don't hunt coyotes et al. It makes my hands dirty.

That doesn't mean I would not kill something if I was hungry. It means I am holding off for now.

Jim

[cwtebay]

Our coyotes need to read “that memo” ...... “do not take a calf”?

Indeed, coyotes not only take calves but now and then they help deliver the calf as its coming out.

Moreover they can also chew on the mother cow’s private parts and cause her destruction as well.

Three44sBelieve me - I shoot, trap, exterminate every coyote that I run across. I had a client say this a couple of decades ago and it of course lit me up. But then I started paying attention. Sick calves? Young and freezing out calves? Calves being born - but their mother is taking her sweet a&& time? Yes!!! They will eat the tar out of them! Healthy calf at a day old in a normal cow herd?? I would challenge anyone to prove that a coyote has any effect on this calf's life - I will take this challenge. I've been calving several hundred cows for a half century, make my living from around 45,000 head calving everywhere from December to October is and have presented this to my associated ranchers whom all agree - there hasn't been a coyote (s!!!!!) been born that will do absolutely anything to a healthy calf - in a healthy cow herd.
The cow that has been neglected by its caretaker until she's exhausted and there's a swollen head and one foot out? The true breach calf that's been ignored because of ignorance??? Scouring calf laying around? Pneumonia babies halfheartedly wandering the calving lot? Yup, those coyotes will eat the bejeebers out of your calves - and perhaps they should!!
But a HEALTHY calf in a HEALTHY cow herd with a RESPONSIBLE man watching after them - a coyote is a skunk, a raven, an opportunistic part of the environment that will surely take advantage of the situation.
This is not an afront to anyone's opinion - merely a chance to challenge what I have stated. Chickens? Sheep? Goats? Pigs? Abso-flipping-lutely they will wreck your ride. But not beef cattle.

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[Wilderness]

Believe me - I shoot, trap, exterminate every coyote that I run across. I had a client say this a couple of decades ago and it of course lit me up. But then I started paying attention. Sick calves? Young and freezing out calves? Calves being born - but their mother is taking her sweet a&& time? Yes!!! They will eat the tar out of them! Healthy calf at a day old in a normal cow herd?? I would challenge anyone to prove that a coyote has any effect on this calf's life - I will take this challenge. I've been calving several hundred cows for a half century, make my living from around 45,000 head calving everywhere from December to October is and have presented this to my associated ranchers whom all agree - there hasn't been a coyote (s!!!!!) been born that will do absolutely anything to a healthy calf - in a healthy cow herd.
The cow that has been neglected by its caretaker until she's exhausted and there's a swollen head and one foot out? The true breach calf that's been ignored because of ignorance??? Scouring calf laying around? Pneumonia babies halfheartedly wandering the calving lot? Yup, those coyotes will eat the bejeebers out of your calves - and perhaps they should!!
But a HEALTHY calf in a HEALTHY cow herd with a RESPONSIBLE man watching after them - a coyote is a skunk, a raven, an opportunistic part of the environment that will surely take advantage of the situation.
This is not an afront to anyone's opinion - merely a chance to challenge what I have stated. Chickens? Sheep? Goats? Pigs? Abso-flipping-lutely they will wreck your ride. But not beef cattle.

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Interesting stuff. Over here, in some parts of the country, the dog problem manifests itself as bites on calves, the consequence of which is downgraded carcases when the steers are eventually slaughtered. Some calves also are taken. Sheep are a different story - complete mayhem. Some of our dogs at least I think must be quite a bit bigger than your coyotes.

A couple of weeks ago I had an SOS re a dog attack on calves - one dead and one torn about. I am normally ambivalent about shooting dogs - a shot fired at a dog finishes any chance of getting a shot at pigs in that area, and I acknowledge they do some good keeping down other undesirables. Conversely, they unsettle the pigs when I am trying to tap into regular behaviour patterns. Usually when I shoot a dog it is because I have bumped into him while looking for pigs.

On this occasion I made a point of going after the dog. There is a dam about a mile from where the calves were attacked, and a pig carcase a few hundred yards further on. I had game camera vision of dingos at this dam, and on carcases nearby over the previous couple of months.

The tactic was to be there at daylight and wait for something to arrive. If they are going to come to a water the best time is always early morning.

Herewith the result - maybe a crossbred, or perhaps a legitimate colour variation, an old dog and quite heavy to move. I have two game camera images of him in this area, one recent and one from a few years back. Neighbours recalled seeing him over a period of years. He came to the dam at 6.30 a.m., 40 minutes after sunrise, and copped a .30-30 through the neck.


294978

[Wilderness]

The value of the fur makes hunting predators profitable. Their intelligence also makes it challenging. That may change in the future but I still don't hunt coyotes et al. It makes my hands dirty.

Jim

Yes, skinning a fox leave a pretty bad smell too. The stink attaches to the oil in your skin. I found a good remedy was to wash my hands in methylated spirits (methyl alcohol), then soap, then lanolin hand cream to replace the stripped oils. End of stink.