Winchester Deer Season XP 6.5 CM

[Dieselhorses]

Probably shouldn't be going down this rabbit hole, but when I went to sight in my Mossberg 6.5 cm using Vortex optic and Win Deer Season XP 125 gr. I shot this group (not perfect but...). I also brought some ladder loads using Hornady 135 grain AT loaded with IMR 4350 (40-42 grains in .2 grain increments).

I know it's irrelevant to most to identify a powder used in commercial ammo but I was rather impressed with the accuracy of "right out of the box" rifle/ammo. I wonder if "Winchester" actually uses "Win-760" in these rounds as I've attached a pic (right-side) of 44.8 grains of what appears to be Win-760. On the left is pic from National Center for Forensic Science (https://www.ilrc.ucf.edu/powders/sample_detail.php?powder_id=39) site. According to latest edition Hornady reloading, 6.5 CM data reflects the following powders in the "safe range" of 44.8: Superformance, Hybrid 100V, Win760, Power Pro 4000 MR, Sta-ball 6.5. I ruled all out except "Superformance and Win760" which resemble "flattened balls/irregular".

I am aware that Winchester does not disclose (as well as other manufacturers) their loads, nor would they rely on a reloading manual but I'm so curious as to what this powder is!

Win760 & ?
291939

Superformance
291940

group
291941

[BunkTheory]

powder in a factory cartridge can be anything. As they dont need to state loading data for it, they are happily using loads that would violate established loading data.

ive shot reloads with powder x, noticed a peculiar smell to them, and then when shooting factory ammunition in other calibers realized the same smell.

But why use that factory bullet, its designed to have random weight retention. IE one shot it could have 70% of the bullet tay in one piece, while the next shot only 40% stays in one piece

[mfraser264]

In my reading over the years OEM's will use the lowest cost powder for the job at hand. They will adjust the load based on the characteristics of the powder once tested and go from there. Never assume from a visual inspection, smell, color, or physical measurements that powder "X" is powder "Y". This is why many that shoot and buy a box or two a year and check their rifle in the Fall are making adjustments.

[mfraser264]

In my reading over the years OEM's will use the lowest cost powder for the job at hand. They will adjust the load based on the characteristics of the powder once tested and go from there. Never assume from a visual inspection, smell, color, or physical measurements that powder "X" is powder "Y". This is why many that shoot and buy a box or two a year and check their rifle in the Fall are making adjustments.

Also keep in mind that Handloader's use canister grade powders where the OEM's do not.

[ulav8r]

The factories don't want or need to pay for canister powders. They buy in large quantities and do not need powder that is blended to meet a canister grade specification. If their next purchase of powder is slightly faster or slower than the previous one they will adjust the load as needed.

The powder factories follow a recipe to make powder of a given range of speed. After testing each batch they will sell to ammunition makers to use as is or blend various batches for use as canister grades. Those blended batches are then given a lot number and sold as canister powders.

[Dieselhorses]

Thank you all for your input! I agree now.


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[Dieselhorses]

Well whatever recipe it is, it works well cuz at 70 yards approximately it looked like this after drilling through the neck bone of a deer.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211223/a11ae8853b504851e8faf2d41298a19e.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211223/606810bd9c2761978b001f50b2d330cb.jpg

No exit wound but was right under hide on opposite side.


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