.30-30 lever action load for 200 yard Rams

[Arrowslinger]

I’m currently shooting lever action silhouette using a 165 cast RN/FP over 13 grains of IMR4227. It is inconsistent at knocking over the 200 yard Rams. Any suggestions on a load that will do the job? I know I could go with a jacketed bullet, but would rather stay with a cast boolit. Anyone using 4227 or do I need to switch to another powder? I’m relatively new to the game. Thanks in advance for any advice.

[358429]

Do you have IMR3031?

I used both 4227 and 3031 with 170 grain powder coated bullets in 308 Winchester.

The 4227 loads were nice to shoot. Bang ping.

The 3031 loads were powerfull and beat the steel plate authoritatively. BOOM PING[emoji41]

[dannyd]

Out that far 3031 works great in cast 30-30. If that’s the only powder you have make sure you hold the rifle same way every time, so the powder is in the same position round to round.

[MT Gianni]

RCBS 180 FN weighs in around 190 gr and feeds like a dream through a 94.

[Wilderness]

You need about 1900 or 1950 fps for that bullet weight to reliably fell PROPERLY SET rams. This will mean a gas check bullet, preferably cast hard for accuracy, with 28 gns Varget or 26 gns H4895 (better) or equivalent. As noted already, heavier bullet (RCBS) will do with less velocity. Momentum (basically velocity times weight) is what gets them down, so you can work out the trade offs as you go to lighter or heavier bullets. And heavier bullets retain a better % of velocity to 200 yds/meters.

Check the rules on setting the rams - having the whole width of the foot on the stand is NOT properly set for LAS.

By contrast the other three targets will succumb to subsonic loads, so you can confine the recoil punishment to just the ram loads.

[ShooterAZ]

Hogdon's Leverevolution powder will give you top velocity and accuracy in the 30-30, with less pressure for a given boolit weight. If it was me that's what I would use, along with the Lyman 311041. This will knock the Rams into the dirt, no problem. If you can find this powder, try it and you will not be disappointed. With Leverevolution I can easily get to 2000fps+ in a 16" M94 Saddle Ring Carbine with the 311041 boolit.

[Beerd]

arrowslinger,
how hard are your bullets?
too hard & brittle can shatter on impact with a steel target.
..

[Wilderness]

Hogdon's Leverevolution powder will give you top velocity and accuracy in the 30-30, with less pressure for a given boolit weight. If it was me that's what I would use, along with the Lyman 311041. This will knock the Rams into the dirt, no problem. If you can find this powder, try it and you will not be disappointed. With Leverevolution I can easily get to 2000fps+ in a 16" M94 Saddle Ring Carbine with the 311041 boolit.

SAZ - I use LVR also, but not for LAS. I find it has to be loaded full throttle for accuracy, i.e. 2200 fps for cast, which is more than I want to endure for competitive shooting.

Also OP did not mention the rifle he was using. My Savage 99 .30-30 hunting rifle has 12" twist and shoots the 2200 fps LVR load very well indeed. My LAS rifle is a 1949 Marlin 336A with cut rifling and 10" twist. It prefers the sub 2000 fps loads, i.e. non LVR. Winchester has 12" twist so should be fine with LVR at full throttle.

Re bullet hardness, if you go through the debris at the ram line, the biggest pieces you will find will be the gas checks. At ram velocities I think all cast bullets turn into dust no matter the hardness.

For a definitive discussion of what knocks silhouettes down, see the article by William C. Davis Jnr in American Rifleman of January 1980. He discusses the physics involved, and cites research done by Hornady on bullet construction as it applies to knocking down silhouettes. Quote: "The Hornady tests show that striking momentum is overwhelmingly more important than bullet construction". Note that it says momentum, not energy. That favours bullet weight.

[1006]

My target load is based on a plated Berry Bullet that weighs 150 grains.

16 inch Trapper 94 /150 Berry plated/ 15.5grains Alliant 2400/ Federal Large Rifle/ COL 2.550/
average velocity 1683/temp. 85/ SD=9/ 3 shots fired.

290686

[Nobade]

In my experience here, around 17 grains of 4227 will probably get the job done.

[Rick B]

Shot a lot of Silhouettes in practice. The 180 grain RCBS gas checked bullet at 1400 fps works real well. 18.0 grains of 4198, Winchester Large Rifle Primer with a 12 BHN bullet appears to dwell on the target. The momentum of the 180 combined with this hardness of bullet is very effective in knocking down our resettable targets. Rams struck in the body at 200 meters, go down. Ones struck high on the leg also tip over. The CF Levergun Silhouette Range here in Phoenix has resettable targets. They are the only Levergun Silhouette targets , I have experience with. I don't recall ever losing a target hit in the body. Above load shoots phenomenal in my micro groove Marlin.
Rick

[marshall623]

I run the Lyman 311041 water quenched out of the mold . These are out of clip on wheel weights with 2% tin added . I'm running them over 20.5 gr of IMR 4198 WLR primers . Out of a 20" 94 they will take down body hit rams . I'm new to this Rifle cartridge lever action game , but I'm having a blast .

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

[Arrowslinger]

Thanks for all the advice. I’m currently shooting Meisterbullets since I don’t cast my own. I’ve been very happy with their bullets and shoot them in my 38-55 with great success. I’m shooting a Winchester 1894 made by Moroku in Japan and the barrel is only 19 inches. This gun is a 100th anniversary NYSP commemorative that was given to me as a retirement gift. I decided I’d rather shoot it than keep it in the safe.

I’m willing to try other powders and bullet configurations, I just thought I might up the 4227 powder charge on my currrent load as the Lyman manual has a starting load of 16.5 for a 170 gr bullet. As already stated by others, I don’t want to punish myself too bad with a sharp recoiling load if a heavier bullet will accomplish the same thing.

Thanks again. Back to the drawing board. I’ll advise.

[Rick B]

The extra 15-25 grains of bullet weight. Makes a noticeable difference in the knockdown ability at 200 meters. Whatever you end up shootings, have fun.
Rick

[hylander]

19.0 gr. 4198 and a Lyman 173 g/c knock them down for me.

[Tar Heel]

With the Lee 309-170-F cast in Lyman #2 alloy and sized to .309", I am getting 2019 fps with 30.0 gr of IMR-3031 in my M94 rifle. With a SD of 2fps, these loads really perform for me.

290867

[OBXPilgrim]

Finally got a Win 94 in 30-30. Thanks to you all for sharing these loads. Was already thinking of the 311041 and H4895, but now have several more options. Thank you to the OP.

[tigweldit]

My 1974 Win 94 30/30 likes 311041 w/27-28 gr 3031. PC'd, water dropped with gas check come in at 178 gr with my mold and alloy. Don' know the velocity, but it works well on everything I've shot.

[OBXPilgrim]

My 1974 Win 94 30/30 likes 311041 w/27-28 gr 3031. PC'd, water dropped with gas check come in at 178 gr with my mold and alloy. Don' know the velocity, but it works well on everything I've shot.

No problems with feeding the 311041? Looks like it would be a great fit for Win 94s, but I've wondered about how they feed them.

[RickinTN]

In my experience here, around 17 grains of 4227 will probably get the job done.

I don't shoot silhouette but my go to 30-30 load is 15 to 16 grains of 4227 with a 187 grain bullet. I think if you up your charge to around 17 grains you'll find success.
Rick

[rintinglen]

No problems with feeding the 311041? Looks like it would be a great fit for Win 94s, but I've wondered about how they feed them.

Like carp through a goose. That's how they'll feed. I have shot many, many hundreds of 311041 sized .310 over 34 grains of WW-748. At the club I used to shoot at, the steel ranges were set up in meters, not yards. And the rams were very hard to knock over. It took a heavy boolit hitting hard to put one down. I eventually went to a 45-70 Marlin CB due to ringing a ram with a solid body hit only to have it teeter, then pop back up. On other ranges, my 30-30 was just fine.

[Nobade]

Like carp through a goose. That's how they'll feed. I have shot many, many hundreds of 311041 sized .310 over 34 grains of WW-748. At the club I used to shoot at, the steel ranges were set up in meters, not yards. And the rams were very hard to knock over. It took a heavy boolit hitting hard to put one down. I eventually went to a 45-70 Marlin CB due to ringing a ram with a solid body hit only to have it teeter, then pop back up. On other ranges, my 30-30 was just fine.

Not Fort Bliss was it? Railroad track even with the dirt behind it. Hit one center and it would push back and keep standing in the dirt. I've never rang a ram with my 30-06 except there, they just laugh at you.

[Arrowslinger]

Thanks for all the information. Any suggestions on best place to source the heavier bullets since I don’t cast?

[ubetcha]

I use 21 grs of Reloader7 in a 14" T/C Contender with bullet weights between 150-170 grs cast for our 230 yrd rams. Ours are at 230 yards due to a large 200yrd target pit inbetween. I have had no problems knocking rams over, ( if and when I hit them of course).😊