38-56 ? Why or why not

[greywuuf]

I know the history of it not being any useful addition over the 38-55 ....but why not. Could a person not make use of the extra capacity to utilize a heavier bullet? Any one here have any actual experience with one ? How about smokeless potential.

[Nobade]

In a strong rifle like a Ruger #1, fitted with a fast twist barrel, loaded with smokeless, it would be every bit of a 375 H&H. In a BPCR type rifle, again with a faster than normal twist, it would be a pretty decent long range rig but you may end up having to wipe the bore often since it holds so much powder compared to the bore size. Either way it would be fun to play with and cases wouldn't be hard to make.

[indian joe]

I know the history of it not being any useful addition over the 38-55 ....but why not. Could a person not make use of the extra capacity to utilize a heavier bullet? Any one here have any actual experience with one ? How about smokeless potential.

38/56 will hold at least 10 grains more Blackpowder - should make a decent difference in velocity?

[Lead pot]

I been procrastinating on a .38-55 or a .38-50 and the .38-56 have come up in my min d several times.
I had a .38-56 chambered in the 86 Win and I liked the caliber. it performed very well and I been thinking on a new rifle in this caliber.
I don't have a Plumbers rifle ( Hepburn :D) and I been thinking on a fast twist 1/12 for the .38-56. The winchesters had the slow twist and it performed well with the light bullets but the games I play I think it would be just as good, maybe better than the 55 or the 50 with the faster ROT.
Brass for that caliber can be easily made. I think it would be a good project.

Kurt

[indian joe]

I been procrastinating on a .38-55 or a .38-50 and the .38-56 have come up in my min d several times.
I had a .38-56 chambered in the 86 Win and I liked the caliber. it performed very well and I been thinking on a new rifle in this caliber.
I don't have a Plumbers rifle ( Hepburn :D) and I been thinking on a fast twist 1/12 for the .38-56. The winchesters had the slow twist and it performed well with the light bullets but the games I play I think it would be just as good, maybe better than the 55 or the 50 with the faster ROT.
Brass for that caliber can be easily made. I think it would be a good project.

Kurt

Only hassle I can see is neck length for heavy GG boolits? ----you proly gonna PP it so thats a non issue

some folk tell that bottle neck cases are a problem with BP - I have one of each in .45 (45/75 and 45/70) - never seemed to be a problem (except for that limitation with neck length = cant have yr wad floating around in the shoulder of the case)

[rpf2697]

I have an 1895 Marlin in 38-56 and would like to find some loaded ammunition sources. I'd like to hunt blacktail with the old girl but hard to find quality loaded ammo. Buffalo arms has been out for years. Any ideas?

[Nobade]

I have an 1895 Marlin in 38-56 and would like to find some loaded ammunition sources. I'd like to hunt blacktail with the old girl but hard to find quality loaded ammo. Buffalo arms has been out for years. Any ideas?

I have a feeling that buying a couple of boxes of custom made ammo for it might be about the same price as getting set up to load for it yourself.

You may, however, find some old factory ammo from one of the collector places. The shop I worked for had two boxes of Remington factory ammo in the safe for some reason. I think he may have had a '86 at some point.

[Lead pot]

The .38-65 is a pretty easy to make with just a pass through a die with a .45-70 case and a little trimming.

Joe.

I have two .44-90 BN and 2 .44-77 rifles and in the past I had a Roller in the .43 Spanish as well as a roller in a 40 caliber and they all shot well with out a problem.
When you see a post with a BN caliber with a bad rep it's most likely from a guy that never even had one in his hands and being a Parrot passing on what he read.

[Nobade]

The .38-65 is a pretty easy to make with just a pass through a die with a .45-70 case and a little trimming.

Joe.

I have two .44-90 BN and 2 .44-77 rifles and in the past I had a Roller in the .43 Spanish as well as a roller in a 40 caliber and they all shot well with out a problem.
When you see a post with a BN caliber with a bad rep it's most likely from a guy that never even had one in his hands and being a Parrot passing on what he read.

Agreed. I never had any problems with my 43 Spanish or 41 Swiss Vetterli. Only difference is powder compression doesn't work the same as a straight case but they shoot fine. 44-77 wouldn't have been such a popular long range caliber if it didn't work.

[sharps4590]

The .38-65 is a pretty easy to make with just a pass through a die with a .45-70 case and a little trimming.

Joe.

I have two .44-90 BN and 2 .44-77 rifles and in the past I had a Roller in the .43 Spanish as well as a roller in a 40 caliber and they all shot well with out a problem.
When you see a post with a BN caliber with a bad rep it's most likely from a guy that never even had one in his hands and being a Parrot passing on what he read.

I'll have to agree as well. I've done a pile of work with the 11.15 X 60R case and the 47mm length case with more than satisfactory results. Oh, worked up a load for a friend's 577/450 and it didn't present any particular difficulties.

[Alan]

Well, as a hunting round it wasn't the equal of the .45's or 50's, but what it did do was turn the 86 into a people shooter. An 1880's .223.

Hear me out - it VASTLY outranges a .44-40, flatter than a .45-70, and almost no recoil.
All the actual users I havr seen documented are either lawmen or bad guys.

[country gent]

Im considering it in a rolling block Im building. I have a 34" green mountain blank 38 cal 1-12 twist I believe its a number 3 octagon contour, plenty heavy, Im planning on a 30" barrel when finished and a tapered octagon contour when done. taper will be .005 per inch.

Im thinking for dies I can bore out and sleeve a set of 45-70 dies to make the new neck shoulder.

Am planning on making some cases here shortly so I can load some dummies with the 360 grn nasa I have the mould for and see what it looks like. then send one off to Dave Manson for the reamer. Am planning on the base of the bullet just ahead of the shoulder. I think I will have enough neck there

I have both the Lyman 330 grn postel and the old west 360grn NASA moulds here to work with. I also have a 340 grn Paper patched mould here that may show promise. Theres still dome figuring thinking and planning that needs to be done before I start making chips.

[Lead pot]

CG,
If you have Dave make the chamber reamer have him make the sizing reamer as well and use it for your die.
I do this for making the die for forming the brass and sizing die. It's a lot cheeper to make the reamer for your die than having a die made.
Dave might even have a die blank with a proper bore for the reamer pilot or you can get die blanks from PT&G.
Here are some of my reamers for the .44-75 Ballard, .44-90BN, .44-100-2.6 Rem, .40-65 tight PP only and some throating reamers that can also be used for a taper crimp or sizing die without the rim recess.
I like making my tools if I can.

302157302158

[doccash]

302159This is the best reason why. Black powder with a hand cast 20:1 plain base bullet, SPG lube and Walters vegetable wad

[Lead pot]

302159This is the best reason why. Black powder with a hand cast 20:1 plain base bullet, SPG lube and Walters vegetable wad


Doc,

Yes it does every time without fail.


302172

[greywuuf]

I have to say that I have never seen one in person but all the pictures I have seen seem to include a rather generous neck length.. ...

[a danl]

I have an 1895 Marlin in 38-56 and would like to find some loaded ammunition sources. I'd like to hunt blacktail with the old girl but hard to find quality loaded ammo. Buffalo arms has been out for years. Any ideas?

if you handload you can make brass from 45/70 by using 38/56 dies. i've done it and it works great. p.s. i once had a mint 1895 marlin in 38/56 and sold it for $2,000