30-06 Garand H4895 and use of Dacron

[primerhead]

Hello Friends:

My understanding from some posters is that they use dacron
when loading cast bullets for the Garand using H4895.

This is something new to me please explain and where do you purchase dacron.

Thanks for the help.
primerhead

[zarrinvz24]

I believe Dacron is commonly available as stuffing for pillows at hobby lobby or craft stores. Do some more research on it, as I’ve heard it cautioned that it can cause a ringed chamber due to unforeseen pressure spikes.

[405grain]

It's basically pillow stuffing, and getting a single bag of it from the sewing section at a Walmart is usually a lifetime supply. This is very important: when using a dacron filler - do not pack it down against the powder charge. The filler's only purpose is to act a light fluffy tuft that takes up the space between the base of the bullet and the powder charge and hold the powder against the back of the case where the primer will give it more uniform ignition. If you pack it down against the powder it might act like a bore obstruction when it gets stuck in the cartridge neck and cause a pressure spike.
You only need around 1/2 grain of dacron (give or take), and it's usually only useful with slower single base powders, (like IMR-3031, 4350, 4895, 4831, etc.) I don't use a filler with ball powders like H335 or BL-C2 when loading cast boolits, but do use a magnum primer with these type loads. With faster powders like Unique or 2400 a filler is totally unnecessary, even with reduced loads.

[Larry Gibson]

Shot many, many cast loads with 4895 in the 30-06, a lot of them in an M1 Rifle. This thread will give you the information;

https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?109280-The-proper-use-of-fillers

[cwtebay]

Larry Gibson- if you don't mind commenting, what is your take on the pressure spike notion brought up?

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[dale2242]

What Larry said.
This has been discussed at length on this site.
I use 1 gr dacron over 32 gr of IMR 4895 and any cast gas checked bullet in the 170 to 200gr range.
My M1 will cycle this load and is as accurate as any M2 ball duplication load.

[Ford SD]

From my understanding and using dacron in 308 / 3006 35 whelen

do not pack it down ... fluffy .. a small little square cut with scissors

if using an slow burning powder that works good with dacron 4895 / 4227 speed range

Using dacron when there is less than a 80% fill will

improve velocity and lower sd and es

improve igniting powder, when the powder is out of position ( semi or shooting down hill)

allow you to use less powder as a you reduce your load and work up .... you will get a higher velocity using less powder ( no dacron vs with dacron)

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I was using imr 4227 in a 308 semi and even with every charge trickled, you could hear and feel velocity differences and see them with a chrono

using dacron with less powder changed everything for the better. ejection / velocity/ es /sd and improved the group size

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ringing the chamber would / can be done if / maybe you used some other type of solid filler, but not fluffy dacron

[Larry Gibson]

Larry Gibson- if you don't mind commenting, what is your take on the pressure spike notion brought up?

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Many use the terms wad and filler interchangeably and ergo the problem. A wad is distinctly different than a filler. Apples and oranges.

It seems there was an occasional problem with "ringing" when any type of wad was used. Thousands and thousands of rounds were fired in the past using a dacron wad. It was recommended and even loads included in Lyman's CBHs of yore. While it is reported that ringing can be caused by using a dacron wad I have never seen an actual case of it. I have seen cases of ringing where card and TP wads were used. Whether there was a "pressure spike" involved with any of the ringing cases is only a guess at best because no pressure measurements were taken. The presence of a pressure spike is only in theory.

I have pressure tested thousands of rounds where dacron was used as a filler. I have never seen a pressure spike when a dacron filler was used correctly [refer to post #2 in the posted thread on the use of fillers]. Actually the pressures are more often smoother and more consistent when the dacron filler is used.

[zarrinvz24]

Many use the terms wad and filler interchangeably and ergo the problem. A wad is distinctly different than a filler. Apples and oranges.

It seems there was an occasional problem with "ringing" when any type of wad was used. Thousands and thousands of rounds were fired in the past using a dacron wad. It was recommended and even loads included in Lyman's CBHs of yore. While it is reported that ringing can be caused by using a dacron wad I have never seen an actual case of it. I have seen cases of ringing where card and TP wads were used. Whether there was a "pressure spike" involved with any of the ringing cases is only a guess at best because no pressure measurements were taken. The presence of a pressure spike is only in theory.

I have pressure tested thousands of rounds where dacron was used as a filler. I have never seen a pressure spike when a dacron filler was used correctly [refer to post #2 in the posted thread on the use of fillers]. Actually the pressures are more often smoother and more consistent when the dacron filler is used.

Larry, thank you very much for expanding on my earlier comments. I had thought this was something that we stumbled on as a collective when trying reduced loads, but now I'm curious about the historical use of dacron filler. Do you happen to recall in which Lyman CBH I may be able to find these descriptions?

[PAndy]

Primer head you can always test your loads in your rifle, looking for vertical stringing. Shoot a group with powder forward and a group with powder back...see what happens.

[zarrinvz24]

Primer head you can always test your loads in your rifle, looking for vertical stringing. Shoot a group with powder forward and a group with powder back...see what happens.

That's true, I've seen reduced load shooters point rifle to the sky and slowly bring the muzzle down. I assumed this was because they wanted to ensure as much powder is in contact with the primer as possible. At the time, I was able to use the bulky SR powders. Now that's gone, I suppose its time to take another closer look at dacron.

[Outpost75]

Key is to follow Larry's instructions and NOT to push the Dacron down against the powder, but only to poke it loosely into the case neck so that the bullet base will gently push it down into the powder space only, to occupy the free airspace, to improve ballistic uniformity. I use 3/8" thick polyester quilt batting from the crafts section at Walmart, and cut it into one inch squares with scissors, which consistently weigh about 1 grain +/-. This amount is adequate for the .30-30, .303 Brit, .308 or 30-'06 and is completely consumed upon firing.

I use 30 grains of H4895, Varget, RL15 or IMR 4895 as a full charge load in .30-30 and as a 200 yard target load in the .303 Brit, .308 Win. or .30-06 bolt guns with Accurate 31-160H. To cycle the M1 Garand increase the charge to 36 grains with #311299.

[GooseGestapo]

I’ve never seen or heard of Dacron fiber causing ringing or over pressure.
You only use 1-2gr of it and it is consumed in combustion. The powder binder is even Dacron...

Cream of Wheat or wadded toilet paper CAN ring a chamber or barrel.
With a 200gr Lee RNGC, I use 35.0gr H4895, no filler. With the Lee 160gr PtGC, I use 36.0gr and a tuft of filler. I seat and crimp to crimp grooves.

[abunaitoo]

The dacron is used to hold the powder back to the primer.
It works well.
I've been using "The Load" with I4350 for a long time.
Never had any problems.
It shoots better than the I4895 for me.