What a waste of time. What is going on here? With a bonus question and picture

[Stopsign32v]

Well today so far is a bust. Spent an hour making nothing but recycled scrap. So I'm using a Lee dipper pot set at temperature setting 7. In my Ideal 358429 this is what I came up with today. Base of the boolit is out of round and look like trash. What is causing it?

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51364076734_f1c844a1e0_b.jpg (https://www.flickr.com/gp/113193676@N08/30a5Vd)

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51364356995_8b95ceb6a1_b.jpg (https://www.flickr.com/gp/113193676@N08/Z3QF95)

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51363563648_38d80a95e0_b.jpg (https://www.flickr.com/gp/113193676@N08/S4YZS5)

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51364076854_260fa2aee2_b.jpg (https://www.flickr.com/gp/113193676@N08/AWT3pd)

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51363341446_24f10ed782_b.jpg (https://www.flickr.com/gp/113193676@N08/2P5413)


And this is a damn wreck. So I have roughly 60 rounds of this Black MZ powder load taking up my 357 Magnum brass. I don't really care to shoot it anymore since I have real black powder so I figured I would take them down and recycle all the stuff and use the cases for 2400 loads. Well once I pulled the copper plated bullets I ended up with this crap. The powder is in solid form and is stuck inside the brass. If I beat it with the bullet puller without the bullet in place the powder sometimes breaks off but some is still in there no matter what. Suggestions? These have live primers in them too BTW. Oh and if you look on the right hand side and see that score mark on the powder. That was from a nail when I tried to break it up to fall out! SOLID!

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51364357180_d844ed4256_b.jpg (https://www.flickr.com/gp/113193676@N08/2K1VZ3)

[358429]

The mold is not hot enough, also there is too much lead stuck to the top.

How many seconds does it take for the sprue to solidify?

Get the mold hotter and use the oily rag the wipe it down all surfaces including the top and bottom of the swinging plate any and all venting lines and the insides of the cavities. If it's hot enough rubbing it with an oily rag will clean it easily.

I do not worry about oil contamination. If it's up to temperature the mold is almost to the solidus temperature of lead. I cannot think of any oil that will withstand that amount of temperature in direct contact with molten lead for any appreciable amount of time.

A couple of casts with a mold that is up to temperature will remove any excess oil easily.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

[Stopsign32v]

The mold is not hot enough, also there is too much lead stuck to the top.

How many seconds does it take for the sprue to solidify?



It takes about 3 seconds

I really think it was up to temp but maybe not. What is the best way to get the lead off the underside of the plate and top of mold? Just use the oily rag?

[358429]

Yeah just scrub

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

[oley55]

What is the best way to get the lead off the underside of the plate and top of mold?

Not an expert here, but as per my readings and experience, I bring the mold and sprue plate up to temperature and then gouge/rub the lead off with the blunt end of a bamboo skewer or similar soft wood utensil (split wood paint paddle). Just keep reheating and rubbing until it's clean.

[John Boy]

First, buy a thermometer …
Then read this article…. http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Contents.htm

* Then heat the melt & mold up to 725 to 750 … and hold the temperature constant so the sprue puddle frosts in 5 to 8 seconds … then cut the sprue …
* Pour the melt into the mold for 5 seconds and insure you have a large spur puddle

The mold will cast nice bullets when the user casts with a thermometer and knows how to cast so don’t blame the mold

[Stopsign32v]

First, buy a thermometer …
* Then heat the melt & mold up to 725 to 750 … and hold the temperature constant so the sprue puddle frosts in 5 to 8 seconds … then cut the sprue
* Pour the melt into the mold for 5 seconds and insure you have a large spur puddle

What are some of the thermometers you guys like to use?

[Skipper]

Try soaking the powder filled cases in water overnight.

[Hedly Lamarr]

I don't know about others here, but my mold is at the right temp when I can cut the sprue without hitting the sprue plate. Just push it with a gloved hand.

[Stopsign32v]

Try soaking the powder filled cases in water overnight.

Would the water mess with the primers?

[reddog81]

Mold isn't hot enough, lead isn't hot enough, and/or sprue plate isn't hot enough.

I wouldn't waste money on a thermometer. Just turn up the temp, cast at a faster pace and/or leave a larger sprue puddle. Once the bullet looks good, you know it's good to go.

Those 1 cavity steel molds take a long time to heat up. Are you warming on a hot plate or rest on the top of the pot?

[megasupermagnum]

The pot temp is only one aspect of this. Your casting cadence also has a huge effect on how hot your mold is, which is really the only thing that matters. If the rest of the bullet is good, then specifically your sprue plate is too cool. You want a decent sized puddle on you sprue plate each time, to keep it hot. You will want to cast very fast at first, those steel molds don't like to build up heat, and especially a single cavity. You should ultimately end up at a point where you can easily open the plate with your gloved hand. It should take a good 8 seconds or so for the color of the sprue to change.

As for your black MZ question, I'd just try and shoot them if you can. Soaking in water may help. I wouldn't trust my life with the primers after that, but if you set them out in the sun to dry for a day, they should still work.

[Minerat]

I take a lead ingot and rub the buildup once the mold is at temp. It comes right off then light oil with spure lube on the top of mould and both sides of the spure plate. I run my temp with the pdi set at 750 for steel or aluminum moulds and 775 for brass. Once the boolits start to frost I slow down and run 2 moulds.

Hot water, you'll probably lose the primers but if you throw the cases away they're gone any way.

[JimB..]

I’d just shoot those 357mag rounds.

Primers are highly water resistant, but you’ll get water in the primer pocket both outside the primer and through the flash hole, it’ll corrode the case.

If desperate I suppose you could put a drillbit that just barely fits in the case in A vice and then turn the cases on it by hand. It’ll make a heck of a mess.

[Helka]

I don't know about others here, but my mold is at the right temp when I can cut the sprue without hitting the sprue plate. Just push it with a gloved hand.

I agree with this. If I need to use some sort of mallet to cut the sprue then the sprue plate isn’t hot enough. If the boolits are wrinkled then mold isn’t hot enough.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Stopsign32v]

Heated up the mold a good bit more and now it cast PERFECT boolits! On my way to powder coat them for the first time now...

[bedbugbilly]

Your powder is a compressed load and what you have is not unusual for BP or substitute. I have pulled down compressed BP loads before and it is pretty much impossible to get the inside completely clean. I used a narrow pointed popsicle stick to try and break up the compressed BP. I have shot and handled BP for close to 60 years but I am still very hesitant in breaking down a BP cartridge. The compressed powder is pretty much worthless as how are you going to measure it after you remove it. As suggested, you could soak them - but then you run the risk of water in the primer pockets unless you let them sit for a long time and what powder residue is in the case may cause corrosion.

I would just shoot them - or pull the lead if you are short on lead and then load the compressed powder finked casing and fire them off - wash and clean the casings thoroughly and start over, I know primers are short, but you at least have the pleasure of shooting them.Be safe and good luck.

[gwpercle]

When dipper casting you will want a little hotter alloy . The dipper sucks heat out . Flux you melt well and Clean the block top and underside of Sprue plate , you don't want any lead stuck to them .
I start with the dial set on 9.0 to heat melt and mould set on top . As soon as alloy is melted , put dipper ( Lyman type with little side spout) into the melt ...keep it in the pot to stay hot ...as things heat up and boolits start getting frosty I move dial back ...8.5 then 8.0 ... usually ending up at 7.5 with the boolits having a light frosty appearance , good for coating or tumble lubing .
I usually give the sprue puddle 6 to 7 seconds to harden before opening ... smeared top is from opening too soon , sprue not hard and smears across top ... stop and clean off ...it gets worse and screws up you castings . Your rounded bases could be from a too cool alloy ... the bases look pretty good but just not filled out and flat . Some like rounded bases because it makes seating easier but they should be flat . Is you alloy pure lead ... if so some Tin will help fill out 1 part Tin with 20 parts Lead ( 1/ 20 ) will fix that right up and a good alloy for 38 special .

I can't help with the powder charge ... 2.5 to 3.0 grains of Bullseye is all I know.
Gary

[Stopsign32v]

The compressed powder, I'm going to try to carefully drill it loose with a hand drill.

[littlejack]

Yep, sumpins not hot enough. I use an electric single burner bought at St. Vinnies to heat my moulds while the lead is heating. I generally cast at between 675° - 725° temperature, but I crank it up to 9 to get the lead started out. This is with the dial on the Lee melting pot. Once the lead has heated, I stir and flux a couple times with sawdust. While this is happening, I'm turning the moulds on the burner to get them hot all the way through. I usually run it on the medium setting. After everything is hot and ready to go, I turn the electric burner off, and start casting at a good speed, and a controlled repetition. It just takes a couple drops from each mould, and the slugs start dropping great. I run double cavity steel moulds, two moulds at a time. I don't care for the heavy 4-6 hole moulds, as they are very fatiguing. When one mould is filled and set down, pick up the other and fill it. As I am filling the second one, the first one is cooling, and ready to cut, open and refill. And so on and so on. Once you get a rhythm going, you're set.
Regards

[Skipper]

Would the water mess with the primers?

Nope, as soon as they're dry, they will be OK.
Oil on the other hand is death to primers.

[cwtebay]

I have tried salvaging BP components before, gotta say - primers will have to get a heck of a lot more expensive to make it worth it for me! I just shot them, at the very least I got some enjoyment out of that method.

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

[winelover]

You can get the lead off that mold several ways, when up to temperature.

Four ought steel wool (iron molds only).
Cool piece of lead used as an eraser, like a discarded sprue.
Bamboo skewer.
Small piece of canvas or burlap.

That mold isn't up to temperature, that's the reason for poor base fill out. Cutting the sprue with a gloved hand is the best way to tell.

Winelover

[Markopolo]

what do the boolits you cast that day look like... not just the base, but the nose?

[Tar Heel]

Put the dipper snout in contact with the sprue plate and rotate the dipper/mold. Let the weight of the alloy in the dipper assist with fill-out in the mold. If your alloy is hot enough, this works fine. If your alloy is too cold, you will bond the dipper to the mold. You just need to play with the heat and the contact time. There are no "absolutes" in this hobby and no two molds act the same. I have a whole tribe of temperamental molds, each with its own idiosyncrasies.

I agree with the above suggestion to digest the excellent work From Ingot to Target: A Cast Bullet Guide for Handgunners ©. Simply stop casting now, read the publication, and start over with a new perspective. That is a "must read" collection for all bullet casters.

[Stopsign32v]

what do the boolits you cast that day look like... not just the base, but the nose?

Some had a slight wrinkle in the nose. I honestly thought I had it hot enough. Guess not

[Stopsign32v]

I ended up getting the mold hot enough to where the lead took around 7 seconds to finally solidify. During this time I held it level but wiggled it slightly to make sure a good distribution within the mold. Absolutely perfect boolits came out. Slightly frosty but nothing too bad

[AlHunt]

I ended up getting the mold hot enough to where the lead took around 7 seconds to finally solidify. During this time I held it level but wiggled it slightly to make sure a good distribution within the mold. Absolutely perfect boolits came out. Slightly frosty but nothing too bad

You should still get a thermometer. Most everywhere that sells casting supplies has them. Another data point never hurts.

Frosty is my usual benchmark. I run my heat up into the 800's until I see frosty then slide it back down around 750.

A hot mold is a happy and forgiving mold.

[lightman]

Heated up the mold a good bit more and now it cast PERFECT boolits! On my way to powder coat them for the first time now...

Glad you got some keepers. I was going to say to not get discouraged, very few of us got good bullets the very first time.

I was also going to suggest cleaning the mold and trying a hotter temp. I personally don't want anything in my mold cavities. No oil, no smoke, no release agent. Nothing!

Thermometers: Tel Tru makes a good one. Prices vary so shop around.

[littlejack]

+1 on what Tar Heel said. I have used this technique with a temperamental mould. I use the term "pressure pouring". It does work.

[Stopsign32v]

If anyone is wanting an update on the stuck black powder substitute this is what I did to get it out:

Fill a bowl of hot water and submerge them making sure to mix them around.

After about 30 minutes I came back and most of the powder had been removed.

1 case was still being stubborn so I took it over to the hose and blasted hot water inside it. That fixed it.

Now all of the wet primed brass is in a bag full of rice.

Next will be to tumble it with crushed walnut shells and load it. Whatever doesn't fire will be broken down an recycled.

[fredj338]

IMO, 3sec is not quite hot enough. It could be your spru plate is too tight & you are getting venting but is that lead smear on the right? Clean that off, make sure the alloy & mold are hot, 7 setting on a full Lee isnt quite hot enough IMO.

[centershot]

What are some of the thermometers you guys like to use?

Skip the thermometer, buy or build a P.I.D.. That's the only way to keep a constant temp on your melt pot.