Remington 1863 Pocket - short lived and disappointing

[Anonym]

Well guys, a cry of desperation here. I picked up a little CVA/ASM replica of the Remington 1863 Pocket Revolver this past Saturday. Brought it home, cleaned and oiled it as it had been sitting for years, and checked functionality. Loaded up 3 chambers and test fired without a problem.

Fast forward to tonight. Decided I wanted to try it again and see where it’s shooting vs functionality. Loaded all five cylinders the same as last time… 12 grains of fffg, the 0.323 ball, and my homemade lube over the top. First shot was on target. Second shot was not, so I stepped closer and fired the remaining 3 shots with only the last making impact to the far right.

As I wiped off the black residue from the frame and was about to go inside to reload, I saw where the whole right side of the barrel at the forcing cone was split and blown out like a cylinder fired with excessive cylinder rotation.

Since these are long out of production, I’m assuming I have just made some lucky guy a great parts opportunity unless any of you have any ideas. Thoughts?

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[Mk42gunner]

Well that is an interesting Yikes. Glad no one was hurt when it let go.

You might see if you can get the barrel out of the frame, then decide what to do. I have no idea if current manufactured ?? barrels will match the threads of an ASM or not. Going by the grip frame screws on one of my 1851's, probably not.

Hope you didn't spend a lot on your new paperweight...

Good luck

Robert

[Anonym]

Not as much as I could have, that’s for sure, but more than I wanted for a project too. The crazy thing was that it was totally unnoticed during the shooting. Granted it is a small charge on a small projectile though.

I’ve already sent a message to Pietta. Seems they are the only game in town for the time being.

[cwtebay]

Boy, I'm sure glad you are alright! Sorry about your pistol!

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[358429]

Your guardian angel is working overtime!

Very fortunate you did not get hit with metal pieces!

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[Walks]

Sorry to hear.

I think a bit heavy on the powder. I only use 10grs 3F in Mine. At least 400rds in a Steel Frame so far.

[Battis]

It does look like the cylinder and barrel were out of alignment, and the ball exited at that broken side point.
There's usually a market for individual parts, as you probably know.
https://www.gunpartscorp.com/gun-manufacturer/remington/black-powder-rev-rem/black-powder-replic

[Nobade]

The kid bought one of those at a gun show a number of years ago. The barrel was flattened, like it had been squeezed in a vise. I made a new barrel for it from a piece of 1913 Enfield barrel I had, with a silver dime for a front sight. That worked out fairly well, but those still were some very low quality guns. I'd try using a dremel or die grinder to cut away the expanded part of the barrel so it won't destroy the frame when you remove it, then examine the lockwork carefully to make sure it's actually coming up and locking when it's fired. It can be repaired, but may not be worth doing if you have to pay someone to do it. Oh, take a look to see if they actually cut a forcing cone in the barrel. I've seen way too many early repros that didn't have one and the ball would slam into the back of the barrel to produce what you have experienced.

[Anonym]

Looked at it a bit more last night. Yes, a forcing cone is present. The only thing I can think of is that some dried oil gummed up the stop long enough to miss the notch and allow the cylinder to over rotate.

I may try removing the barrel, and if I can without damaging it, I can reface the barrel breach and try replacing the forcing cone if I can set the shoulder back far enough to get a full rotation. Then I would just need to address the loading lever length change and hopefully be able to shoot it again.

[rintinglen]

With the grips off, the cylinder removed and the gun in a vise, grind away everything you can reach of the damaged forcing cone with a Dremel tool, being very careful not to hit the frame as you work. Soak the barrel frame junction with a good quality penetrating oil and let it set for a day or two. The barrel should then unscrew pretty easily. Then you hunt for a replacement, or fabricate and install a liner from a cut-off piece of a Mosin-Nagant rifle barrel.
Unless the gun has great personal value, it is not worth what it would cost for a Professional Gunsmith to repair this gun.

[GOPHER SLAYER]

Hang it on the wall. Don't but brass framed pistols.

[Nobade]

Hang it on the wall. Don't but brass framed pistols.

Aaw...they're really fun for hunting mice once you get them tuned up.

[Anonym]

Had nothing to do with it being brass framed. The bad indexing and the ball smashing into the side of the barrel would have done the same to a steel framed pistol. Barrels are the same on both models.

So I got it shootable again. Had to heat up the loading lever catch and remove it (soldered on) and then was able to remove the cylinder pin. A little heat and the barrel came off pretty easily. Once off, I refaced the breach of the barrel in a lathe to get all the damaged portion off. Then it was a matter of turning the shoulder and rebating the shank behind the threads until I got within range of the cylinder face and it indexed at 12 o’clock correctly.

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Then it was a matter of reworking the forcing cone and slowly trimming it to get an appropriate cylinder gap.

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Only thing left is the loading lever is now too long to fit if I replace the catch in the original location. I’m making a loading block for it, so I may find a way to retain the cylinder pin without the loading lever similar to how most people do when they cut down the 1858.

286149

Not a bad project! I have impressed myself… as long as it shoots again!

[Mk42gunner]

Glad to hear it.

What about just filing the base of the loading lever catch to match the barrel profile, then soldering it back on a bit closer to the muzzle?

The tiny little .31's are fun when they work right.

Robert

[358429]

Had nothing to do with it being brass framed. The bad indexing and the ball smashing into the side of the barrel would have done the same to a steel framed pistol. Barrels are the same on both models.

So I got it shootable again. Had to heat up the loading lever catch and remove it (soldered on) and then was able to remove the cylinder pin. A little heat and the barrel came off pretty easily. Once off, I refaced the breach of the barrel in a lathe to get all the damaged portion off. Then it was a matter of turning the shoulder and rebating the shank behind the threads until I got within range of the cylinder face and it indexed at 12 o’clock correctly.

286143
286144

Then it was a matter of reworking the forcing cone and slowly trimming it to get an appropriate cylinder gap.

286145
286146
286147
286148

Only thing left is the loading lever is now too long to fit if I replace the catch in the original location. I’m making a loading block for it, so I may find a way to retain the cylinder pin without the loading lever similar to how most people do when they cut down the 1858.

286149

Not a bad project! I have impressed myself… as long as it shoots again!That's awesome man!

I did not expect to see that, that's impressive.

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[Nobade]

Having your own lathe is a wonderful thing, isn't it? Good work. Now make sure that bolt fits the cylinder notches and it really locks up every time.

[Bent Ramrod]

Thats a nice save. Those little Remingtons are pretty fragile. I guess they wanted to have them go into a smaller pocket than the .31 Colts did.

I have the all-steel version, and I broke the web of the loading lever with a little too much force seating the ball in the cylinder. Got a new lever from VTI, but in the meantime, I made one of those loading stands, scaling it down from the one for my Uberti percussion Cattleman.

The accuracy range of mine seems to be the width of a card table, so I haven’t shot it much. But as a hideout gun it sure beats a Derringer.

[turtlezx]

nice machining work

[sharps4590]

That is a skillful repair, well done!

I have an 1849 an it shoots quite good....out to about 7 yards. I was shooting it at 25 yesterday and I was keeping it under a foot sized group.

[Anonym]

Thanks everyone. I put 2 cylinders through it this evening, being careful with each shot to verify proper rotation and lock up. Both cylinders went without issues. Now I just need to figure out a way to get the latch back on it.

[sharps4590]

Excellent!!! No doubt you'll solve the rammer challenge.

[Tar Heel]

Wow! For want of a lathe. Really nice work there on that little revolver. Want to tackle making an Arbor for a ASM Walker?

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[Anonym]

Ouch! That really stinks. I would love to try/help, but threads that aren’t in a tap and die set are not my friend. ��. This little lathe does decent, but not as precise as I would want either. Could be user error too.

[45 Dragoon]

Wow! For want of a lathe. Really nice work there on that little revolver. Want to tackle making an Arbor for a ASM Walker?

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That happened because the arbor was too short (they all are except for the originals and the last ten yrs +/- of Pietta offerings). VTI may have replacements.

Mike

[sharps4590]

Wow! For want of a lathe. Really nice work there on that little revolver. Want to tackle making an Arbor for a ASM Walker?

286211

That's just ugly...ouch! Any luck finding one?

[Green Frog]

The repairs on that little Remmy have you all set for a good cowboy card game. Just sit with your back away from the door and don't draw aces and eights! :bigsmyl2:

Froggie

[Der Gebirgsjager]

I had not seen this thread before. Good job, Anonym. Maybe that lever latch's present location is too close where the relocation would have to be? Kind of make one big useless hole? Is the original dovetailed into the barrel? If you could cut a new dovetail forward of the old one, then maybe you could solder a piece of metal in behind it where the old one was located to keep the new one in place. Just thinking...I don't have one of those, but do have a few BP revolvers.

DG

[Anonym]

Thanks DG. Yes, it's very close. I'm still debating on the correct repair. It's just a circular recess where the latch was soldered in. Cutting a new one (if I have the right size cutter) should make it look like a "8", so it should work. That's probably easier than cutting down the lever at this point.

[Good Cheer]

Aw, man, I was hoping you was gonna make it a revolving carbine!
:-P

[Alferd Packer]

I love shooting those old pistols.
I have easily made hot glue bullets for them using a bullet mould.
After the hot glue bullets have cured overnite, they can be loaded into the original cases and fired by primer alone thru these guns without pressure issues and can be fun.

Wax bullets , primer powered can also be utilized in these old
girls without pressure issues.
Those against shooting wax forget that canning wax is a petroleum product and is easily soluble in odorless paint thinners as well as gasoline.
The plastic hot glue bullets can also be used as a real function check prior to loading and shooting lead at least for alignment purposes to see if the barrel and cylinder are in time.
Just my 2 cents worth.
I like to keep them shooting.

[Nobade]

I love shooting those old pistols.
I have easily made hot glue bullets for them using a bullet mould.
After the hot glue bullets have cured overnite, they can be loaded into the original cases and fired by primer alone thru these guns without pressure issues and can be fun.

Wax bullets , primer powered can also be utilized in these old
girls without pressure issues.
Those against shooting wax forget that canning wax is a petroleum product and is easily soluble in odorless paint thinners as well as gasoline.
The plastic hot glue bullets can also be used as a real function check prior to loading and shooting lead at least for alignment purposes to see if the barrel and cylinder are in time.
Just my 2 cents worth.
I like to keep them shooting.
Huh? Ain't no cartridge cases with these revolvers.

[country gent]

I would plug the hole with a screw and locktie clean up flush and then redrill the new hole on location it looks like it will just barely hit the edge of the old hole.