Ford and Cummins Diesel

[GregLaROCHE]

My son just bought a 1999 Ford 350 heavy duty truck. It has a Cummins diesel and he said it was made before pollution restrictions, that is a good thing. He won’t tell me how many miles are on it or how much he paid. I know for his use, mostly pulling a heavy trailer now and then, It will probably work out for him.

I was wondering what kind of reputation these trucks with those diesel engins have.

[country gent]

I always thought Ford used the international diesel in their trucks and Dodge used the cummins diesel.

[Budzilla 19]

If that ‘99 F 350 has a Cummins diesel in it, it was put in there aftermarket. Country gent, you are correct as far as pickups go.Big trucks, it’s not a Cummins in the big Fords. Before I get hammered, at one time in Ford’s history of big trucks, they DID run Cummins in their trucks. When they quit, I don’t know. But, pickups?? Never had a Cummins in any one of their trucks as far I know.

[Jsm180]

1999 F-350 diesel came with a 7.3L V-8 Power Stroke, if it has a Cummins it was converted.

[rancher1913]

I seem to remember all our ford work trucks back in the 80's had cummins in them, and something about ford was going to buy them out, the buy out thing obviously did not happen and my memory may be a little off.

[zarrinvz24]

At one time Ford owned a controlling interest in Cummins stock, however that was many years ago. During the 1980’s Ford commited to IH, followed by Navistar to use their products in light duty diesels. The medium duty commercial trucks could be ordered without engine, with the end user installing their desired power plant. Ford user navistar engines until the 6.7 was released around 10 years ago.

[MUSTANG]

Concerning the 7.3 Liter Power Stroke (I have a 1997 F250 still going strong at 285,000 miles):


The History of the 7.3L Diesel Powerstroke Engine

The 7.3L Diesel Power Stroke engine had been used by International for Ford Trucks since 1993. More than one million had left the factory by 1999, with number two million being built by 2002. The name Power Stroke is reserved for Ford trucks and has set a new bar among the Big Three competitors.

The engine was included in the prestigious Diesel Power
Magazine’s Top 10 Diesel Engines Ever Produced. With more than two
million Ford trucks equipped with this engine, it beat the total number of Dodge, Chevy and
GMC diesel engines in just one lineup.

Specs

Displacement: 7.3L; 444 cubic inches
Configuration: V8
Compression Ratio: 17.5:1
Bore: 4.11"
Stroke: 4.18"
Injection: Direct injection; hydraulic electronic unit injection (HEUI)
Aspiration: Single turbocharger
Valve Train: OHV, two valves per cylinder
Oil Capacity: 14 to 15 quarts
Weight: Approximately 920 pounds dry
Horsepower (Peak): 275 HP @ 2,800 RPM
Torque (Peak): 525 foot pounds @ 1,600 RPM
*Peak is qualified by the highest rating given to this area during testing.

With the changes in emission regulations hitting engine production hard
in 2003, International had to pull the mighty Power Stroke off the
market, replacing it with a 6.0L Power Stroke. Though the 7.3L Diesel Power Stroke engine is no longer in production, it’s estimated there are around two million still on the road today.

The 7.3L is considered aging to today’s diesel technology, but it was a
major powerhouse in its heyday. Buyers of trucks with this engine love
the performance and heavy duty dedication the 7.3L Diesel Power Stroke
offers. It’s no wonder this engine beat out all the diesels its
competitors put out combined.

If you’re in the market for a hard working diesel engine you can trust,
check for a used 7.3L Diesel Power Stroke. Check with your local state
EPA regulations to find out if you need to perform any modifications.

https://www.ford-trucks.com/articles/the-history-of-the-7-3l-diesel-powerstroke-engine/

[kens]

never was a Cummins in a Ford pickup from the factory.

Ford's 7.3L was an international, and it had a good reputation
Dodge 'married' Cummins in 1989 and the horsepower race was on !
This left chevy in a far distant 3rd place at the time

[mexicanjoe]

I have a 7.3 IDI International Harvester engine in my '89 F-250, no turbo, but with 22 :1 compression, ya dont need it. ... Still runs good, a/c works, cant complain..... EASY TO WORK ON!.... Powerstrokes=not so much...

[jimlj]

Like others have said, if it has a Cummins, more than likely it was a conversion at some time.
I had a '99 with a 7.3 Power Stroke. I drove it over 200,000 miles with the only problem being a couple glow plug relays going bad. It was hard starting without the glow plugs.
I now have a '79 F250 that I installed a Cummins engine from a '89 Dodge. The Dodge showed 87,000 miles on the odometer, but the previous owner said he knew it had been around once and thought it may have been around twice. I've put 70,000 miles on it since then, so it has somewhere between 257 and 357 thousand miles on the engine. I don't have or anticipate any problem with the engine. I've heard stories of over a million miles on the Cummins engines, but I doubt I'll live long enough to find out if mine will go that far.

[Mal Paso]

I had a Ford with a cornbinder IDI Diesel, Cummins is an upgrade.

[bakerjw]

Just as a side note.
I used to contract into Caterpillar maintaining servers at their Mossville engine plant. Back in the early 2000's, they were working on their ACERT engine for on highway use. It used in series turbochargers to put 100PSI air into the cylinders. Emission regulations were getting so strict that they ended up dropping on highway engine production which IMHO was a shame because Cat was a top quality company.

Many afternoons if all servers were up and running with no issues, I'd put in earplugs and don safety glasses to walk different machining lines. Nothing like watching a gray rough cast block or head go through each machining station to come out as a part ready to assemble.

[Soundguy]

1999 F-350 diesel came with a 7.3L V-8 Power Stroke, if it has a Cummins it was converted.

Agreed.. it was an international design. Probably the best engine ford ever used... I have a 99 350 and a 99 450. Great engines.. can outlast the truck. A 25$ sensor can leave you on the side of the road.. so most owners travel with a spare one in the glove box with a chinese 10mm wrench taped to it. just get behind a front wheel and r&r the CPS.. back to driving. also watch the oil pan for salt erosion.. otherwise.. just common truck stuff.

[Dieselhorses]

I miss my 87 6.9 Navistar. They started the 7.3's in 88 which I think the only difference was they were bored out to 4.11. Ironically Ford did have almost 11% stock in Cummins from mid 90's to 2015. See here >>>>https://www.4btengines.com/rumor-mill-ford-owns-cummins/

[Three44s]

It’s too bad that Ford and Cummins never got together with respect to pick-ups.

The International Diesel engines are a good second place choice however.

The problems with Ford occurred when they went with Ford diesels. Not good!

Three44s

[Evoken]

Like others have said it would have come from the factory with a powerstroke. Putting a Cummins in would be a downgrade, no matter what anyone says. If it is in good shape, he paid big for it. The square bodies are going for huge money if they are nice anymore.

The 6.no and the 6.4 were junk unless you did some major work to them. The new 6.7 is a monster and once again blows the cummins out of the water. I am fairly biased, as I drive a 6.7, but I've run the dodge motors and they did not then (7.3)and still do not hold a candle to the powerstroke. The straight sixes just can't make the power that a big block V-8 does.

Ken

[Froogal]

If that ‘99 F 350 has a Cummins diesel in it, it was put in there aftermarket. Country gent, you are correct as far as pickups go.Big trucks, it’s not a Cummins in the big Fords. Before I get hammered, at one time in Ford’s history of big trucks, they DID run Cummins in their trucks. When they quit, I don’t know. But, pickups?? Never had a Cummins in any one of their trucks as far I know.

The Ford heavy duty trucks could be purchased with a Cummins, Caterpillar, or Detroit diesel engines.

[Gator 45/70]

I had I think a 97 F-250 7.3 diesel, Thing would get stuck in wet grass, When I sold it a few months later I made a grand off it.

[tryNto]

My son just bought a 1999 Ford 350 heavy duty truck. It has a Cummins diesel and he said it was made before pollution restrictions, that is a good thing. He won’t tell me how many miles are on it or how much he paid. I know for his use, mostly pulling a heavy trailer now and then, It will probably work out for him.

I was wondering what kind of reputation these trucks with those diesel engins have.

It is what's called a Fummins. Lots of conversions of this type have been made, it is most likely a 12 valve 5.9 Cummins, and it is a great combination that will provide lots of miles of use.
Have your son sign up at cumminsforum.com (http://cumminsforum.com) to learn everything he needs to know about that engine, there is also a good conversion section with many knowledgeable members. I am an Administrator there with the same user name.

[tryNto]

At one time Ford owned a controlling interest in Cummins stock, however that was many years ago.

Not so, that's an urban myth.

Cummins set the record straight in their May 2013 newsletter, outlining that Ford Motor Company had purchased 10.8% of the diesel engine manufacturer in 1990.
In 1997, those shares were bought back, and as such Ford has not owned a stake in Cummins since. Think of it as an investment for Ford, rather than a strategic partnership.
Beyond the medium-duty market, there are no additional ties between Ford and Cummins. If you were told that Ford owns or has owned Cummins, your source was blatantly incorrect.

https://www.dieselhub.com/news/ford-owns-cummins.html

[scattershot]

I had a 2000 Ford F250 Superduty, but it was a7.3L Navistar (International) diesel. Great truck. If your 99 has a Cummins diesel, I would surmise that it’s an aftermarket swap.

[jim147]

We used to pull the race trailer with a converted Chevy duelly with a Cummings in it. Never lacked power or left us stranded.

[GregLaROCHE]

I am trying to get more details as to what the engine is and how it got in the truck. I did get the information from his mother(my ex). In the original post I got it wrong. It’s a super duty, not heavy duty as I wrote. I’ll post when I get more details.

[GregLaROCHE]

I just heard back from my son. It’s an International 7.3 liters he thinks. I don’t know where his mother got the idea it was a Cummins. Sounds like the International should be a decent motor too. Anyone have more comments about them.

[Lloyd Smale]

son in law has been a diesel mechanic for almost 20 years. He drives a cummins dodge and say he doesnt like duramaxs and detests powerstokes. Say there more troublesome and harder to work on when they do break. As to power ran has an optional upgrade that puts torque at over a 1000 fps. How much power do you need in a pickup. Thats close to double what an over the road tractor trailer had 20 years ago and probably as much as a new one today. I trust him totaly. Theres not an ounce of bs in him. Not a died in the wool dodge cheerleader either. He owns a chev camaro and a v8 cadilac and has owned fords in the past too. He buys what he can get a deal on and fix up and resell it about a year later. Other then his trucks. He buys a truck its a dodge diesel period.

[Jsm180]

Send him here https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/forum31/

Good folks and lots of information.

[jgstrug]

Just to set the record straight:

"Engine" Engines are of internal combustion by design! "Internal combustion Engine"

Motors have cords and generally require electricity to operate!

Unless you have a long cord your vehicle does not have a "Motor", it has and "Engine"

Words mean things.

KenAgreed, but then why is it more acceptable for a boat engine to be called a motor [emoji848]

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk

[farmbif]

99 was one of the last years ford used good reliable diesel engines I guess.
I went to see a few 2009 -2011 450's that were being auctioned off from a nearby city. got to talking with the fleet manager who had worked there for something like 30+ years after a while chatting with him he flat out told me the ford 6.0, which came out after the 7.3, was probably the worst Diesel engine ever built.
in other words you probably don't want to spend your money on this thing.

[Jsm180]

99 was one of the last years ford used good reliable diesel engines I guess.
I went to see a few 2009 -2011 450's that were being auctioned off from a nearby city. got to talking with the fleet manager who had worked there for something like 30+ years after a while chatting with him he flat out told me the ford 6.0, which came out after the 7.3, was probably the worst Diesel engine ever built.
in other words you probably don't want to spend your money on this thing.

2009-2011 F series used the 6.4L, I'll be nice and say that engine is less than desirable. The 6.0L can be made just as reliable as the 7.3 with a little work and good preventative maintenance. My 03' 6.0 is pushing 240k miles and still running the original head gaskets and bolts. The key is understanding the engine and knowing how to work on it.

[Soundguy]

94.5 to 2003 was the Good 7.3

[scattershot]

That ‘99 is one of three years that no catalytic converter was required on the 7.3. Folks are paying a premium for them now. One of the best engines Ford ever put in a truck.

[GregLaROCHE]

That ‘99 is one of three years that no catalytic converter was required on the 7.3. Folks are paying a premium for them now. One of the best engines Ford ever put in a truck.

My son said he paid $7000 for it and it has 120k miles on lt. sounded like a good deal to me. It looks really clean. No body damage or rust.

He was asking if he should add anything to the fuel. What’s the current opinion on additives?

file:///var/mobile/Library/SMS/Attachments/33/03/E1ECAC32-9E42-4486-9DC0-1283B94296F6/64798255246__12B383A5-088E-4CD3-9974-0C53AFFE32CF.heic

[Soundguy]

I put a little hoses or Lucas fuel treatment in my diesels every 10 tanks or so. Biodiesel seem to have plenty of lube..but also more detergents.

[downzero]

Just to set the record straight:

"Engine" Engines are of internal combustion by design! "Internal combustion Engine"

Motors have cords and generally require electricity to operate!

Unless you have a long cord your vehicle does not have a "Motor", it has and "Engine"

Words mean things.

Ken

Actually an engine is a form of motor. All engines are motors, but not all motors are engines.

Engines also need not be internal combustion; by your definition steam engines are not engines.

[PhilC]

My brother bought a brand new F250 SD SuperCab with the 6.0 in 2003. He ran it hard for a few years, chipped it, and ran it even harder. It's still running great today, now with over 300k on the odometer, and nothing in the drive train has ever been touched. Sold it to his company and is used daily in their HVAC business as a service vehicle.

[Jsm180]

My son said he paid $7000 for it and it has 120k miles on lt. sounded like a good deal to me. It looks really clean. No body damage or rust.

He was asking if he should add anything to the fuel. What’s the current opinion on additives?

file:///var/mobile/Library/SMS/Attachments/33/03/E1ECAC32-9E42-4486-9DC0-1283B94296F6/64798255246__12B383A5-088E-4CD3-9974-0C53AFFE32CF.heic

I run this https://www.amazon.com/Genuine-Ford-Compliant-Performance-Improver/dp/B000NUAFH0/ref=sr_1_5?crid=2VTCJ9JFTBOAN&dchild=1&keywords=pm22&qid=1626298512&sprefix=pm22%2Caps%2C370&sr=8-5

No idea if it helps anything other than piece of mind. Seems to be the same as a product made by Gold Eagle.

[Gator 45/70]

What would be the perfect truck?
Cummings diesel
Allison transmission
The ride like a Ford ?

[Mal Paso]

What would be the perfect truck?
Cummings diesel
Allison transmission
The ride like a Ford ?

Don't think even Allison will last as long as a Cummins. I like my 6 speed and with the exhaust brake awesome. I keep reaching for the exhaust brake in the Subaru and it isn't there.

[Mal Paso]

What would be the perfect truck?
Cummings diesel
Allison transmission
The ride like a Ford ?

Don't think even Allison will last as long as a Cummins. I like my 6 speed and with the exhaust brake awesome. I keep reaching for the exhaust brake in the Subaru and it isn't there.

I had a 1985 6.9 IDI Ford that made 160 HP. A head gasket went at 170K and the engine didn't make it to 200K. The fuel injection pump had plastic parts and was located between the cylinder heads where it cooked. They would quit without warning. I changed one on the side of the freeway in less than an hour, I wouldn't go anywhere without a spare.

The 5.9 Cummins makes 325 HP can be chipped to 600 and broke a belt tensioner at 220K miles.

[GregLaROCHE]

What does the term “being chipped” refer to. Seems like it increases power.

[jimlj]

To my knowledge there aren't any CUMMINGS engines. Clessie Cummins started building diesel engines around 1919 and the company that uses his name sells about 20 billion dollars worth of products each year.

[rbuck351]

A chip is a computer that reconfigures fuel timing, fuel amount, transmission shift points, amount and timing of turbo boost and probably some other stuff. Dodge Cummins started with 24 valve computer controlled engines at mid year 1998. I bought my 98 1/2 Dodge Cummins used and it came with an Edge tuner ( chip). With chip turned off it is stock at 210hp and some 400+ lbs ft of torque. Chip turned on it has about 350hp and 600lbs ft of torque. There are other things that can be done for more power such as high output pump, bigger injectors, bigger exhaust, better air filter, propane injector and such stuff.
My sons 5.9 is probably 450hp and one of his friends has one with 700+hp. There's no end to what you can do if you have the money.

The auto trasmissions with the 5.9 will not last unless they are built by someone that knows what they are doing. The newer trucks, Dodge, Ford and Chevy are all putting out a lot of hp and torque but the price has went way beyond what I can afford so I'll drive my old Dodge for another 20 years and call it money well spent.

[Mal Paso]

What does the term “being chipped” refer to. Seems like it increases power.

Power is limited mostly for mileage/ air quality and fuel injection is computer controlled. Hardware (chip) and software can be added to increase power. Which puts more strain on the truck which doesn't last as long..... Basically you are overfueling.

I was going uphill about 3000 feet and put my foot in it to pass a log truck in a short passing lane. The acceleration was more than I expected and when I looked back the log truck was gone, all you could see was black smoke, overfueled. My truck is stock and the computer made a mistake that one time.

[Jsm180]

What does the term “being chipped” refer to. Seems like it increases power.

Computer is reprogrammed, 7.3's used a module/chip that plugs into the obd port, later trucks use a tuner to change the programming. Some are good, others not so much, and a few will shorten the life of the engine and or transmission.

[Lloyd Smale]

Just to set the record straight:

"Engine" Engines are of internal combustion by design! "Internal combustion Engine"

Motors have cords and generally require electricity to operate!

Unless you have a long cord your vehicle does not have a "Motor", it has and "Engine"

Words mean things.

Ken

HUM dont they call them motorcycles and out board motors???

motor
[ˈmōdər]
NOUN
a machine, especially one powered by electricity or internal combustion, that supplies motive power for a vehicle or for some other device with moving parts.

[wolfwing]

never was a Cummins in a Ford pickup from the factory.


Not true. In the early 2000's Ford did offer the Cummins in their 450 and 550 series pick ups. Some trucks wore a Sterling badge.

[Lloyd Smale]

What does the term “being chipped” refer to. Seems like it increases power.

chipped came from back when automotive computers had actual chips in them with programing that to change programing you popped out on chip and stuck in another. For the most part now a computer has to be taken out of the car or truck and plugged into another computer to change programing. Matter of fact most of them are factory locked to prevent reprograming. But most of the locks are eventually figured out and unlocked to allow reprograming. There is usually a lot more power to gain in a diesels computer then a gas motor. gas motors are lucky to pick up 10hp with a tuner. maybe 30 with a real dyno tune. Diesel motors a 100hp is easy and like was said with a few other parts and a tuner even 300hp is doable. But go that far and good chance you will have to upgrade your transmission at minimum. We had one guy with a duramax at a car shot dyno last year do 1060hp and he said it wasnt even turned up all the way. But he had bigger tubos bigger intercooler bigger injectors and a well built transmission. But to this old gas hot rod guy that was awful impressive. This years show they had a sign up NO DIESELS

[jgstrug]

Just as a side note.
I used to contract into Caterpillar maintaining servers at their Mossville engine plant. Back in the early 2000's, they were working on their ACERT engine for on highway use. It used in series turbochargers to put 100PSI air into the cylinders. Emission regulations were getting so strict that they ended up dropping on highway engine production which IMHO was a shame because Cat was a top quality company.

Many afternoons if all servers were up and running with no issues, I'd put in earplugs and don safety glasses to walk different machining lines. Nothing like watching a gray rough cast block or head go through each machining station to come out as a part ready to assemble.Exactly correct, I worked for a Caterpillar dealer at that time and Cat had been steadily gaining market share, EPA regulations being able to kill the whole thing is amazing to me especially when you see kids rolling coal in a pickup that costs over 50k!

Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk

[farmbif]

2009-2011 F series used the 6.4L, I'll be nice and say that engine is less than desirable. The 6.0L can be made just as reliable as the 7.3 with a little work and good preventative maintenance. My 03' 6.0 is pushing 240k miles and still running the original head gaskets and bolts. The key is understanding the engine and knowing how to work on it.

the 450's I was looking at were cut aways and they had the 6.0 in them
I'm no expert but the fleet manager I met sure is. after learning what I can about them
I'd much rather have a 7.3 which when cared for I guess is a 1/2 million mile engine or more

[Gator 45/70]

Thought I saw a Toyota truck awhile back with a Cummings diesel badge on the fender, Anyone?

[Soundguy]

What does the term “being chipped” refer to. Seems like it increases power.

Chipped used to refer to an actual ecm or gem module chip that changed engine parameters. Nowadays it usually means you used a programmer to change ( store original and replace?) The engine control parameters. Everything from shift points to timing..

[Soundguy]

Computer is reprogrammed, 7.3's used a module/chip that plugs into the obd port, later trucks use a tuner to change the programming. Some are good, others not so much, and a few will shorten the life of the engine and or transmission.

My 7.3's used a chip that went into the ecm not the obd. I have since removed them. I reprogrammed with a super chips tuner. Didn't have to remove the ecm... Just plug into obd, save original program, send new program. Takes 5 minutes.

[jimlj]

I dun drived my CumminGS powered Ford truk to the EvINGston wyomin libary.

[Gator 45/70]

Neighbor has a Dodge 2015 4x4 Fiat diesel, He loves it !

[PhilC]

Thought I saw a Toyota truck awhile back with a Cummings diesel badge on the fender, Anyone?
Bet it was Nissan, the Titan XD is Cummins powered. I've seen a few, first one made me look twice.

[Gator 45/70]

Bet it was Nissan, the Titan XD is Cummins powered. I've seen a few, first one made me look twice.

You're probably correct about the Nissan, Same here I'm like what the heck?

[rbuck351]

The Edge tuner on my 5.9 Dodge has 5 stages of power and each stage has 5 levels of programming for the different areas. Different trans shift points, different turbo boost levels, different injector timing and flow and so forth. It is plugged in line with the ecm and pcm and can be turned off or on with buttons on the Edge box in the cab. The different levels are also adjustable from the in cab tuner.
The truck has had a tranny rebuild with better parts and clutch pressure turned up and a special TQ. It has a bit over 200,000 miles and I think I can get another 200,000 on the motor/tranny.

The stock tranny is good for up to about 280hp. After that you have to have it built or your lucky to get 100,000 from the tranny.