Trimmed .45 Colt Brass and .45 S&W Schofield Dies?

[Liberty1776]

On another thread, I asked why a bunch of used .45 Colt brass I bought had been trimmed down to oddball lengths.

The best answer, I felt, was that the reloader was trimming split cases down to save the brass, and that I should trim them all to 1.1" (.45 S&W Schofield length) and load them as Schofield.

Question:

Will a Lee .45 S&W Schofield die set work with trimmed .45 Colt brass?

The Colt spec has brass .005" bigger.

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I'd move to the single stage Rock Chucker press for this operation. Should I just use another set of .45 Colt dies? Is that possible with the shorter brass?

[nhyrum]

I'd just use the 45 Colt dies. As an example, not many die manufacturers make 454 casull dies, because there really no reason to. 38 special and 357 Magnum use the same dies. I load 45 Colt with my rcbs 454 casull dies all the time. If the ammo is going in a 45 Colt cylinder, 45 Colt dies will work and i wouldn't be worried about the difference in measurement. If it was in a Scofield cylinder, I'd be a bit more hesitant, but nothing wrong with trying and seeing if they fit the cylinder.

A reason they could be cut down(maybe this was mentioned) is the goat ftx says you need to cut the case down to meet oal and not have the bullet too far inside the case, but all that brass should be cut to the same measurement, and you mention that they were cut randomly.

It is interesting that the Scofield has a smaller diameter at the web, but a larger rim diameter though. Seems a little backwards.

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[Liberty1776]

I'd just use the 45 Colt dies. [snip] If the ammo is going in a 45 Colt cylinder, 45 Colt dies will work [snip]. If it was in a Scofield cylinder, I'd be a bit more hesitant.

[snip] you mention that they were cut randomly.



I think the original owner was a Cowboy Action Shooter and was trying to save his brass as it split. But reloading random lengths is tough. All different adjustment for expanding, seating depths and crimping.

These are the lengths by headstamp:

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[nhyrum]

I agree with trimming them all the same and reloading as Scofield, I forgot to mention that in my first post.

I would say that you could cut them to a length just shorter than minimum and adjust for a crimp there, keeping a standard oal, and load normally as Colt loads, but there's enough that are just way too short for that(I wouldn't cut anything shorter than what the starline is, about 1.270 is as short as I'd go). Cutting them all down to Scofield length makes the most sense and will be safest.

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[Der Gebirgsjager]

Yours is a great question, and one I'm sure others have wondered about. The answers so far are enlightening, and probably spot on. If it was cut down to load for a Schofield, then it would all best be the same length. A Schofield trim die would assure that, but probably hard to find right now. If they're Schofield length, then I'd go for it with the .45 Colt dies, and believe there's a high probability of success. If you could round up some Schofield dies, then so much the better; but again, hard to come by right now. If the brass is different, random lengths, then the thought that someone was trying to salvage brass with necks that had split is a good one. In that case, I'd be inclined to just scrap the brass, as it been through a useful life cycle and probably won't last long for you.

DG

[Liberty1776]

In that case, I'd be inclined to just scrap the brass, as it been through a useful life cycle and probably won't last long for you.

DG

I'm sure the brass was shot a lot, and sometime with black powder. Some were green on the inside. I know for sure some of his reloads have BP in them because I disassembled them for inspection. I shot some tests and they fired fine. By weight and bullet type, none were overloaded. I'm sure just a SASS shooter stretching his brass supply.

I'm keeping this trick in mind for the future, as brass gets harder and harder to find.

[AntiqueSledMan]

Hello Liberty1776,

I know LEE used to list the individual parts of their die sets.
They listed 45 Colt, 45 Schofield, and 454 Casull as all using a SD2181 Steel Die and the 45 Colt and 454 Casull as using a 90533 Carbide Die.
They don't list any Carbide Die for the 45 Schofield.
Shooting out of a 45 Colt chamber, I'd just size with a 45 Colt Die and probably use a 45 Shofield seat die.

AntiqueSledMan.

[Harter66]

Sled Man hit it . Odds are , even if you have a Schofield chamber , the Colts dies will size plenty . More so if you're using carbide dies .

I have 45 ACP , S&W , Mag , and Colts die sets and the S&W chambers were cut with a 45 ACP reamer as near as I can tell .

The more you size the case the shorter the life . There may still be a set of 45 Mag steel dies for sale in Swapping and Selling . A guy had 2-3 sets up not long ago and not many hits . In this regard of course it comes down to your chamber .

[Liberty1776]

Finally got the pilot worked out for the Forster (but that's another thread).

Trimmed the oddball shorter 45 Colts to 1.106 or so. .45 S&W Schofield spec. Deburred with a Lyman Case Prep Multi tool.

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B004MCMCYE/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

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Loaded using two of the three Lee 45 Colt dies.

The Sizer worked on the shorter brass.

The seat/crimper worked on the shorter brass.

The Expander/Powder-thru die did not go short enough.

So I belled the case mouths with a Lee Universal Expander Die.

Loaded with Winchester WLP primers and 3.5 grains of Trail Boss, then seated/crimped the Lyman 452389 180 grain button bullet in one action using the Lee die.

The load was called out at Hodgdon for a 180-grain bullet in 45 ACP brass. Should be close.

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"Schofield" Length .45 Colt vs Full Size Colt Case; Lyman 180 grain 452389 with wax lube.

[AntiqueSledMan]

Hello Liberty1776,

Looks like you've got it figured out.
I can see why those didn't feed very well in your 1911.
Looks like your revolver should like them.
You know some guys shoot the Cowboy 45 brass, same length at a 45 ACP.

AntiqueSledMan.

[Liberty1776]

Hello Liberty1776,


You know some guys shoot the Cowboy 45 brass, same length at a 45 ACP.

AntiqueSledMan.

One of our CAS Wild Bunch guys even shoots .45ACP in his .45 Winchester 1873. Had a special mod done to the carrier. Seems to work well.

[Baltimoreed]

Case wall thickness as the brass is cut shorter would be my only concern. Could cause issues with a tight chamber. I have enough brass that loads that get by me when I’m loading with a beginning crack at the mouth become yard loads and then get recycled.