well..I'm consistent...

[wolfdog]

I'm having the same issue in both cals. In 380acp I'm shooting both jacketed and cast round nose style bullets. They have very similar weights and profiles. However, the jacketed are shooting ok, and the cast is hanging up just out of battery. I've checked mouth size, looked for bulges and made sure that single shots lock the slide back. I "plunk" test them by dropping them in the bbl and making sure they chamber, I hand cycle them and they cycle fine, but as soon as it's live shooting, I'm getting constant failure to feeds, a good smack on the slide seats most of them. On ejection, I'm getting damage around the back edge of the bullet where it looks like it's contacting the rifling. Worst part is, the EXACT same issue is happening in 45acp. I'm thinking maybe the bullet is yanking forward on chambering and ramming into the lands? But other than that, I can't for the life of me figure out why they would only do this on firing and not on hand working the action. I tried seating them deeper but got to some pretty silly depths with the same issue. Maybe my bullet is a bit too fat (.356 in the 380) and the leading edge is catching the end of the chamber? But I would think hand cycling would show that.. Any ideas cause I'm at a loss.

[Dusty Bannister]

What bullet mold are you using? Alloy again? Cartridge OAL as determined by dowel method or just keep seating deeper and crimping til it plunks? Clean and lightly oiled? .356" should not be a problem in the .380 but what kind is it?

[wolfdog]

It's the lee 100 ish grain round nose in the 380, I've worked OAL all the way from .980 down to .900 which started to scare me and is way too short for that to be the issue. It's passing the "plunk" test. It's bumble lubed in LLA so not cleaned. The 45acp is the lee 255grn flat tip round nose. I've also tried the flat tip round nose lee 95grn bullet in the 380, same results.

[tankgunner59]

Are you belling the case mouths before seating the cast bullets? If so, are you taper crimping them after seating?
I had a problem like this with my wife's LCP and did the same with OAL. Then I tried taper crimping just a bit more and it corrected my problem.

[wolfdog]

I am belling the case just enough and I'm using the combo seat/crimp die to just take out the bell.

[lesharris]

You might try the LEE carbide factory crimp die and see if that helps.

[Minerat]

I have had the same issues with 40 S&W. I found that seating then taper crimping solved the problem. When I was doing it in one step I fought the feeding problem. I use the progressive to load then remove the seating die and adjust to crimp on the rock chucker. Extra step but it works.

[Walks]

Try Taper Crimp.
I load all Semi-Auto pistol cartridges that way. From .32ACP to .45ACP, all function fine. pass the "plunk" test too.

[wolfdog]

Try Taper Crimp.
I load all Semi-Auto pistol cartridges that way. From .32ACP to .45ACP, all function fine. pass the "plunk" test too.

I pass the "plunk" test, just not the will it chamber from mag while shooting test. So does seating and crimping in two steps make a difference, and is a factory crimp die needed/the thing?

[Walks]

Have you checked the ramps for smoothness. Something is causing the hang up. Does it happen with all magazines. I number all magazines, so I can easily tell if one is causing problems. Weird as it is there might actually be one mag for each pistol that is screwing up.
When you pull back the slide manually it gets a bit more force going forward then you do when the pistol feeds "itself" during operation.
I don't care for the Lee factory crimp die. It will size down the diameter of a bullet when used.

[wolfdog]

For the 380, I can get 3 out of the 4 guns to shoot well with a seating depth change, but I had a Kahr CW380 that just gives me fits, so much so that I've decided to trade it in for a ruger LCP2. My MP shield, browning 1911 and keltec P3AT all had a sweet spot I could find, it was the Kahr that was an issue, the 45, we only have the Sig, but as I was having the same problem, I thought maybe it was something I was doing wrong for both guns. The fact that the edges get chewed up on the chambered rounds makes me wonder if my crimp is weak and the rounds are pulling forward, but I would think they would be seated back by the feeding ramp...so I'm again confused.

[jim147]

I pass the "plunk" test, just not the will it chamber from mag while shooting test. So does seating and crimping in two steps make a difference, and is a factory crimp die needed/the thing?

The plunk test normally does it but you could have a enough case thickness and length variation that seating and crimping in two steps might fix it.

[sigep1764]

Seating and crimping in separate steps is usually the rule. I bought a separate RCBS taper crimp die for 38 special because that set of dies is Lee. The dillon dies in 380 and 9mm seat and crimp separately. Much easier to adjust the crimp only and not have to adjust the seating depth stem at the same time.

[dverna]

Use a micrometer to check the diameter at the case mouth of you factory loads and reloads.

Also, when you get a FTF check the diameter and see how it compares to those rounds that are feeding fine. BTW, I use a separate die to crimp. The standard factory crimp die should be all you need if adjusted properly.

[wolfdog]

Ok, I will try the seat/crimp in two steps, rather than mess with moving the die up and down and the seating stem, I may just buy a second seater die, set one to seat the bullet and the second to crimp only. It's a bit of extra cost, but I bet it's more consistent than moving the die and bullet seater every time I load.

[Mr_Sheesh]

Hey, wolfdog

You say "On ejection, I'm getting damage around the back edge of the bullet where it looks like it's contacting the rifling.", I'm not sure what you mean there, as the bullet should be way downrange by ejection time :) Do you mean that the case mouth is contacting the rifling, or ???

[onelight]

I have never had a bullet in an auto move forward when chambering . This should not be a problem if you are using a proper die set .
When you are doing your plunk test , your barrel out of your gun . When you drop your loaded cartridge in the barrel you should be able to press the cartridge down in the barrel hard with you thumb and it still drop out when you point the barrel up or with a minor shake . If the ogive is not a match for your chamber and the thumb pressure forces the bullet into the rifling you have 3 options .
1 , seat deeper and adjust your powder charge for this.
2 , find a bullet that will chamber at the OAL you are trying.
3 , have your barrel modified to accept that bullet at that OAL.
When doing your plunk test the cartridge should make a sound just like a factory load does when plunking it :)

[gwpercle]

I am belling the case just enough and I'm using the combo seat/crimp die to just take out the bell.

Try adding more crimp .
Life is easier with truncated cone designed boolits . RN and RF can give you problems ...most new guns have little or no no throat and the TC design can give less grief.
Keep working them ... sometimes it takes a while for everything to get worked out . You can always have the barrel throated to give you more room to work with ... contact member DougGuy for this .
Gary

[Thumbcocker]

I agree. Try more crimp.

[jimb16]

I don't see what firearm you are loading for. I can tell you this....certain firearms do not like longer narrower bullet noses and will hang up badly. A shorter bullet nose feeds easily. So, my questions to you are what firearm and what is the bullet ogive, 1 r or 2 r?

[wolfdog]

No, I mean if it doesn't feed and I hand eject a live round. The lead right up near the case mouth is chewed up, sometimes leading to difficult extraction.

[onelight]

Is it possible that some of your cases are long enough that you are scraping lead from the bullet as you seat and crimp in one step ?
And I am not sure how rounds that pass the barrel plunk test can keep the guns from going into battery in two different pistols / calibers .
If empty resized cases plunk and the slide will go into battery with them in the chamber then I would say the problem has to be the combined bullet case dia. , or OAL , or ogive shape , or crimp so light it does not remove flare , or so heavy it is scraping a ring of lead at the case mouth when seating and crimping in same step on some cases.
Case length/ thickness is more of an issue when seating and crimping in the same step with bullets with no crimp groove . Separate crimp dies for auto pistols simplify life :)
I can't think of anything else , but 2 different cartridge/bullet/gun combinations with the same problem it is probably something simple in your process

[wolfdog]

My Lee .356-102RN are a 1R bullet.

[wolfdog]

That's what I'm thinking and I bet I'm crimping too light, I'm doing just enough to remove the bell..maybe I'm not removing the entire bell? I'm going to try more crimp, slowly, lol.

[Mr_Sheesh]

Sounds like a plan.

[Three44s]

I would rather buy a dedicated crimp die such as a Lee or better still the Redding profile crimp die in taper style than a second seater die.

If the same seater die adjusted differently is the ticket I would run your original seater twice for a while before going and pulling the “trigger” (wallet) on number two.

Three44s

[mdi]

If the rounds plunk and drop out, the problem probably is elsewhere. The 1R Lee molds have been reported to pose problems in this area mainly because the fat profile. The 45 ACP RN 1R needs to be seated way deeper than a 2R to chamber cleanly. If there are marks on the bullet after feeding and extracting, the bullet is obviously hitting the end of the chamber/rifling...

[wolfdog]

Correct, I just can't figure out why since they don't on seating, perhaps I'm just not putting enough thumb pressure on them. But I don't want to chase ten options at once, first I'll reset everything and pick one cal/bullet/gun and work with the crimp. What do you guys think of the RCBS 356637 147grn 9mm mold? I've got a Hellcat, given the short 3" bbl, I'm thinking a 147grn 9mm may be just the ticket?

[jimb16]

As always, it depends on what your firearm likes. I have a Hi-Power that won't shoot accurately with any bullets except in the 124-125 gr range. My friend's won't shoot worth SH with those bullets, but it loves the 147 grainers. Its always worth a try.

[sigep1764]

Correct, I just can't figure out why since they don't on seating, perhaps I'm just not putting enough thumb pressure on them. But I don't want to chase ten options at once, first I'll reset everything and pick one cal/bullet/gun and work with the crimp. What do you guys think of the RCBS 356637 147grn 9mm mold? I've got a Hellcat, given the short 3" bbl, I'm thinking a 147grn 9mm may be just the ticket?

If you wanna shoot 147 grainers, Accurate and NOE have the proper nose profile boolits to do it. Look at the Elco mold on NOE's website. Accurate has similar profiles. They are stepped so seating deep isn't necessary.

[wolfdog]

Update, 45acp is shooting outstanding with 230grn lee swc seated right at the edge of the taper with just enough "crimp" to take out my flair. And the 9mm LOVES 120grn (124 from my alloy) seated the same way. Both are 100% functional and hitting solidly to POA/POI. My 380s, I ditched the Kahr, it hung up on everything and just wasn't trustworthy as a carry gun, ended up with a Ruger LCP2 instead. LCP2, P3AT and Smith 380EZ are eating both the RN and the Round nose flat point bullets. 1911-380 is still giving me some issues but I'm closing in on it's sweet spot. The RN (which is the 1r that seems to give everyone issues) needs to be seated so deep that it jumps out of the mag in the 1911. However the 95grn Flat Tip RN Tumble Lube design feeds in everything and hits about 99grns with my allow. My only issue is that it's not locking the slide on the 1911. I'm betting 100grn jacketed load data isn't giving me the same pressure as 99grn cast and I need to go up just a couple tenths of a grain..if I can get slide lock back..I'm set on everything. Special thanks to Dusty Bannister for sending me some bullet profiles to try and pushing me in the correct direction. I did get the 120 grain TC bullets that the 9mm likes to shoot from all the 380s. However it casts at 124grns from my allow and Hodgdon was not too happy with my load data. Though it shot well and I got no pressure signs, they felt it was highly unsafe so I'll stay clear...no matter how much I really really want to shoot 124grn bullets in my 380.

[jim147]

Sounds good. Do they they make a pound or two lighter recoil spring for the Colt? If everything else is working might be worth a try.

[wolfdog]

Sounds good. Do they they make a pound or two lighter recoil spring for the Colt? If everything else is working might be worth a try.

It's a browning, and I'm not sure. But even Hodgdon said my load was a bit on the light side for a 100grn cast. And I'm really close, they suggested I could go up half a grain and be safe..and I don't think it'll take half a grain. On the good side, I've been working on one gun at a time and then taking them all to the range to make sure previous success wasn't just a lucky day. Today I took the 45acp, 9mm, and all 4 380s to the range and at 7 yards you could cover a full mag from each with your fist. Not target shooting, but I feel like all this work really got me some needed practice. I had the failure to lock back on the 1911-380 and other than that 100% success.

[slim1836]

It's a browning, and I'm not sure. But even Hodgdon said my load was a bit on the light side for a 100grn cast. And I'm really close, they suggested I could go up half a grain and be safe..and I don't think it'll take half a grain. On the good side, I've been working on one gun at a time and then taking them all to the range to make sure previous success wasn't just a lucky day. Today I took the 45acp, 9mm, and all 4 380s to the range and at 7 yards you could cover a full mag from each with your fist. Not target shooting, but I feel like all this work really got me some needed practice. I had the failure to lock back on the 1911-380 and other than that 100% success.

I'd say that was a great day at the range.

Slim

[Thumbcocker]

Good job staying with it. Enjoy your success.

[Hanzy4200]

Sounds like a tight chamber throat. I've dealt with this many times in many calibers. Your options are, find a different mold, or seat your bullet deeper. If you are seeing marks on the bullet itself, it's not a crimping issue. The cast bullet is .001-.003 larger than the jacketed, and is getting squeezed tight going into the chamber. .380's are nearly as bad as 9MM's when it comes to variances. There are so many models spanning dozens of countries and 100 years.