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View Full Version : MP 452-200 FN NG boolit sizing and OAL



oley55
04-15-2021, 01:52 PM
Bullets will be used in a Colt 1911 GOVT model, slugged and mic'ed at .4507". Alloy is COWW with 1.5% tin added producing 13+ BHN (via pencil). Powder coated unsized diameter is .456", (I don't recall what the as cast size was, but they ran heavier than expected at nearly 225gr.

I casted and PC'd about 400 of the MP 452-200 FN NG boolits approximately five weeks ago. My NOE push thru sizers have finally arrived and I sized about a 100 last night with the following results:

Initially I used the NOE B453 sizer, but the bullets were measuring close to .454", so I shifted to the NOE B452 sizer. I most definitely did use lube to ease the sizing effort. The .452" sizer is producing mic measured .4527"-.4528" boolits. I broke out my pin gauges and determined the sizers are NOT oversized. In fact the .452" minus pin gauge would not quite pass through the B452 die. I will note those grooveless bullets required a good bit of effort to size in my Rock Chucker.

My thought or guess is the larger sizes are related to alloy spring-back and/or the lack of grooves for the lead to flow into. I even ran a few through twice and did size off a wee bit more, but not enough to really matter. Question about spring-back, would there be less spring-back if the bullets had been sized within a day or two of casting and coating? Or should I (hope not) size before PC and then again after PC-ing? Kind of wish I had ordered a .451" sizer bushing just to see what size they would produce.

Can someone provide a target COAL range I should aim for before plunk and function checking dummy rounds?

Side note: I guess the larger than expected sizes may come in handy should I decide to load cast boolits for my early 1980's Llama 1911 which has a .454" barrel. But I suspect case bulging will be ridiculous and that's a road best left with the blood blisters it produces.

fredj338
04-15-2021, 02:56 PM
I think you are over thinking things a bit. Final size, not a huge issue +/- 0.0005". I cast from pretty much range scrap, 10bhn+/-, I dont really care. I size 0.452" for all my guns, dont really care to have custtom ammo for 6 diff 45acp. All will shoot 3" or better out to 25y, better than I can do most days.
OAL, as always bullet & bbl specific. What works in my gun may not in yours. So make a dummy round, load it a bit long & chamber it. If it chambers, you are gtg. If not, start seating 0.010" deeper until the easily chamber. Then check that all the way down in the mag.

Burnt Fingers
04-15-2021, 04:14 PM
Cut that alloy 1:1 with pure lead and shoot it. The 45 ACP doesn't need lead that hard.

I load for over a dozen 45 ACP firearms ranging in age from over 100 years old to new this year. I size to .452 and shoot.

gwpercle
04-15-2021, 06:26 PM
Cut that alloy 1:1 with pure lead and shoot it. The 45 ACP doesn't need lead that hard.

I load for over a dozen 45 ACP firearms ranging in age from over 100 years old to new this year. I size to .452 and shoot.

I second this motion ...plus you are Powder Coating so hardness not that big an issue . Softer boolits will help ease the sizing difficulty ... grooves in a boolit give the alloy a place to go when you are sizing down... all this hoopla about No Grooves isn't the wonderful thing you think it to be ... No Grooves has a downside ... blood blisters from sizing the things .
Gary

oley55
04-15-2021, 08:16 PM
I second this motion ...plus you are Powder Coating so hardness not that big an issue . Softer boolits will help ease the sizing difficulty ... grooves in a boolit give the alloy a place to go when you are sizing down... all this hoopla about No Grooves isn't the wonderful thing you think it to be ... No Grooves has a downside ... blood blisters from sizing the things .
Gary

LOL on the blisters. Sure am glade I put a cue ball on my handle, otherwise...?

So my aged bullets are not the issue, just the hard alloy. It seems doubtful I would buy another no lube groove mold again. a newbe miscalculation.

I’m out now and do not recall my final COAL, but it is .015” shorter than my just fit plunk length. My think being a perfect fit in a perfectly clean chamber could be an issue as it fouls up a bit.

PapaJ
04-16-2021, 11:47 AM
It may be just me, but I would think that if you are trying to size down from .454 to .452, and your bullets are still coming out too large, you may want to consider casting to a smaller diameter or softer alloy. You seem to be getting a lot of "spring back" during sizing. It could also be your powder coat thickness.

Quality over Quantity

oley55
04-16-2021, 01:52 PM
[QUOTE=Burnt Fingers;5168958]Cut that alloy 1:1 with pure lead and shoot it. The 45 ACP doesn't need lead that hard.

I load for over a dozen 45 ACP firearms ranging in age from over 100 years old to new this year. I size to .452 and shoot.[/QUOTE

Are you suggesting I can run softer 50/50 .452" sized bullets through my 454" Llama barrel without leading?

Burnt Fingers
04-16-2021, 02:20 PM
[QUOTE=Burnt Fingers;5168958]Cut that alloy 1:1 with pure lead and shoot it. The 45 ACP doesn't need lead that hard.

I load for over a dozen 45 ACP firearms ranging in age from over 100 years old to new this year. I size to .452 and shoot.[/QUOTE

Are you suggesting I can run softer 50/50 .452" sized bullets through my 454" Llama barrel without leading?

Nope. But you can run softer 455 bullets through it.