Questions on 7mm case heads

[Handloader109]

I've been accumulating what I need to reload for 7x57 mauser that I obtained from a member here.
I have about 30 cases all marked 7x57 from a couple of manufacturers and the all go through my Lee shell holders
(have one for std lee press and a x holder for the APP)

Got some from another member today and they are all marked Hornady brass, all 7x57, but half of the brass won't go through the holders.
The ring above the rim is 0.020 larger on half the brass. I examined and the 'newer' brass has a distinct bevel above the rim, but the brass that won't fit holder doesn't. But that brass looks very similar to the first cases that fit. Kind of strange to me.
Should I look for another brand shell holder? Which right now is pretty hard to find anything.
I'll post picture.

[Handloader109]

left case won't fit, 0.020 and right will.....https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210407/0d2bc5c7e334149a263280c13eeb84ec.jpg

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[Jedman]

I once bought a new bag of 50 Winchester brand brass in 284 Winchester and had about half of them not fit my shell holders and I have probably 5 or 6 for that case head. I called Winchester and told them of the problem.
They had me send them the cases that wouldn’t fit so I sent them about 15- 20 and they sent me 2 bags of new brass ( 100 ) for my trouble. I had sold the rifle I was using them in so I sold the brass they sent also so I never opened the bags to see if they had the same trouble .

Jedman

[Bad Ass Wallace]

Not unusual, take 6,5x55 - Norma cases only fit an RCBS No.2 while PMC & Win require a No.3. The difference Norma rims measure 0.476" while Win are 0.472".

[Handloader109]

But strange both are hornady brass

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[jim147]

Is that new brass or once fired?

[uscra112]

Interesting. I would have thought that the extractor groove dimensions would be standardized along with everything else. Maybe sources outside the US of A work to a different standard?

[uscra112]

Yes they are.

[M-Tecs]

Interesting. I would have thought that the extractor groove dimensions would be standardized along with everything else. Maybe sources outside the US of A work to a different standard?

SAAMI and CIP do have differences. I don't have a clue if that applies to this.

https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/02/27/cip-european-equivalent-saami/

[gwpercle]

Try different brand(s) shell holder(s) if possible . I have found some cases that will not fit Lee shell holders will fit CH , RCBS , Lyman or Redding .
Ran into this problem with 9mm Luger recently ... The cases that didn't fit the Lee shell holder did fit a CH and RCBS shell holder ... cases are different and shell holders are different .
Good luck finding them ,
Gary

[405grain]

I've read where there can be a similar situation regarding different makes of 7.65x53 Mauser brass. I think it could be because of a difference in SAMMI and CIP standards. Something to look for is to be sure that the actual base of the cartridge case is in contact with the "bottom" of the shell holder. If the shell holder is supporting the case by the bevel of the extraction groove, and the base of the case has a gap between it and the part of the shell holder that is supposed to be supporting the case, a full length resized case may end up with excess headspace. Make sure that the case fits into the shell holder properly.

[Harter66]

Sort of a black sheep here . How are they not fitting ? ( Not the obvious of they don't fit ) I've had some 45 ACP that gave me trouble , some brands have a different holder for the ACP than the usual Savage , 308 , Mauser , 06' , it's cut taller in the ejector groove area .

Do you have a 45 ACP bulge buster or an FCD ?
I had some brass in 06' from Dad's stuff many years ago that just wouldn't chamber and only fit the Lyman 2X shell holder . I did all of the normal sizing stuff , and had run them through the sizer 2-3 times . I had a loose FCD for 45 ACP and the anvil from a 45 cal push through and effectively used it gutted as an FCD I was surprised at how hard they hit the rim . I didn't break the carbide insert and the brass fit the other holders as well as chambering like they should have .

I don't know who's idea a near match chamber in a slide action hunting rifle was but they should be slapped .

[toot]

try different shell holders till you get one that fits. and put it in your die box

[uscra112]

try different shell holders till you get one that fits. and put it in your die box

Since it's all but impossible to find shellholders to buy, maybe use a Dremel to grind a bevel on the top surface of the one you have. Wouldn't have to be pretty, just functional.

[CastingFool]

I had a similar problem with 7.62x39 brass. Some of the cases, the e
Xtractor groove was too narrow, bought a hornady shell holder and that didn't work either. Ended up taking a dremel tool and narrowing the chamber on the shell holder so it would fit the cases with the narrow extractor groove. Just ground it, a little bit at a time, until it fit all the shell with narrow grooves.

[broomhandle]

Hi Handloader109 ,

Two choices for you! Assuming both cases fit & eject from your rifle..

If you know someone with a small metal cutting lathe they can neatly put the correct angle on the rim.
Or you have to alter your case holder, preferably with a lathe or drill press with a cutter or grinding wheel. Should set the down stop, so you can have all the cases sized correctly.

Good Luck,
broom

[screwcutter]

My 1987 RCBS 7x57 dies say to use #11 shell holder, I’ve only used a #3.

[Harter66]

If a guy had say 6-7 #2 Lee , #3 RCBS , 2X Lyman and/or #1 Redding/Hornady maybe you could PM me and send a case to try in some of them and send it back to you .

[samari46]

Had the same happen with Remington factory 308 cases. Extractor groove was not properly cut causing hard chambering. Stopped shooting that ammo and compared some previously fired cases. Ran a dial caliper checking extractor grooves and one set of brass had fatter (meaning less brass removed) extractor grooves than other RP brass fired in that rifle. Frank

[MostlyLeverGuns]

Have not researched lately, but many years ago RCBS made different shell holders for some calibers that were based on the brand of brass. I remember the .257 Roberts and the 45 Colt had different shell holders for different brass, based on the manufacturer's, I think 45 ACP and 308 Win were others.

[DocSavage]

Somewhere I read if the shell holder for 7x57 won't work try the shell holder for 220 Swift sorry don't know the number for the Swift.

[44magLeo]

I have had the same issue with 7x57. Not with one brand but with different brands. European brass for the 7x57 is made to CIP specs. When American manufacturrs syarted making 7x57 they made them the same as 30-06 brass.
For some of my brass I use a 6.5x55 shell holder, some the 30-06 shell holder.
CIP calls for a slightly larger diameter in the bottom of the extractor groove and slightly larger rim.
All work in the rifle. just some are too tight for the US shell holder.
You sometimes find the same with 308 brass, some fit the same as the 06, some son't.
Leo

[DonHowe]

Not unusual, take 6,5x55 - Norma cases only fit an RCBS No.2 while PMC & Win require a No.3. The difference Norma rims measure 0.476" while Win are 0.472".

Sounds like the Norma is made to spec.

[sharps4590]

Ain't no thing and it isn't uncommon with a great number of cartridges. I have a few that I keep 2 shellholders in the die box.. Do what toot or broomhandle said and problem solved. It is reloading and nothing is 100%. We either learn to solve little problems or not.

[Petrol & Powder]

I have experienced the exact same problem with different makes of 7 x 57 casings. The biggest variation of rim thickness and extractor groove profiles were between American made brass and European brass. The solution was a second shell holder and the problem was solved.

[Handloader109]

Thanks guys. I'll see if I can find correct holder, just seemed strange I had hornady brass that was different from other hornady brass

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[Wayne Smith]

Call Hornaday and let them know.

[Deadeye Bly]

The shell holder for the older 257 Roberts brass should work. I don't remember the number.

[Bmi48219]

Have the same issue with ‘USA’ headstamp brass I load for an AMT.
On average one out of 15 won’t fit into my Lee Auto Bench Prime shell holder.
Those go in scrap pail. Load the rest, go shooting. Next time I’m reloading I have the same issue with the remaining USA HS brass. I Have roughly 200 pcs USA HS brass and well over 4,000 other HS’s in this caliber. I know every piece of this USA brass has cycled through my reloading process several times and each time the pieces that won’t fit the Lee shell holder are scrapped. But each session I find some more. All I can figure is that upon firing or resizing the extractor groove gets narrower and the case binds on the shell holder.
This isn’t a hot load, the effort to resize is the same as all the other brass and none of the other Headstamps I load in this caliber ever fail to fit the shellholder during their usable life. I don’t care that I scrap several USA HS brass each session, it doesn’t own me anything. Just one of life’s mysteries I guess.

[DonHowe]

Mauser cartridges were designed in Europe, not the US and were not derived from .30-06. Brass produced in Eutope tends to be made to original design dimensions. There seems to be a tendency for US companies to fudge case diameters toward .30-06 while they don't even make .30-06 cases to SAAMI specs. In fact most US-made cases seem to be smaller than spec.
I learned this

When making .338-06 cases. Badly bulged cases prompted me to mic all the brands os .30-06 brass I had. The largest base diameter I found was arsenal brass at .467"/.468"while some US commercial brass was as small as .464"/.465". PPU is .468". I recently encountered this with .303 Btit cases also. Rem/Win .303 cases are .450"/.451" ahead of the rim with spec being more like .457". PPU .303 brass is right at spec while Norma is slightly smaller.
These discrepancies can sometimes help when making cases for obsolete cartridges but otherwise I guess we just live with it.

[Handloader109]

The shell holder for the older 257 Roberts brass should work. I don't remember the number.Yep,just ran into the correct (I guess) holder a #10. researching neck turning,.

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[j4570]

I had some Hanson brand Ammo from back in the 80's/90's that had different grooves than the R-P 7mm Mauser Brass I was used too. I had one Mauser that didn't like to feed that ammo. I can't remember if I needed a different shellholder, but have generally found LEE to have the most tolerance (loosest fit).

Why are you neck turning 7x57 brass? I have never done this. My Mauser loads shot well. I don't shoot cast in mine however. Usually Hornady 139gr BTSP.

JW

[Handloader109]

Hard to find brass, I'm headed down conversion route, 30-06 or 270 to 7mm Mauser. I expect to have to turn the converted neck...

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[Handloader109]

A #10 lee fits this hornady brass perfectly...

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[444ttd]

feeler gauge


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HkVGw7_s8UY&t=16s