annealing

[Garyshome]

Any other way to check annealing temps other then tempilaq?
​

[racepres]

Personally, roll case in fingers over blue flame, you will certainly know when Hot Enough

[jmorris]

If you are using propane the flame will change from blue to orange once you have gone too far.

I set my machines fast and slow them down gradually until I can just see signs of the flame starting to turn orange. Then speed it back up just enough they stay blue.

Anneals the neck and base is not too hot to hold onto.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ciy6dwb290A

[GregLaROCHE]

I look to have the same color, when cool as military brass, that normally shows that it had been annealed.

[jmorris]

FF to 4:23-4:26 of this video and note how the flame changes colors.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uPlbB6LHKE

That’s what you don’t want.

[racepres]

Geeze... don't gotta "buy", nor "build" nuthin..Walk over to kitchen stove... turn on burner... roll between yer fingers until it gets too hot to hold...drop in Water, Next
Not Scientific... but... highly functional... unless you have an unusually high, or low, Burn Pain Tolerance!!

[upnorthwis]

I use the darkened room method and get them just turning red. And I hold them with a vise-grip, not fingers.

[onelight]

I use the darkened room method and get them just turning red. And I hold them with a vise-grip, not fingers.

That's how I do it too , I stand them in a pan of water with the bottom 3rd submerged and knock them over when they start to go red . I annealed a lot more before I had so many cases and needed to make them last longer.

[FLINTNFIRE]

He was not very consistent in the video on time or flame colors , but it looks like an easy set up .

[Bushrat]

I use the hot lead hot dip method, depth of lead controls how much is heated, and PID sets the exact temp of the, a consistent count controls how long.

[Old Caster]

I put my rifle cases in a deep socket that matches the size of the case where just the neck and shoulder stick out the top. Then I have the socket on an extension and into a drill. I turn the drill at the slowest speed and watch the color of the brass as the propane torch is pointed at it until it turns a sort of black or maybe very dark blue and just dump them into water and install the next in the socket. It is pretty quick.

[sigep1764]

I turn all the lights off in the basement. Still have light from the two storm windows but that is enough. Propane torch from Lowes or Home Depot for $30 bucks. Drill with a standard spark plug socket chucked in it. Spin in the flame til the neck just starts to glow and drop in water. Im on the tenth loading of 30-30, 270, and 223 using this technique every 5th loading and counting.

[MOA]

Yup. The ole propane socket and sink method. I'm getting this 30-40 krag brass ready to be turned into 40-60 Maynard, or as some say 40 krag.


https://i.postimg.cc/SxN0MwSQ/20190713_091836.jpg (https://postimg.cc/Czt6yrn9)

https://i.postimg.cc/DyNQrGFW/20190713_091936.jpg (https://postimg.cc/RNcn9NW9)

https://i.postimg.cc/4dwVm7Bx/20190713_092029.jpg (https://postimg.cc/TLLpsPzz)

https://i.postimg.cc/BZY23Fjh/20190713_093056.jpg (https://postimg.cc/23W1FVFv)

https://i.postimg.cc/jSNfykZ9/20190713_093517.jpg (https://postimg.cc/v4YDsXRL)

[jmorris]

He was not very consistent in the video on time or flame colors , but it looks like an easy set up .

I imagine there is more brass made inconsistent by many methods of annealing than improved. Some people just don’t want them to get hard and split, over cooking them (any “glow” of the brass) will make them soft enough to keep those folks happy.

As I stated back in #3 you don’t want the flame to change, why I linked the other video so one could see what that looks like. Some time after the flame changes the case will begin to glow, both are past the ideal point to remove the case from the flame.

[FLINTNFIRE]

Yes his first one flared ,his others he was inconsistent on times and even position , his idea for his device was neat but something like a slight notch to keep in same position , I to do mine in a semi darkened room and turn at a consistent speed for same times , seems to work fine , you do have a nice machine for doing yours and it is a consistent method .

[onelight]

I imagine there is more brass made inconsistent by many methods of annealing than improved. Some people just don’t want them to get hard and split, over cooking them (any “glow” of the brass) will make them soft enough to keep those folks happy.

As I stated back in #3 you don’t want the flame to change, why I linked the other video so one could see what that looks like. Some time after the flame changes the case will begin to glow, both are past the ideal point to remove the case from the flame.
I don't disagree a bit . The cases I have done have all been revolver and 45/70 . For hot loads I only use new or once fired so by the time mine need it they are in the light to medium group of cases some loaded 30 or more times without splits . So the old heat to light red glow in the dark and turnover in the water has served well in my process. But I do get some that are really soft and would not load to magnum pressure.

[upnorthwis]

Another thing to know is that dunking them in water only makes them easier to pick up. It doesn't change the annealing process.

[onelight]

Another thing to know is that dunking them in water only makes them easier to pick up. It doesn't change the annealing process.
I always heard that they needed to be cooled quick . But I never tried letting them cool slow so I can't argue that.

[uscra112]

Dunk them to stop heat migration toward the base. Necessary if you are annealing down into the shoulder area for later fireforming.

[biffj]

Brass isn't steel, quenching it doesn't change the hardness, it only cools it off and freezes it where it is. It will be more consistent if you do the water drop because your temp will stabilize quicker than if you let it air cool too. On top of that its a lot easier to handle when it doesn't burn you.

Frank

[Jsm180]

Tried the water drop one time, saw no change just had to cook them in the dehydrator to dry them. Spinning them in a socket and dropping into a towel works best for me.

[1066]

Doing some brass on one of my homemade machines:

https://youtu.be/_330JnAaMBQ

[rjathon]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NzilW5egDs4

[JimB..]

Somehow I think this whole thread got off track. Wasn’t the question how to check temp rather than how to anneal. Seems like about the closest we’ve come is “don’t burn your fingers.”

[porthos]

with all of these do it yourself annealing processes; you are probably extending case life. but without a constant time and temp. you are doing nothing to achieve a uniform neck tension.

[uscra112]

OK, another low-$$ approach.

The $20 (Amazon) DC motor gearbox rotates the aluminum cup at 60 RPM. Handy box cost $4.00 Cup is a simple lathe part.

Prop the torch at the correct height however you like, light the flame, and plug in the battery.

Drop a case in the cup, slide into the flame, and count the revolutions. Rinse and repeat.

Heat applied uniformly around the entire circumference, judge heat by appearance of the finished cases. Since one revolution is one second, the total heat can be very consistent, and incremented up or down in discrete steps.

The cup is watertight. This was originally for annealing necks of .17 WSM rimfire without setting the priming off. Cold water in the cup absorbs enough heat at the rim to prevent that. WHY? you ask? .17 WSM can be expanded and trimmed to make a passable HV substitute for the long-obsolete .25 Stevens RF. That's for another thread.

No, I don't do video, and definitely don't do Utoob.

[onelight]

Doing some brass on one of my homemade machines:

https://youtu.be/_330JnAaMBQ
That is really slick !

[jmorris]

Somehow I think this whole thread got off track. Wasn’t the question how to check temp rather than how to anneal. Seems like about the closest we’ve come is “don’t burn your fingers.”

Covered in 3&5

If you are more of a still photo guy take a look at the photos in #63 in this thread.

https://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=545128&page=3

[FLINTNFIRE]

Those are great pictures that show the color of flame and to much also .

[Half Dog]

If you’re near me, give me a shout.

[Conditor22]

https://www.govets.com/index.php/tempil-310-60797842.html

Best price I could find

750 F Temp Indicating Liquid
29.58 for Minimum Order Qty of 2
$22.40 Special Price$14.79 Each

[1066]

Heat applied uniformly around the entire circumference, judge heat by appearance of the finished cases.




In my experience I've found trying to judge correct annealing temperature by using the colour of the case as a guide can be misleading. If I anneal soon after wet tumbling my cases I get virtually no colour change, if I leave those same cases for a week or so before annealing I get a classic "Lapua" looking anneal.

[JimB..]

Covered in 3&5

If you are more of a still photo guy take a look at the photos in #63 in this thread.

https://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=545128&page=3

Good discussion. Interesting observation about the coincidence of the flame color changing and the temp of the neck. I don’t expect it’s zinc, temp seems too low, my guess is that at some temp the brass scavenges oxygen and the flame temp drops, but that’s a wild wild guess. I know a guy that spent his career studying how metals react to heat (think components for jet engines) and will ask him.