Cast gallery loads for the 358 Winchester?

[Yukoner]

Just took a look at this great old thread on Mouse Fart loads for the 30-06. I found this post from Larry Gibson where he mentions using Bullseye, http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?152431-Recipes-for-quot-Mouse-Fart-quot-Loads-in-30-06&p=1695609&viewfull=1#post1695609, but alas none of that powder available up here at all. :sad:

Wondering if anyone has done any similar light load development for the 358 using other powders?

Thinking this would be good for shooting indoors, and certainly for grouse, ptarmigan and rabbits up North here.

Thanks,
Ted

[Larry Gibson]

If you have any 9mm moulds that drop 100 - 125 gr bullet at least at .358 you might try TLing them and load over 3.5 or 4 gr of Red Dot, WST, 700x or similar powder if Bullseye is not to be found.....

[Yukoner]

Thanks Larry. Not sure what TLing is, but I do have some 700X. :)

No doubt I'm going to feel like an idiot when you tell me what it stands for....

Ted

[richhodg66]

TL = tumble lubing with Lee liquid alox.

Never did loads that light, but a Lyman 358311 and about 7-8 grains of Unique worked pretty well for me.

[dverna]

If you want to shoot indoors, get a pellet gun. Safer and a lot less expensive. The air borne particulate from primers is not good for you. Why anyone would want to cast, size and lube bullets, then reload a bottleneck case for plinking is something I have never understood. Use a $.03 pellet.....heck the primer alone is worth more than double that.

[NEKVT]

I use 700X for reduced and roundball loads in many cartridges. In the 356 Win I have used Lee 105 SWC with 3.5gr as the lightest load but have also used 6 to 7gr with 150gr RN, 158gr RN and 148gr wadcutters for close range plinking loads. Just about any bullet with fast burning powders in this range can be tweeked to work in individual rifles.

[Yukoner]

Thanks to all of you! Will get back with a report after I give this a try.

Ted

[onelight]

Why anyone would want to cast, size and lube bullets, then reload a bottleneck case for plinking is something I have never understood. Use a $.03 pellet.....heck the primer alone is worth more than double that.
Most of us have no rational reason for 90% of the guns and shooting we do . We just want to 🤫

[NEKVT]

Maybe there is a benefit to practicing by shooting these reduced loads in the same firearm to be used for other purposes...like maybe hunting? My pellet gun serves a purpose too but the only thing that gives a satisfying crack of a real firearm from it are the lightweight cleaning wads breaking the sound barrier - but those don't go very far.

[RU shooter]

I load a good bit of reduced loads in my 35 Rem . I tend to use the same bullets I use for regular shooting i.e. 200 gr lee . If you don't have Bullseye you can use another fast pistol powder like Red Dot ,W231. 700X ect in the 6-7 gr range also unique in the 10-14 gr range and 2400 around 14-18 grs . I mainly use these slower loads to practice my offhand shooting

[Larry Gibson]

If you can find them the soft swaged HBWCs from Speer and Hornady also will make for very nice "gallery" loads for your 358W. Probably just a single loader with them but loaded over Bullseye or Red Dot to 700 - 800 or so fps they will shoot very well. Excellent small game loads also.

[Yukoner]

Turns out I don't have the 700X I thought I did. Did a bit more research and am wondering if IMR4198 would work with 158 gr wadcutters? They are lubed and measure .359", so that part works.

According to Speer a max load of 44 gr 4198 gives 2740 with their 180 gr soft point, so thinking out loud here, 15 gr should give about 1200fps IF 4198 is safe in reduced loads.

279753

I value your advice and opinions. Thanks,
Ted

[wmitty]

Do you have access to any other fast burning powders rather than the 4198? I suspect the silence is due to the lack of data for reducing 4198 to the degree that you are looking for. The fast burning pistol powers are ideal for these low velocity loads.

[RU shooter]

That powder does get used in reduced cast loads BUT I've never heard or read anyone reducing it down that low . I wouldn't do it .

[Yukoner]

Well, no pistol powder available, and didn't find any warnings about using very reduced loads with 4198, so went ahead and tried three rounds in two different rifles.

No filler, all fired with rifle held horizontal. No problems, quite accurate at 25 yards. Now need to check the velocity.

Wonder what Quickload would predict?

Ted

[Norske]

Some of the tightest groups my 358 Winchester BLR has made were with a 200 gr RCBS cast gas check boolit and 39gr IMR 30-31.

[Yukoner]

Here's a bit of 4198 info from the Reloaders' Reference program.

Ted

PS: anyone know how to get this site to accept portrait orinetation in photos?

[onelight]

My pics were loading sideways and I was told to crop them and they would load correctly , seems to work for me.
Take the pic big enough to crop and not loose what you want to post.

[Rico1950]

Was trying to upload RCBS cast bullet book 1 data but it keeps saying upload failed???

RCBS 38-158-RN
IMR4198 19.0 1376
21.0 1516

RCBS 38-158-SWC
IMR4198 25.0 1802
27.0 1941

RCBS 357-180-SIL
IMR4198 24.0 1660
26.0 1727
Data using Sav. 99, 22" bbl. 1-12" twist WW case, CCI 200 primer

[Outpost75]

In my .35/.30-30 Winchester I use 8 grains of Bullseye with Accurate 35-245D. That would be safe start load in a .358 and you could increase a couple grains as needed to find the sweet spot for best grouping.

280417

[charlie b]

Not .358Win but .35 Rem is in here. Should be close enough. I use .30-30 data in my .308.

http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm

[cwtebay]

In my .35/.30-30 Winchester I use 8 grains of Bullseye with Accurate 35-245D. That would be safe start load in a .358 and you could increase a couple grains as needed to find the sweet spot for best grouping.x2 - I use this exact load for my 35/30 and a shade more for 35 WCF.
Another option is to get a chamber adaptor for your chosen cartridge. Shooting 38 ACP may not be economical if you're buying factory fresh, but definitely if you're looking for "gallery loads" (aka grouse / rabbit loads when hunting big game).

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

[Landy88]

Except for the really slow ones 4831 and slower the H / IMR stick powders are safe enough to reduce, but will not let you go all that slow before the get very dirty or leave unburnt powder grains - sometimes they still shoot well. Way back when I first started shooting .350RM, I found a small game 158 grain cast load with 31 grains of 3031 in an old Al Miller (A serious 350 fan and then the editor of the Nosler manual and several gun rags.) article and have been using it ever since. By every general rule it should be awful - it is much dirtier and uses over three times the powder of my pistol powder equivalents, but it does just what he suggested by shooting nice groups at 25 yards from a rifle zeroed at 200 with a powder usable for standard loads and at about 1500fps is not too destructive on small game. A firm crimp and a magnum primer was noted to and does cleans up the burn a little. Slower with pistol powders is better, but the rifle powders can be made to work with some caveats.