.45 acp and 255gr bullet for revolver?

[Kyle M.]

Hey all I hope this is the right place for this out of the ordinary question. I just bought what was supposed to be a Colt New Service in .45 Colt, turns out it's a 1917 in .45 acp, and I have all this .45 Colt ammo I loaded several years ago! Oh well. I have .45 acp brass, some moon clips, and dies. Now the problem is the only mold I have is a 255gr RNFP, would anyone have any possible loads with unique or Bullseye I could use with this heavy of a bullet in .45acp? I'm thinking this may be a no go due to the lack of case capacity generating too high of pressures, I'd just go buy a 230gr mold but it doesn't look like I'm going to be finding one for a not ridiculous price right now. Thanks in advance for any help.

[fc60]

Greetings,

Peters used to offer a 255 grain load for the 45 Auto Rim.

I chronographed some of them and they averaged 730 FPS.

Some of the old loading books may have data for the powder and charge.

Cheers,

Dave

[FredBuddy]

Kyle:

I have both the Lee 200 gr SWC and
228 gr round nose moulds I could
loan you, or a small supply of boolits
if you prefer. These are from wheel
weights and are not sized or lubed.

PM me if interested.

Fred in Danville

[6thtexas]

I use a NOE 454424 in the Auto case with 6.0 grains of Unique. These are shot in a Ruger Blackhawk. IIRC, Skeeter Skelton loaded 7.5 grains of Unique under a 454424 and ruined a 1917 S&W. I would certainly start low and work up.

[rhemcla]

My Speer Manual (12th edition, 1994) shows the following for 45 auto rim:
250 grs L-SWC
Unique 5.8 grs 772 fps
Max 6.2 grs 824 fps

Blue Dot 8.6 grs 789 fps
Max 9.0 grs 824 fps


Sent from my MHA-L29 using Tapatalk

[ShooterAZ]

Beware the heavy loads in the 1917 Colt! I use 4.2 grains of Bullseye with a 255 gr SWC in my S&W Model 25 chambered in 45ACP. It's a mild mannered pleasant load, with pressures suitable for the 1917.

[Outpost75]

^^^^What ShooterAZ said!^^^^

I use Accurate 45-264H with 4 grains of Bullseye in the .45 Auto Rim and 3.5 grains in the .455 Webley MkII.

[Kyle M.]

Thank you all. There’s some good info and loads to try here. Yes I definitely want to keep them mild, this won’t be a gun I shoot a lot but I’d like to shoot it occasionally.

[Kyle M.]

Well I loaded up 25 test rounds last night. 255gr RNFP sized to .452" and tumble lubed in X-Lox. I used ShooterAZ's load of 4.2 grains of Bullseye. I didn't drag my chronograph out but my findings were, pleasant to shoot, shot to point of aim at 10 yards, and no leading. I was a bit surprised at the lack of leading as the bore is a bit rough. It doesn't look like there's any pitting but it has a rough look to it like a machined surface that was done in a hurry or with a dull tool. I scrubbed and scrubbed and scrubbed when I got it so I don't think it's old leading built up. I would certainly think WWI era .45acp primers were still corrosive and it's likely a bit of 100 year old corrosion.

[brstevns]

I use 4.8 Unique with the Lee 255 FN nose in my 1917 smith, shoots great and hits hard, FPS is no more then 650fps

[ddixie884]

OAL will make a big difference in pressure of these loads. For revolver use they can be loaded longer to make more powder room. I have loaded longer SWCs out to the crimp groove and even crimped them if using with clips............

[Harter66]

I loaded the 452-255 RNFP for Moms 1917 .Speer listed data for a 260 HP in 45 ACP . Seems like it was 6.5 gr of Unique as a load was selected as the Lee mould drops at 265 gr with 50/50 I loaded them out to the top lube groove with good accuracy and hits about 6-8" high at 25 yd .

The S&W my Daughter has likes 5.5 gr under everything but doesn't care for the original or NOE version of the 454424 solid I loaded some in 2 different HPs but didn't get a chance to shoot them .

Seek Auto Rim data or Speer #12 for sure .

[Beaverhunter2]

FWIW I'm running 5.3gr Bullseye under a Lee 252 SWC (casts at 260) in my USP45. Super accurate but its a hammer and likely +P. USP's are rated for +P. Might be a little much for the 1917. Start low

Enjoy!

John

[Kyle M.]

FWIW I'm running 5.3gr Bullseye under a Lee 252 SWC (casts at 260) in my USP45. Super accurate but its a hammer and likely +P. USP's are rated for +P. Might be a little much for the 1917. Start low

Enjoy!

John

Yes that seems a bit hot. So far I’m liking the 4.2 grains load. I haven’t tried Unique yet, I’m waiting on the brass I ordered.

[Kyle M.]

OAL will make a big difference in pressure of these loads. For revolver use they can be loaded longer to make more powder room. I have loaded longer SWCs out to the crimp groove and even crimped them if using with clips............

I’m currently loading them to the crimp groove.


I loaded the 452-255 RNFP for Moms 1917 .Speer listed data for a 260 HP in 45 ACP . Seems like it was 6.5 gr of Unique as a load was selected as the Lee mould drops at 265 gr with 50/50 I loaded them out to the top lube groove with good accuracy and hits about 6-8" high at 25 yd .

The S&W my Daughter has likes 5.5 gr under everything but doesn't care for the original or NOE version of the 454424 solid I loaded some in 2 different HPs but didn't get a chance to shoot them .

Seek Auto Rim data or Speer #12 for sure .

I’ll give that 5.5 grain load a try when my brass shows up. I only have about a half pound of Unique. But I have at least 4 lbs of Bullseye.

[Kyle M.]

I use 4.8 Unique with the Lee 255 FN nose in my 1917 smith, shoots great and hits hard, FPS is no more then 650fps

I might have to give this load a try, I don’t need anything heavier than that for punching paper.

[ddixie884]

Well I loaded up 25 test rounds last night. 255gr RNFP sized to .452" and tumble lubed in X-Lox. I used ShooterAZ's load of 4.2 grains of Bullseye. I didn't drag my chronograph out but my findings were, pleasant to shoot, shot to point of aim at 10 yards, and no leading. I was a bit surprised at the lack of leading as the bore is a bit rough. It doesn't look like there's any pitting but it has a rough look to it like a machined surface that was done in a hurry or with a dull tool. I scrubbed and scrubbed and scrubbed when I got it so I don't think it's old leading built up. I would certainly think WWI era .45acp primers were still corrosive and it's likely a bit of 100 year old corrosion.

Lots of 1917s were fired with corrosive ammo and not cleaned right away. I have heard the appearance you describe as a frosted bore. That is what I always think of when a bore won't shine up. I have one old Colt 1917 that has a pretty rough bore and it still shoots good and doesn't lead much. JMHO-YMMV. Enjoy your fine revolver.

[Drm50]

I’ve got three S&W m25-2s and one Colt 1917 in excellent condition. I wouldn’t shoot heavy loads in any of them. If Colt is in good shape it’s worth $1k or more and is worth buying a Lee mold for.
I’m running all 45ar brass, I hate moons.

[Mk42gunner]

I'm surprised you have a decent point of impact with the heavier projectile. I had a S&W Model 25-2 that shot great with 185 and 200 brain bullets, but shot so high with 230 grain hardball the sights could not be adjusted for it.

Since I had free supply of 230 ball, I made a higher front sight for the gun.

Robert

[Kyle M.]

I’ve got three S&W m25-2s and one Colt 1917 in excellent condition. I wouldn’t shoot heavy loads in any of them. If Colt is in good shape it’s worth $1k or more and is worth buying a Lee mold for.
I’m running all 45ar brass, I hate moons.

I have no intention of shooting hot loads in it. It’s in pretty poor shape honestly. Basically no finish, somewhat rough bore, all the military markings have been buffed off. But it’s mechanically sound and seems to shoot fine. The 255 grain mold I have is a Lee mold, I have enough moon clips now and regular .45acp brass that I might as well stick with it.

https://i.ibb.co/tq4tkZf/IMG-2149.jpg

https://i.ibb.co/rFfhpBW/IMG-2148.jpg

[Kyle M.]

I'm surprised you have a decent point of impact with the heavier projectile. I had a S&W Model 25-2 that shot great with 185 and 200 brain bullets, but shot so high with 230 grain hardball the sights could not be adjusted for it.

Since I had free supply of 230 ball, I made a higher front sight for the gun.

Robert

I would have figured they were factory sighted for 230gr hardball. I imagine my 255gr bullets aren’t going as fast as 230gr.

[Kyle M.]

Lots of 1917s were fired with corrosive ammo and not cleaned right away. I have heard the appearance you describe as a frosted bore. That is what I always think of when a bore won't shine up. I have one old Colt 1917 that has a pretty rough bore and it still shoots good and doesn't lead much. JMHO-YMMV. Enjoy your fine revolver.

Yes I’ve heard of frosted bores as well and I’d say that’s what this is. I’ve never shot any gun for groups and doubt I ever will. It shoots as well as I can and that’s all that really matters. I bought it more for the fact that I wanted a Colt revolver in the collection than as a shooter. Though I will definitely shoot it occasionally.

[Outpost75]

Cylinder throats in my three Colt New Service revolvers in .455, .45 ACP and .45 Colt all run .455+ with barrel groove diameters of frosted wartime bores all .453-.454". All shoot well with SOFT 8-10 BHN bullets with MILD loads of Bullseye, Titegroup, 452AA, WST at velocities around 700-750 fps. Hard bullets of smaller diameter above 800 fps both lead the barrel and keyhole!!!!

[Mk42gunner]

I would have figured they were factory sighted for 230gr hardball. I imagine my 255gr bullets aren’t going as fast as 230gr.
Kyle, your 1917 is or at least was, probably regulated for the 230 grain ball ammo. The S&W I had was (If I remember the barrel stamping correctly) a Model of 1955 Target.

IIRC the front Patridge sight was about 3/16" tall, above the ramp, and the replacement I made was somewhere around 3/8". What ever it was I could then adjust the POI to hit center with standard hardball.

Handguns, particularly revolvers, react in varying degrees to differences in bullet weight, velocity and even in how you grip them.

Robert

[Kyle M.]

Cylinder throats in my three Colt New Service revolvers in .455, .45 ACP and .45 Colt all run .455+ with barrel groove diameters of frosted wartime bores all .453-.454". All shoot well with SOFT 8-10 BHN bullets with MILD loads of Bullseye, Titegroup, 452AA, WST at velocities around 700-750 fps. Hard bullets of smaller diameter above 800 fps both lead the barrel and keyhole!!!!

I honestly forgot to check the cylinder throats. I got .451”-.4515” on the bore. I’ve read that prior to WWI .45 Colt was standardized as .454” and this was changed to .452” post war. I have no idea what the standard was for .45acp but I’ve read about 1917 bores varying anywhere from .451”-.455” +. I can say all of the .45 Colt revolvers I’ve owned which have all been past WWII have had .451”-.452” bores. I also know I have a load that doesn’t lead and shoots good enough for me.


Kyle, your 1917 is or at least was, probably regulated for the 230 grain ball ammo. The S&W I had was (If I remember the barrel stamping correctly) a Model of 1955 Target.

IIRC the front Patridge sight was about 3/16" tall, above the ramp, and the replacement I made was somewhere around 3/8". What ever it was I could then adjust the POI to hit center with standard hardball.

Handguns, particularly revolvers, react in varying degrees to differences in bullet weight, velocity and even in how you grip them.

Robert

Several years ago I had a S&W 1905 1st change. With a Lee 158gr SWC sized to .358” over 3.0 grains of Bullseye I could regularly put 6 rounds in one ragged hole at ten yards. That was probably more me than the gun or the load but I probably should have hung onto that one. I’ve had a few 1911’s I could shoot just as well. I’ve fallen out of practice since the due to lack of free time but my goal is to get back to that level someday.

I know there are plenty of people out there who can shoot better but I was more than happy with that.

[OBXPilgrim]

I used the Lee 255 gr RF mold for some loads in a 625 Smith. The mold dropped at only 244gr. Must have been more lino than I usually use. Found some decent loads with Red Dot and Unique, but the Unique loads were so dirty I quit loading them.

Good luck.