Flintlock Inaccuracy in Movies and Television

[Prairie Cowboy]

I can't begin to count the number of times when I have watched a scene where a flintlock pistol or musket is pointed at someone where the frizzen is obviously wide open.

Obviously that means no powder in the pan and no sparks and no possibility of firing. The lack of knowledge from those who make these period films is incredible.

[bedbugbilly]

You aren't really equating "Hollywood" with intelligence, the ability to do real research and the ability to actually show and tell the truth are you?

[bruce drake]

I bet you'd hate if you looked closely, many of those flintlocks and percussion rifles are actually prop-master reworks of Trapdoor Springfields or rubber rifles.

[tai95]

If seeing flintlocks portrayed wrong gets you mad, don't watch the shows with wheel guns that shoot 30 rounds. Also a stick of c4 will not level a building.

[GARD72977]

I seen a documentary of WW1 and the soldiers had M1 Garands.

I try to not contribute to the salaries of any one in the movie business

[panhed65]

You aren't really equating "Hollywood" with intelligence, the ability to do real research and the ability to actually show and tell the truth are you?
kind of a change of subject, but not topic, was watching a documentary on wwI, 2 soldiers in a trench, one had an M14, the other a M1 carbine. so much for accuracy.
Barry

[GregLaROCHE]

I’m going to keep an eye out now for those open frizzens.

[Prairie Cowboy]

You aren't really equating "Hollywood" with intelligence, the ability to do real research and the ability to actually show and tell the truth are you?

This comment seems like more of a political condemnation of Hollywood rather than a firearms comment.

However, with regards to firearms authenticity, it all seems to depend on whether they employ a firearms expert or not. Productions where they do are often much better.

[Prairie Cowboy]

I bet you'd hate if you looked closely, many of those flintlocks and percussion rifles are actually prop-master reworks of Trapdoor Springfields or rubber rifles.

I've seen those movies. Most of those old prop guns are long gone today.
It is annoying however to see open frizzens in flintlocks that are obviously genuine, or at least close replicas.

[Prairie Cowboy]

kind of a change of subject, but not topic, was watching a documentary on wwI, 2 soldiers in a trench, one had an M14, the other a M1 carbine. so much for accuracy.
Barry

I have seen cheesy war movies where American troops were carrying Lee Enfields because that was probably all the prop masters could get ahold of where they were.

[Bent Ramrod]

The research and prop departments for the movie companies have gotten much more concerned with authenticity in recent years. Anachronisms and inaccuracies generate a lot of complaints from the more with-it viewers now. It’s all about suspending disbelief, which is a basic requirement of any storytelling. All that money spent on computer-generated battle scenes is wasted if some small prop isn’t right.

It’s hard enough to believe a British colonel would actually fully cooperate with the enemy in their efforts to build a bridge over the River Kwai, so that more British would be defeated and captured. Seeing the Japanese soldiers all carrying Lee Enfields moves it even further into the realm of unreality. But the acting was good.

At least the bad guys don’t hold the flintlock pistol (frizzen open) sideways...

[KCSO]

For safety most of those guns are old trapdoor blank guns with frizzens tacked on, or old non functional muskets. I always like the woosh....boom, not one good shooting flinter on screen seems like.

[Eddie2002]

I remember one WW2 movie about submariners who were equipped with a bunch of lever action rifles for a landing party. I try to ignore the small stuff like open frizzens and 20 round six shooters and just enjoy the movie with a couple laughs at the mistakes.

[1Hawkeye]

Don't watch the history Channel the number of lefthanded m1's , mausers, and Enfields will make you nuts.

[fixit]

I kinda expect that sort of thing in entertainment..... what drives me batty is when you find it in a museum! I've gotten into more than one argument with know it all curators over the dating of their displays.

[Toymaker]

I'm pretty sure it was the made for TV movie "Texas". A couple of Houston's men were chasing a Mexican courier on horseback. One pulled out his flintlock pistol and shot at the courier. He missed. So he cocked the pistol and shot again. I hollered "How'd they loose the Alamo? They got repeaters!!!!" There were a few blank stares, but a few spewed their mouthful of beer, choked on the popcorn or laughed so hard they fell out of their chairs.

[rbuck351]

Two guns that have been used so much in movies of times prior to the manufacturing of that gun are the 92 Win and the 73 SSA colt. One of my favorite boo boos is Wanted Dead or Alive where Josh is shown with a belt full of 45/70 for his shortened 92 Win. The period correct percussion revolver is commonly replaced with the Colt SAA.

The movie prop houses have a lot of 92Wins and Colt SSAs. They don't have nearly enough of much of anything else.
My wife hates it when I pick out this sort of thing during a movie.

[Tasbay]

Jeramiha Johnson where the crazy lady has him covered with a Hawken with no cap on the nipple. Watched the Explosion Show on Discovery a couple of nights ago on Black Powder. Boy a lot of inaccuracy's in that one.

[waksupi]

I watched a WW2 movie last night. Lever actions, Luger used by a US soldier on D-Day, some unidentifiable .22 it appeared, both sides using .303 Enfields. Arghhhhh!

[poppy42]

How about the old TV cop shows where the bad guy screws a suppressor on the end of a revolver!

[toot]

in the REVENENT,? I don't know if I got it right, LEONARDO DI CAPRIO,S film the frizzen's were all closed and appeared to fire when they were struck by the hammer? JMHO.

[waksupi]

in the REVENENT,? I don't know if I got it right, LEONARDO DI CAPRIO,S film the frizzen's were all closed and appeared to fire when they were struck by the hammer? JMHO.

Those did all fire, they were made by North Star West.

[Bazoo]

In mountain men, they caught the guy ramming and he shot an Indian with the ramrod in the bore. Rifle and ramrod were both unscathed. I found that unbelievable. Figured either the gun would blow up or the ramrod would be mangled.

[mooman76]

People have shot RRs out of guns and they went unscathed. Usually it's because they forgot and left it in but sometimes because they get it stuck. MLs are quite resilient but not totally blow up proof. Quickest way is to load with smokeless powder.

[Tasbay]

Those did all fire, they were made by North Star West.
They were good guns De Caprio even got one pistol he stole to fire twice from horse back without reloading, very impressive!!

[rockrat]

My wife gets really upset when I point out stuff on TV that is inaccurate. Firearms or otherwise. One TV show had a car in a pond with the trunk exposed, but when the tow truck pulled it out, it came out front end first!!

She glares at me and tells me its just a TV show!!!

[sharps4590]

As was previously noted, the History Channel can get really bad. Saw one show on Mountain Men where the trapper was setting a coil spring trap....uh-huh. And, another on Hitler's "Beer Hall Putsch" where BOTH SIDES were armed with SMLE's!! Just watched one a couple nights ago that was just as blatant but I don't remember what it was. No, most of those guys don't know what was when or how it works.

[stubshaft]

How about the old TV cop shows where the bad guy screws a suppressor on the end of a revolver!

I just saw a recent film where they did the same thing! The best thing is when they fire it, it sounds like a mouse fart.

[rbuck351]

You can actually use a suppressor on a revolver but you have to set the barrel back and set the cyl/barrel gap at just over 0. Still doesn't make it silent but none make any gun silent. Most only reduce noise level about 30 db.

[Jniedbalski]

I remember watching a old 50’s or early 60’s movie with them shooting flint locks. All they had to do is recock the hammer and shoot again. No reloading was involved. Never found one of them

[Bent Ramrod]

The worst disappointment I experienced with my flintlock pistol was that no loading ever reproduced that uber-Kool “pyttt-ti-kowwww!!!” sound on firing that all the flintlock shooters in the Davey Crockett shows on TV used to get.

Too bad Fess Parker and Disney didn’t publish a booklet of “Davey Crockett’s Loading Secrets For Best Sound Effects.”

On the other hand, that nifty “ka-pweeeennnng!” ricochet noise is easily obtained by firing a .22 RF at a 45 degree angle against the top of a railroad track. Couldn't get it to happen off every rock, tree, corral post or other obstruction the Cowboys could, though.

[todd2]

my wife will tell you not to watch movies with me cant help myself

[TNsailorman]

I remember watching a western some years ago about a scout (Clint Walker) who had rescued the captive fair haired damsel from a Indian camp and was fleeing to the settlements with her. They stopped for the night to camp and built a roaring fire to cook. Scout whipped out a knife (clearly a Buck 110 in the close up) and proceeded to open a can of beans to cook. Indians found the camp a few moments later (surprise) and rode into the camp shooting and shouting. Scout proceeds to put up a withering fire from 5 to 10 yards with a repeater (Winchester 94), this is in a timeline that was suppose to be taking place in the late 1870's. Well he misses all shots but drives the Indians out of the camp in full retreat. By this time the Winchester had run out of shells and the Indians were what looked like 300 to 400 yards away (they looked like ants on tiny, tiny horses in the camera. Scout whips out his trusty .45 single action and fires one fast snap shot as they disappear over the very distant ridge. Off his horse topples one dead Indian. Now he can't hit with a rifle at 10 yards but can pull off a snap shot at incredible distance. Just like real life. Wife couldn't understand why I was laughing so hard until I explained it to her. Now she watches for the mistakes and laughs with me. She is really getting into old westerns because of the humor in them. John Wayne made some real bonehead moves in his early movies. In one western we watch, his Colt had not quite cleared leather when it went off but the bad guy about 100 feet away fell dead just the same. Wife made me back up the action so she could watch it again. Like I said, she is really into westerns now. james

[poppy42]

You can actually use a suppressor on a revolver but you have to set the barrel back and set the cyl/barrel gap at just over 0. Still doesn't make it silent but none make any gun silent. Most only reduce noise level about 30 db.

Really! Yes I know that technically , it can be done. LOL

[john.k]

In the old gangster movies ,a snubnose 38 was fired folded in a pillow ......I often wonder if that would silence the blast?