Bending Bullets?

[mrmachinist]

Hello,
I decided to play with a few of my first Bullets I casted a couple weeks ago. I powder coated a few and tried to size them.

They are casting at .2795-.280
After PC .282
A lee .278 sizer is sizing them to .276 and they come out bent. I sized an uncoated bullet and it did the same thing.


Any ideas? Using range scrap. I’m not sure why the sizer is going so far undersized either.

Top 2 are unsized. Bottom have been sized.

Pc came out good except where it touched the rack I used to stand them up. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210212/b3fa843a01028e8ff6cb7d262897bf5c.jpg


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[Dusty Bannister]

Sometimes a little lube on the bullets will help them through the sizer since there are no lube grooves and no place for the alloy to be displaced. Did you notice flash trailing off the edges of the base? Polish out the sizer a little and it might go through a little easier. POLISH do not SAND PAPER. looks like you might have a little scoring on the sides from a rough die surface.

[greenjoytj]

The instructions for my LEE press mounted up push sizing die says to lube the bullets with their liquid Alox. I don’t use that product.
What I do is to push a oiled fuzzy wire handle dauber up into the die to lube the die.
I see you are coating the bullet so you would need to remove the oil prior to painting.

[charlie b]

Long bullets can be tougher to size. At least lube them. I use case sizing lube when I need it.

And it does look like you need to polish the die.

I would size the bare bullets first. Once they come out straight then PC them and size again.

[mrmachinist]

Thanks for the responses. I have some lapping compound from working on my old Mauser receivers I can polish it up with.

I did try putting some case lube on them tried bare and pcd with the same results. Could the lead be too soft? Just trying to think of any causes for this happening.

Any ideas why the Bullets are coming out .002” undersized?

Should I contact lee?


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[fa38]

try to harden the lead with some tin. The following from Accurate Moulds

Why does the order form require that I select a casting alloy?

In order to produce the requested bullet diameter, I need to know how much tin is in the alloy. All applicable alloys shrink as they solidify. The more tin, the less shrinkage. The alloy choices in the drop down menu are listed in order of expected shrinkage, from greatest to least. If you intend to use varied alloys, choose the most appropriate one that's highest on the list, so that other alloys with more tin will be a bit larger.

[Dusty Bannister]

If you have the Lee press mounted push through die then you may find that they are out of stock with Lee and no longer being made. If that is the case then refer to the following link. It will be cheaper and much faster.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?298626-Enlarging-a-Lee-bullet-sizing-die

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

That's a long skinny boolit :shock:

I think you should investigate the boolit base and pusher stem alignment during the beginning of sizing. If the boolit gets a misaligned start, it'll make a banana shaped boolit ...and surely a soft alloy will compound your problem.

another thought, Your sizer die is clearly undersized and .004 to .006 is alot to size down a soft long skinny boolit, the bending could be as the sizing begins, which would cause the misalignment I mention above. Other misalignment issues could be caused by a protruding sprue cut or even how the Spring in the Ram is influencing the pusher stem.
good luck

[John McCorkle]

That's a long skinny boolit :shock:

I think you should investigate the boolit base and pusher stem alignment during the beginning of sizing. If the boolit gets a misaligned start, it'll make a banana shaped boolit ...and surely a soft alloy will compound your problem.

another thought, Your sizer die is clearly undersized and .004 to .006 is alot to size down a soft long skinny boolit, the bending could be as the sizing begins, which would cause the misalignment I mention above. Other misalignment issues could be caused by a protruding sprue cut or even how the Spring in the Ram is influencing the pusher stem.
good luckThat was my thought too....some inconsistent forces at play somewhere in the system that make one side want to curl.

I have no idea where that could be...I know with long boolits I've seen if I don't let it cool long enough, dropping from mold - I get boolits that are bent straight from the mold (lead is not structurally solidified enough to hold shape while being dropped)

Not sure if that is happening to you and it's not noticed until the sizer exaggerates the axis tilt?

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[Hanzy4200]

I would concur that both an uneven sprue could be a factor, and that is a lot of pressure sizing down even .004. I admit I have never seen a bullet bend to that extreme. Maybe a tiny touch of Imperial Sizing wax on every 7th or so bullet would help.

[mrmachinist]

Ok sounds like I have a few issues I need to address.
Bullets need to be harder, size die is rough and probably undersized and the bullets are not entering the die straight.

I’m thinking of making a new size die that has a “alignment counterbore” to align the bullet regardless of the base being off.

I’m going to have to order a small boring bar. Thinking of a bushing style die and make a few different diameters to play with it.


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[swheeler]

Ok sounds like I have a few issues I need to address.
Bullets need to be harder, size die is rough and probably undersized and the bullets are not entering the die straight.

I’m thinking of making a new size die that has a “alignment counterbore” to align the bullet regardless of the base being off.

I’m going to have to order a small boring bar. Thinking of a bushing style die and make a few different diameters to play with it.


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That lee die you have only has a very thin ring inside that sizes to nominal size, maybe 1-16 inch wide. As much over-sized as your bullets are you are probably sizing a very wide area inside the die. Some ideas that come to mind are to size the bullet before and again after powder coat, maybe size in steps if you can find intermediate diameter dies. You might try water dropping from PC oven, then lube the bullets on a lube pad before running through the sizer, you can anneal after they size just put them back in the PC oven for 20 min at 400f and let air cool. One other thing is your sizer die may be leaded or PC build up, might need cleaned.

[mrmachinist]

The die was brand new and these are the 4 Bullets that it had run through them.

I’m really thinking it’s an alignment issue. I have designed a new size die that will support the bullet before and after sizing and hopefully keep it straight.

I am also going to cast a few from my friends pot using his allow to see if my lead is too soft.

Sizing them twice is a great idea. I may try that too. Although the non pc Bullets bent the same.

I will also do a cast of the chamber to get dimensions as well.

Thanks for the help


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[Taterhead]

Stiffer alloy and alignment will help the crooked bullets. That is a lot of sizing.

But if the die itself is below stated diameter, then that is issue 2. Common with Lee bullet sizers as evident by the many helpful threads about how to hone more diameter.

Both Lee sizers I've owned were under sized. They're gone and I've settled on the NOE sizing die. Those come out the stated diameter on the nose. I think I've bought 12 bushings from NOE and all are nats eye precise.

[mrmachinist]

A friend cast a few bookies for home from his allow and air and water cooled some.

Both batches bent after sizing.

I’m going to make a new sizer this week hopefully and see if that helps.

I did get to function test the ar pistol for these.

Ran great with my standard plinking load with 85gr Barnes.

I need a bigger powder charge for these 214gr Bullets to cycle. The bolt was only coming back halfway. Shot them unsized and they all did fine.


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