Standing up coated 22 caliber bullets

[slide]

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This is another way to stand up powder coated 22 caliber bullets. Also a photo of a few coated bullets. No bb's,no tweezers. If anybody is interested I will tell you how to do it.

[Conditor22]

You are getting that matte finish down.

Ever try checking the velocity difference between matte and gloss?

I'm pretty sure how you do it --- I'll leave that to others to guess :).

[slide]

No, I haven't tested that yet. It is on the list. That black one on the lower right is a hi-tek bullet. Snuck in on me somehow. Except for the hi-tek bullet those are all one coat.

[RogerDat]

I'm a bit interested. I don't bother to stand them up but then I shake-n-bake so I only have to worry about baking not coating. I lay them on their side in non-stick aluminum foil pressed into the openings between the wires of a wire cake cooling rack. Legs on one side are cut short so the rack is sitting at an angle. Which doesn't help them bake but does make it a bit easier to set them in.

Think of how you might press foil down between the grate of a a BBQ grill. I do that so the bullets don't roll but are only touching in a thin line of contact.

So if there is a good way to stand them up I would surely like to examine it. May not use it today since I don't spray apply but then again I might. Also have to wonder if it works for 30 caliber. They tend to stand up ok up to a point. Heavy 220 grain .303 Brit are pretty tall and none to stable.

[slide]

RogerDat, if you can hang on until tommorrow I will let everybody know if there is enough interest. If not I will send you a pm with the info. I just got a call and am going to have to leave shortly and probably won't be back til tommorrow.

[CraigOK]

More knowledge and options is always better, I'd like to know

[BamaNapper]

Sure, put the tease out there then say 'maybe I'll tell you tomorrow, maybe I won't'. That's like telling the best joke ever and not remembering the punch line.

Just putting it out there, I'm sure somebody here knows how to figure out where you live. If you leave us hanging there could be serious consequences.

[Minerat]

Count me in on the secret handshake cause standing those little boogers is a pain.

[Gtrubicon]

C,mon, I just received my mp hornet mold. I plan to cast this weekend. I’m all ears on these little guys

[mrmachinist]

I’d like to know. I plan on trying to coat my first batch soon.


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[mcornell]

This topic interests me...

Please, tell us more.

[slide]

You are going to need a small hammer, a couple of pieces of 300 blackout brass. Lay the silicon tray squares up on a board and use the brass to cut your holes. 223 brass is too small, you will scrape off your powder coat. Tap don't beat. You will probably need to clean out your brass every once in a while. I used a paper clip straightened with a hook bent in it. You guys may come up with a better way. I tried a drill press but kept catching the side of the squares and cutting them. I stacked the bullets in by hand using nitrile gloves. This next part a lot of the guys won't agree with. Coating the bullets I used what me and AndyC call the vtb method. It is simply two containers laid in a vibratory tumbler on their sides with powder and bullets in them. I use empty powder bottles and AndyC uses other types of containers. The bottles will slowly turn while vibrating. I think that the bullets sliding on the plastic while vibrating and turning create more static thus a better coat and being able to handle the bullets. Besides that I hate having a tumbler full of powder to clean out if you want to change colors. I posted above a photo of some coated bullets. Those are all one coat. Time wise that seems to vary. Usually around five to twenty minutes depending on the humidity just like with other methods. It is a simple matter to open the lid and look. In the small powder bottles or containers I can usually put 150 bullets and two level tablespoons of powder. This is with 22 bullets. If you coat bigger bullets you may have to cut down on the number. You will have to experiment and see what works best for you. The bullets are poured in a wire screen and shaken good to remove excess powder. I used one of those door guards that go on storm doors to keep pets from pushing out the screen. The mesh is small enough that the little bullets won't fall thru. Using gloved hands I pickup a bullet in each hand and start putting them in the holes. The powder is put back in the bottle using a funnel.My granddaughter has timed me and it takes seven minutes for me to put in 160 bullets.That is at an old mans pace.When you first start doing it you will be slow but you will get faster. I would suggest that you use one tray for one color because the powder coat will build up on the trays over time. If you have a powder that won't coat this method will not make it coat. That's about it. If anyone has questions fire away. I hope this helps someone. Good luck! Almost forgot,I put parchment paper under the trays and I use a pan to set the tray in (check photo). If I want to do a bunch I have a flat pan that I can set three of the silicone trays on. All these bullets were cured using my thermocouple bullet method.

[Budzilla 19]

Ingenious!!! Thank you, I got a batch to do myself!

[Dragonheart]

I use a simple stainless bakers cooking rack with a small grid for 22's and larger grids for 30, 9mm & 45.

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[Dimner]

Slide, if I am understanding this process correctly. You are cutting holes on the bottom of those silicone square ice cube trays?

Like this one:https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/71wxoMImbVL._AC_SX466_.jpg

So you, for lack of a better term, cut a guiding hole (30 cal) in the bottom of each square, then when it comes time to use the tray... you are using them upside down and as a guide. Do I have that right? I like it. That would be a big help with PC bake when not installing GCs first. I find these trays perfect for baking 22 bullets with GCs pre fit. My hands are steady enough to keep them upright on the trip to the oven. However, when I do a PC coat first, and apply GCs afterward, i'm always cooking my hands trying to use my tweezers to get the fallen bullets back upright when they are in the oven.


Also, what is a thermocouple bullet cure method?

[slide]

Dimner,you got it. A thermocouple bullet is simple. You take a digital thermometer with a thermocouple that you can buy on Amazon for around twenty bucks. You can use a multi meter if it has a thermocouple and will measure the necessary heat. Drill a hole in a coated bullet and insert thermocouple and squeeze down the bullet on the thermocouple to secure it (Hossfly's idea). Lay it in the tray when you bake your bullets. Follow the mfg. instructions. For example, if you have a powder that needs to reach 400F and stay there for 10 minutes watch your themometer and when your bullets hit 400F start a timer to countdown from 10 minutes. I will post a photo of one of the ones I use. I know a lot of the guys put them in and give them 20 minutes and call it good. Then they hammer smash them and think the powder coat is cured. Look at it this way, I am not cutting him down, Elvis Ammo hammer smashed a bullet on his low heat method and it passed. At those low temps no way that coating was cured. You have to respect him. He is trying to help the coating community and he is not afraid of failure. He seems to be an honorable man. I have never heard him try and steal others ideas and he gives credit to those that come up with new ideas.

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These are not very good photos but you will get the idea. You'll notice that the 22 bullet has tape around the base. That has been on there for several years. This was before I started using Hossfly's idea.

[mrmachinist]

I use a simple stainless bakers cooking rack with a small grid for 22's and larger grids for 30, 9mm & 45.

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That’s what I have ordered. I’m hoping to works on my tall .277s


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[slide]

Use whatever works for you.

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I have gotten a couple of pm's from guys who liked the tray but was wondering about a standup way like the guys do with the metal plates. It can be done with silicone mats. The one I use is called supmatxl silicone counter mat. You can find it on amazon prime. It is thick enough that the 22 bullets will stand up. All my 22 bullets have gas checks so a bullet that doesn't may not fit as well. You will need to use 223 brass this time. I can put 120 bullets in this tray. The only problem is it costs $26.99 but I was able to make two out of it. Make sure the 223 brass has been resized.

[RogerDat]

I size and apply gas check with a Lee push through sizer before PC so that wouldn't be a problem. One might also be able to size the brass used to punch the holes out a bit with a Lee neck flaring die. Or if one already has the Lee flaring die body a $6.50 neck sizing button from NOE that fits that body would give you a precise neck size of the brass that you use to punch the holes. Might even try some 1/4 (.25) tubing to see how hole from that would work. .That .027 difference in size might still be snug enough to prevent falling.

Has anyone tried tumbling bullets and PC in a FART? I'm sure an empty powder bottle would fit. Tumble seems like it might be more even than my vibratory brass polisher.

However you do your bake I do think you need a way to confirm the temperature inside is correct, thrift store toaster oven dial temp and inside temp are related but not that closely. I would say knob is about 40* off of actual on mine.

If I had a bigger oven and wanted to spend the extra money a PID might be very useful for baking PC. For now I use a thermometer and go to temp, then run for a set period of time +/- based on bullet mass or ambient temp then hammer test the end product. Bullet mass is a heat sink, count of bullets being near equal the 255 grain .45 bullets are going to keep oven from reaching full temperature longer than same number of 158 grain .38's or 70 grain .223 The tool I use, spring loaded small needle nose pliers determines how close bullets can get so count of ones that stand up doesn't vary by enough to make up for the additional mass of lead to warm to temp. Only talking 1 or 2 minutes at most difference.

Has this been tried with cheap Walmart silicon baking sheets?

[slide]

RogerDat, be careful and don't get those holes too small. You will scrape off the powder coat. I have tried the silicone mats and they work fine. I prefer parchment paper. I also use my t-couple bullet so that I know the approx. temp of my bullets. I do have a pid on my oven. What is a fart? One thing about the vibratory tumbler. It is a slow turning. The bullets are sliding down the inside of the bottles and not being tossed. I'll add one more thing,some of the guys are assuming that they can use this method when the humidity is high and still get stellar coats. I will post some photos of bullets I did today. Where I am at the temp is 26 F and the humidity is 90%. The top bullets were vibrating for 5 minutes and the bottom was vibrated for 20 minutes. I couldn't get the shake and bake to stick at all.

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[mrmachinist]

I tried using the racks and got bare spots where they touched. Is that normal?


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[Agarbers]

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These are not very good photos but you will get the idea. You'll notice that the 22 bullet has tape around the base. That has been on there for several years. This was before I started using Hossfly's idea.

The attachments do not work for me.

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You can see the thermometer attached to the leg of the stand with the thermocouple going into the oven.

[slide]

mrmachinist, did you use those metal racks?

[mrmachinist]

mrmachinist, did you use those metal racks?

Yes used metal since I had it. I’m going to try the vibe method along with the silicone mats next.


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[slide]

I think you will have better luck. Remember not to cut your holes too small in your tray. If you use the tray as is the bullets will fall over and you will see those marks again. I gave the directions in page one of this post.

[Dragonheart]

I tried using the racks and got bare spots where they touched. Is that normal?
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I would think if the cooling rack wires were touching the bullet during the cook it would leave a mark. I use the cooling racks to separate and hold the bullets until I get them into the oven, then I lift the rack off and load another shelf. Of course I am loading a cold oven and typically cooking about 1200+ bullets in my toaster oven.

[Wolfdog91]

Can't wait to try this out !

[Land Owner]

So far, with a limited statistical population of 150, I have found no change in point of impact with the "little lines" left by hardware cloth on 22-55-SP (RCBS) boolits out to 100 yards. Not as pretty as some, I've got a ways to go in getting this PC stuff down, but it's still getting the job done...

https://i.postimg.cc/zfjM6vDZ/PC_Tray_[2].jpg




1. Not coated....2. Smoke's "Bacon Grease".....3. Lube Sized.....4. Smoke's Black

https://i.postimg.cc/m2NBcnhV/IMG_1516.jpg