?? shooting cast in ar 223, can it cycle?

[bigdog454]

If you are shooting cast in the ar 15 in 223 cal can your rifle cycle?
if it does, what powder, how heavy of a bullet, and what velocity?
Did you have to open the gas port?
I want to get my ar to cycle with a load about 2500 to 2700 fps in order to cut down on the muzzle blast. The neighbors are questioning why so loud, especially in the morn when hunting coyotes. the nearest is about 1000 ft away, and the range is 200 yards or less so 2500 to 2700 fps ought to work ok. Now; you have to understand this is a heavily wooded area with the nearest cross road out back is 1 mile ao we only shoot in that dir.
BD

[Markopolo]

search is your friend.. this is covered in great detail on this site by our rocket scientists.

[Larry Gibson]

"I want to get my ar to cycle with a load about 2500 to 2700 fps in order to cut down on the muzzle blast. The neighbors are questioning why so loud, especially in the morn when hunting coyotes. the nearest is about 1000 ft away, and the range is 200 yards or less so 2500 to 2700 fps ought to work ok"

If your AR has a 12" twist that might be doable though effective shots at 200 yards may not.

If your AR has a 7, 8 or 9" twist.....good luck with that.

[Wolfdog91]

I've legit been posting about how I've been doing this for the last two weeks or so.
So far I've been getting good cycling with a Lee .225 and the best accuracy has been with accurate 2017 17.2 grains 2100fps

[mehavey]

No problemmo....
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?368459-223-cast-bullets-w-ar15&p=4472544&viewfull=1#post4472544


If your AR has a 7, 8 or 9" twist.....good luck with that.Please elaborate...

[Winger Ed.]

Something some folks are switching to is casting with Zinc.
There's some youtube videos about it.
They just size them, and can pump 'em up about to jacketed speeds.

When I run out of my stash of FMJ, I'll be checking into it myself.
As Lead dries up, and is restricted in more and more places, it might be the future for casting.

[Hamish]

There are years and years of posts.

[Dapaki]

BD, I would have you do a search on this site to look for the efforts others have made to achieve this and then point you toward getting a tax stamp for a silencer.

[BentSprings]

Used Smokes Bacon Grease pc and Lee 22-55 bullets made of straight wheelweight alloy immediately waterdropped after pc'ing in my 9 twist 16 inch AR carbine built from random parts. Honest very near MOA accuracy out to 250 yards. Was able to do it surprisingly easily using both H4198 and Accurate2015 at BigDogs required speeds and then some. I am no cast in an AR 15 genius. Just read what those that actually did things before me did. This was done in a generic no name 223Wylde carbine gassed m4gery type barrel I bought off gunbroker for a song. Like Mehavey says "no problemo". If I can kill a beer can at 250yards with 223 cast you can kill a coyote.

[Wolfdog91]

I'm sorry be it seems to me , more and more , that this whole casting for AR's isn't as hard as eveyone makes it out to be. Personally I just went the PC hard BHN road and I haven't hand any real problems with function and what not.
Seems everyone else is just plain stuck on the older methods .....

[BrutalAB]

Havent tried cast in .223 seems like it would be a lot of work and a lot of luck to get respectable results.

I like my ARs and i like my cast boolits. So i am focusing on 350 legend. Ive matched jacketed accuracy and velocity with mine.

My 16 inch 350 is quieter than my 20 inch .223, or rather less loud.

Put a "blast can" or something another on my 20 inch 350, trying to further reduce noise without a stamp and wait. It reduced noise i heard, but i could tell from the echo that down range was a bit louder than my 16 inch.

[bigdog454]

Thanks for replays. Should haave done search first, but better late then never, found a lot of info here by doing the search.
Thanks again!
BD

[gpidaho]

bigdog454: My 9 twist 223 AR 15 runs nicely with no leading using the 55gr. Lyman 225646DV gas checked and powder coated over 19.5gr Hodgdon 4895. Gp

[mehavey]

just went the PC hard BHN road and I haven't hand any real problemsThe only (most significant) challenge with PC is that it changes/adds to nose/ogive dimension -- that may have been originally designed to fit the bore.
That can cause headaches.

[Larry Gibson]

No problemmo....
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?368459-223-cast-bullets-w-ar15&p=4472544&viewfull=1#post4472544

Please elaborate...

OP wants 2500 - 2700 fps and coyote accuracy out to 200 yards. At those velocities it has to do with the RPM created. Getting 1 - 2" groups at 50 yards most often will not correlate to the same level of accuracy at the longer ranges with the faster twists when using higher velocity/RPMs. There's plenty of information on that if you do a search. Most that are successful with cast in those twist ARs find the best is just at reliable functioning , usually in the 1900 - 2100 fps range. That may eventually kill a coyote at the 1000 feet to 200 yards the OP mentions but it's going to go a long way before it dies as coyotes are very tenacious.

In 12" twist ARs (that's what my shooter has) I can get decent "coyote" accuracy out to 100 yards with cast at 2500 - 2600 fps with cast but I don't use cast in the 223 for coyote's. Just my choice based on experience of losing a couple that were well hit.

The OP would be much better served using a good quality jacketed varmint bullet such as the Speer 52 gr HP. They will hold together in the faster twists if not pushed over 2700 fps and will still be deadly accurate with excellent terminal effect out to 200 yards.

[Larry Gibson]

I'm sorry be it seems to me , more and more , that this whole casting for AR's isn't as hard as eveyone makes it out to be. Personally I just went the PC hard BHN road and I haven't hand any real problems with function and what not.
Seems everyone else is just plain stuck on the older methods .....

How about showing us a 10 shot group or even a 5 shot group at 200 yards with your load? The accuracy level you've posted at 50 yards very well may not hold at 100 yards let alone 200 yards. Many think it will but only putting bullets on paper will tell. Show me it can be done and I might start PCing myself. Have shot numerous others PC/HT'd cast bullets enough in 7, 9 and 12" twists that, so far, I don't bother with PC/HT as they've not shown me anything over the "older methods". I'm an old dog but I can and am willing to learn new tricks. Please demonstrate?

[Markopolo]

new tricks???? i have trouble just sitting up and begging!!! :kidding:

I have not PC'd... i wont say I wont ever, but my lyman luber works great with gas checks...

if I try anything, it will be Transparent Aluminum... my friend scotty said, "How do we know he diddnt invent the stuff"

[mehavey]

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?368459-223-cast-bullets-w-ar15&p=4472544&viewfull=1#post4472544
OP wants 2500 - 2700 fps and coyote accuracy out to 200 yards.
Getting 1 - 2" groups at 50 yards
That was 1.2" at 100 yards
2,485 fps (Labradar'd) out of a 15" barrel
8 twist

I guess I could run it out to 200 and see what changes.

As to actually killing things with it . . . I agree jacketed soft-point at full velocity
would be more ethical than Lyman#2/pencil-in/pencil-out

[Wolfdog91]

How about showing us a 10 shot group or even a 5 shot group at 200 yards with your load? The accuracy level you've posted at 50 yards very well may not hold at 100 yards let alone 200 yards. Many think it will but only putting bullets on paper will tell. Show me it can be done and I might start PCing myself. Have shot numerous others PC/HT'd cast bullets enough in 7, 9 and 12" twists that, so far, I don't bother with PC/HT as they've not shown me anything over the "older methods". I'm an old dog but I can and am willing to learn new tricks. Please demonstrate?

Lol I've been posting pretty regularly what I've been up to my process and so on. So I have been. And trust me I will. Doin my best to be beyond meticulous with my work up data and what not. And so far my free video journal is at #7 videos where I explain why I'm doing Everything I'm doing. Don't look for a 200yd group though.
1. Not what I'm after
2. Not that good of a group shooter.
I'm fairly close to a sub MOA load at 50 and once that's done where moving it to 100. Still have multiple things to try before I can come close to saying this isn't going to work . Especially since I'm doing far better so far than more than a few people said I would. It's too much fun.
Also where ever your finding jacketed bullets right now please let me know because I need some speer gold dots to try in my grendel lol

[rancher1913]

cast is very capable of functioning in an ar, the problem with cast in ar's is lead will collect in the gas system and plug it so you need to keep an eye on it.

[mehavey]

...lead will collect in the gas system and plug it....In all the years I have been shooting cast proejectiles in gas guns, not once have I ever seen gas system problems.

Notwithstanding Garand & M1A w/ cast . . .

AR-15s/223
AR Legends/357
SR-762/308
AR Grendel/6.5
AR Beowoof/50

Mind you this w/ either thinnest liquid ALOX coat or PC, but "lead" has never been an issue

[Hanzy4200]

It is doable, but why? With the cost of excellent quality .223 pills being so low, it just seems pointless. I get doing it just to do it, but as a cost effective, or ballistically effective solution, I don't see it. As for muzzle blast, the obvious choice would be a suppressor. Or maybe try working up a load with a heavy 77 gr pill.

[Wolfdog91]

On a serious note though, seriously where are y'all finding jacketed...well anything right now ? Seriously seems just about eveyone is sold out of everything

[Greg S]

Jacketed bullets for blasting ammo were bought cheap years ago and stacked deep pre-Obummer years. Still have plenty of 69s, 75s, 77s and 80s too. If this drought has taught any of you youngsters anything is be prepared for an election drought.

[bigdog454]

Larry Gibson ("I don't use cast in the 223 for coyote's. Just my choice based on experience of losing a couple that were well hit.")
I think that you are right Larry, to get a humane kill on a coyote I would be better off using a expanding copper jacket bullet. I have quite a few 52 gr of just that type and I think after all of this discussion that would be the best route to take.
Thanks again to everyone for you great information and input.
BD