Just Back From the Range

[Johnch]

I learned 2 things

I went there about 5 PM to test a new 40 S&W load in the Sig 229
But I took the Glock 17/22 ( I have both a 9 mm and 40 S&W barrel for it ) to try the loads in it also
The Sig 229 LOVED the 180 gr cast bullet load
But the Glock 22 barrel didn't group the load well

I also took a few hundred 9 mm rounds to plink with in the Glock with the 9 mm barrel

The First thing I learned
The 2 other shooters DROOLLED over a coffee can 2/3 full of loaded 9 mm ammo
Almost begging me to SELL them ammo as they had shot up all the ammo they had brought
I told them cast some bullets and load their own ammo
That idea was about like I had called them names and left


The Second thing I learned was I didn't want to shoot reloads from someone that had been at the range earlier
As when I was done shooting , I swept up and collected all the brass
As I use the range brass for ME to reload

I found a bunch of both 9 mm and 45 ACP brass with REALLY Flattened primers
I mean the 45 ACP primers looked like someone had used knife to smear the primers totally FLAT
The 9 mm Primers were even worse
Those primers also had been smeared totally flat
BUT there was signs on most of them that the primers had flowed back into the firing pin hole
But also a lot of the Head Stamps on the 9 mm brass had been almost also smeared flat
I am not sure who it was shooting this ammo or had reloaded the ammo
But IMO they had a time bomb in those loaded ammo
Sort of like 9 MM +P+++
And IMO all to soon someone was soon going to have a pistol come apart at best
OR Have the pistol fail and they would get HURT

As I am now just a member , not a Trustee anymore
I will give the Range Director a call in the morning to give him a heads up
So He can look at the video and maybe tell who needs a talking to

So I knew a lot of people didn't want to take the time to reload

But I would not want to even be at the range when someone was shooting 9 mm ammo loaded that hot :sad:

Have a nice day
John

[Gtrubicon]

What about down the road when these kinda people want to sell said firearm, that has been stressed it whole life shooting over pressured rounds? There are a lot of people new to reloading that aren’t taking it seriously, I’m trying to reign in 3 currently.

[Ford SD]

I think we all have found brass pickups over the years of really flat primers

What I do is sort for caliber , then clean

Then sort by head stamp and at that time if I see any really flat primers they go right into the Brass recycle bucket
and when sorting find the berdan primers ..... big reason for sorting by head stamp

berdan = scrap bucket too

I also load by head stamp

Free Brass not worth having a problem with later

[kerplode]

The average gun owner these days is too stupid or careless or both to reload safely. Hell, most of them can barely shoot factory loads without accidentally killing someone in the process. They'll eventually blow their face/fingers off because they can't be bothered to look up from Twittface long enough to pay attention, or they think they know better than the manuals and push everything way over max. These are usually the same doofuses that spout off about "Long range hunting" and the elk they killed at 800 yards, but shoot 12" patterns at 100 yards off a bench...Sure, Bubba.

I'm to the point now that I just leave if anyone else shows up while I'm on the range. Don't want to get shot in the back checking targets or catch a face full of shrapnel when some booger-eater is screwing around on a cease fire, or blows his gun to smithereens with his super duper internet-recipe reloads.

[shampine]

The average gun owner these days is too stupid or careless or both to reload safely. Hell, most of them can barely shoot factory loads without accidentally killing someone in the process. They'll eventually blow their face/fingers off because they can't be bothered to look up from Twittface long enough to pay attention, or they think they know better than the manuals and push everything way over max. These are usually the same doofuses that spout off about "Long range hunting" and the elk they killed at 800 yards, but shoot 12" patterns at 100 yards off a bench...Sure, Bubba.

I'm to the point now that I just leave if anyone else shows up while I'm on the range. Don't want to get shot in the back checking targets or catch a face full of shrapnel when some booger-eater is screwing around on a cease fire, or blows his gun to smithereens with his super duper internet-recipe reloads.

Wow, do you call people all these names to their face while they have these loaded guns ? How many people have been shot at said range,blew their face off and other such nonsense. ?

[kerplode]

I've heard this exact phrase on multiple occasions: "It's way over the max in the book, but it's fine...Lawyers write those books anyway."

I've had, on more occasions than I can count, been shooting only to look over and see some goober pointing his handgun muzzle down the line, directly at me, with a dumb look on his face poking at it because...Well who knows why. Their reply is always some stammering nonsense about the safety being on or something equally stupid.

I've had, on more occasions than I can count, been checking targets on a "cold line" and looked back to see some fool down behind his rifle fiddling with it. They usually come back with something related to testing the trigger or looking through the scope.

On one occasion, some ******* actually FIRED A RIFLE ROUND while I was down range. His reply after I screamed at him was "What's the problem...You were way down at that end and I was shooting over here"

So yeah. Not all shooters are stupid and/or unsafe, but LOTS of them are. So I just remove myself from the situation now. They can shoot each other in the back and blow themselves up. I'll come another time when no one else is around.

[Ateam]

I just picked up a bunch of LC 65 MATCH 30-06 brass out of the snow at the range. When I got them home and thawed out, they had pierced primers, flattened primers, primers half blown out of the pocket. I mean about as bad as it gets without loosing your face. Some scary people out there.

[john.k]

I was beside an older guy shooting a 22/250,he was having sticky bolt every shot,and finally had a case separation ,for which he simply grabbed my rod without asking,and tried to ram it out.......no base ,no go......Anyway he packed up his stuff ,I had to ask for my rod back.......when he was gone I looked at his brass......nearly every one had a spotted line around the base , and cratered primers.....He had a nice FN Mauser short action too ,be a shame to blow up such a rare gun.

[contender1]

One other possibility about the 9mm brass.
In USPSA,, shooters are allowed to load 9mm hotter,, in the "Open" category,, for their race guns. Hotter than many factory rounds,, and too hot for many of the "normal" 9mm handguns.
Maybe that brass was left behind by a USPSA Open class shooter,,,???

[dverna]

I am blessed and have my range off the back porch.

[truckerdave397]

Seems like if the person that was shooting was the same person that was doing the reloading then that person would have kept the brass.

[brewer12345]

I've heard this exact phrase on multiple occasions: "It's way over the max in the book, but it's fine...Lawyers write those books anyway."

I've had, on more occasions than I can count, been shooting only to look over and see some goober pointing his handgun muzzle down the line, directly at me, with a dumb look on his face poking at it because...Well who knows why. Their reply is always some stammering nonsense about the safety being on or something equally stupid.

I've had, on more occasions than I can count, been checking targets on a "cold line" and looked back to see some fool down behind his rifle fiddling with it. They usually come back with something related to testing the trigger or looking through the scope.

On one occasion, some ******* actually FIRED A RIFLE ROUND while I was down range. His reply after I screamed at him was "What's the problem...You were way down at that end and I was shooting over here"

So yeah. Not all shooters are stupid and/or unsafe, but LOTS of them are. So I just remove myself from the situation now. They can shoot each other in the back and blow themselves up. I'll come another time when no one else is around.

With covid I mostly shoot in the national forest these days, but when I frequent a range I never, ever give the range officers the slightest bit of guff for being safety Nazis. On a public range anyone with $20 and an ID can walk in and that includes idiots, those that do not understand English, the impaired, etc.

[David2011]

One other possibility about the 9mm brass.
In USPSA,, shooters are allowed to load 9mm hotter,, in the "Open" category,, for their race guns. Hotter than many factory rounds,, and too hot for many of the "normal" 9mm handguns.
Maybe that brass was left behind by a USPSA Open class shooter,,,???

Yep. I’m a USPSA shooter and have shot with several guys that shot 9mm Major but I don’t recall their primers ever looking like John’s description.

I also don’t scrounge 9mm brass where USPSA is shot. At this point, I’ve quit scrounging 9mm altogether.

[Lloyd Smale]

Seems like if the person that was shooting was the same person that was doing the reloading then that person would have kept the brass.

thats what i was thinking.

[robg]

i dont teach people to reload ,i just introduce them to reloading .the 1st thing i tell them is get a manual and never go over max listed loads .one guy wanted me to show him how to reload then started telling me how he could get his 223 to shoot like a 22-250 by putting more powder in .needless to say i told him to go away .

[dverna]

i dont teach people to reload ,i just introduce them to reloading .the 1st thing i tell them is get a manual and never go over max listed loads .one guy wanted me to show him how to reload then started telling me how he could get his 223 to shoot like a 22-250 by putting more powder in .needless to say i told him to go away .

I have two guys from deer camp that want to learn. They will be using my equipment and I will try to teach them right. Never taught reloading before. My concern is that most people want "instant gratification". Both of these guys are about 15 years younger than I am and seem to have their head screwed on straight....but I will see. Another concern is that neither are "shooters". They are concerned about getting hunting ammunition. Loading a couple of boxes a year may give them an unwarranted feeling of knowing what they are doing.

[flyingmonkey35]

Over the past few months I've been shooting the bull at the club more then anything else.



Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[Ateam]

I think Don hit the nail on the head. To be a successful reloader I think you also need to be a "shooter" and enjoy the process as a whole. Otherwise it is just a hassle.

[centershot]

I learned 2 things

I went there about 5 PM to test a new 40 S&W load in the Sig 229
But I took the Glock 17/22 ( I have both a 9 mm and 40 S&W barrel for it ) to try the loads in it also
The Sig 229 LOVED the 180 gr cast bullet load
But the Glock 22 barrel didn't group the load well

I also took a few hundred 9 mm rounds to plink with in the Glock with the 9 mm barrel

The First thing I learned
The 2 other shooters DROOLLED over a coffee can 2/3 full of loaded 9 mm ammo
Almost begging me to SELL them ammo as they had shot up all the ammo they had brought
I told them cast some bullets and load their own ammo
That idea was about like I had called them names and left


The Second thing I learned was I didn't want to shoot reloads from someone that had been at the range earlier
As when I was done shooting , I swept up and collected all the brass
As I use the range brass for ME to reload

I found a bunch of both 9 mm and 45 ACP brass with REALLY Flattened primers
I mean the 45 ACP primers looked like someone had used knife to smear the primers totally FLAT
The 9 mm Primers were even worse
Those primers also had been smeared totally flat
BUT there was signs on most of them that the primers had flowed back into the firing pin hole
But also a lot of the Head Stamps on the 9 mm brass had been almost also smeared flat
I am not sure who it was shooting this ammo or had reloaded the ammo
But IMO they had a time bomb in those loaded ammo
Sort of like 9 MM +P+++
And IMO all to soon someone was soon going to have a pistol come apart at best
OR Have the pistol fail and they would get HURT

As I am now just a member , not a Trustee anymore
I will give the Range Director a call in the morning to give him a heads up
So He can look at the video and maybe tell who needs a talking to

So I knew a lot of people didn't want to take the time to reload

But I would not want to even be at the range when someone was shooting 9 mm ammo loaded that hot :sad:

Have a nice day
John

John, I couldn't agree with you more! Some guys are so driven by the "velocity monster" that they ignore the safety aspects of handloading. "It won't happen to me 'cuz I know what I'm doing!" LOL! I see it at our range too.

[Johnch]

i dont teach people to reload ,i just introduce them to reloading .the 1st thing i tell them is get a manual and never go over max listed loads .one guy wanted me to show him how to reload then started telling me how he could get his 223 to shoot like a 22-250 by putting more powder in .needless to say i told him to go away .

For must of my reloading for the 9 MM and 45 ACP I tend to start at close to the Starting loads
I also try to get people I show how to start reloading to do the same
As I found a lot of the time the slower loads are both more accurate and Softer on ME & the Pistol
I will try working closer to max slowly
As sometimes the groups will shrink

John

[Winger Ed.]

itelling me how he could get his 223 to shoot like a 22-250

I've run into guys that started at the max. and worked up.
I've told them if they want a .300WinMag, its cheaper to just buy one rather than trying to make it out of their .308.

[Johnch]

John, I couldn't agree with you more! Some guys are so driven by the "velocity monster" that they ignore the safety aspects of handloading. "It won't happen to me 'cuz I know what I'm doing!" LOL! I see it at our range too.

For SOME rifles I have started to consider what the capacity of the FIREFORMED Case is in the form as I will be reloading
Not as if I was reloading Full Length Sized cases
As I have a OLDER Savage 110 in 223 , I bought it in 1984 or 1985
It has a HUGE chamber
I use a Hornady 22 Cal Neck Sizer and JUST size the neck and don't touch the rest of the case
After several reloads I bump the shoulder back a little with a reamed out sizer

As I reload the 223 cases
They have a larger case capacity than listed for the 222 Rem Mag
So I started working up a load with 50 gr Nosler BT bullets , Rem Cases , Rem 7 1/2 and H335
I kept bumping up the powder charge .2 gr at a time till I was at the Max load for the 222 Rem Max
I figured a 3/8" group at 100 yards good enough when the fired case would just drop from the chamber

That rifle has been used for a lot of years a LOT of shots
I wish I had bought a extra barrel when they were switching over to the new short action with the larger barrel threads
As the throat is getting shot out
So I either have a thread or 2 turned off the barrel and have a new chamber reamed
Or I buy a new barrel
Neither will give me the old over sizer chamber
Not a huge problem , but I will have to shoot up all the old loads
Then start with a fresh batch of cases .... Oh well 223 Ammo and Good Quality 223 Brass is Easy to get and Still CHEAP Right ?? LOL

John

[shooterg]

I'm happy when the boolit clears the barrel, happier if it hits close to where I'm aiming, and happiest when by some miracle it rings the steel or shoots an actual group rather than a shotgun pattern . I don't care if the boolits break the speed limit or not , plus my powder lasts longer !