Who knows two cylinder john Deere's

[redneck1]

So who knows two cylinder john Deere's ?

I've been put in charge of procuring a two cylinder for a local church group
Their goal is to get a tractor to pull parade floats and to let the pastor who has been there for over 35 years as a volunteer fulfill a dream of doing some farm stock pulling .

They have a pretty decent budget to get a good condition tractor and do it up a bit .
I know what I want to get ... a late model A between 49-52 mainly to get the electric start and higher HP.

Thankfully two poppers are easy to find in my area , a ten minute search turned up 6 of them in the right age range in the $1500 -$2500 price range
That from outside appearance look like good candidates .

I am not a two cylinder expert , but I am mechanicaly inclined .
I can diagnose engine knocks , bad valves and such .
And I know to check for a loose flywheel and the resulting crankshaft endplay ... Though I believe that's mainly a issue for the big diesels .

So I guess the question is for those who know ... Are there any known problem areas I should look for in particular ?

[Brassmonkey]

One lonely farmer on youtube.

[Springfield]

My uncle, but he is in Massachusetts.

[wch]

You might check the playlist at the youtube site <mustie 1>.

[Gewehr-Guy]

In the winter time, if these tractors have been setting outside, they can collect condensation in the crankcase, and it will collect in the oil pump gears and freeze. If you crank the motor over, and there is too much water and the gears are froze solid, it will break a little round coupling that joins the pump to the small shaft that drives it. Not too hard to fix, if your arm will fit down into the bottom of the crankcase.

One time I forgot to turn the gas valve off on the tank, and the float leaked by, and filled one cyl with gas and locked up the motor. So I was standing beside the tractor and used my hand to press down on the starter pedal, and cranked the motor over. All the gasoline sprayed out of the plug hole and about two inches away from my belly, and ignited. I had forgot to pull the wire off the magneto, and it sparked through the plug wire cap against the frame. All the flaming gas landed in the dry grass beside the tractor, and I had quite a time stomping it out. Had I been standing a few inches closer, I would have been badly burned, or worse.

[Froogal]

So who knows two cylinder john Deere's ?

I've been put in charge of procuring a two cylinder for a local church group
Their goal is to get a tractor to pull parade floats and to let the pastor who has been there for over 35 years as a volunteer fulfill a dream of doing some farm stock pulling .

They have a pretty decent budget to get a good condition tractor and do it up a bit .
I know what I want to get ... a late model A between 49-52 mainly to get the electric start and higher HP.

Thankfully two poppers are easy to find in my area , a ten minute search turned up 6 of them in the right age range in the $1500 -$2500 price range
That from outside appearance look like good candidates .

I am not a two cylinder expert , but I am mechanicaly inclined .
I can diagnose engine knocks , bad valves and such .
And I know to check for a loose flywheel and the resulting crankshaft endplay ... Though I believe that's mainly a issue for the big diesels .

So I guess the question is for those who know ... Are there any known problem areas I should look for in particular ?

I used to be into that hobby. Not John Deere's in particular, but Farmall Hs and Ms. The one thing I have learned from all of it is that it far less costly to buy a tractor that is ready to go rather than buying one that needs a lot of work. A pair of NEW rear tires will cost in excess of $1,000. Your choice of a '49 to '52 A is a good one, and there are bunches of them out there.

[Parson]

As an old farm boy who spent many hours on a putten Johnny I agree with Froogal, get one that has already been rebuilt by someone who knows what they are doing, take care of it and it will outlast your grandkids

[Tatume]

Is the John Deere Model A tractor the one that Oliver is seen riding in Green Acres?

[Blanket]

Is the John Deere Model A tractor the one that Oliver is seen riding in Green Acres?

no it is not

[redneck1]

Well when i was asked to look for a tractor my first remark was to find one already done to , but they want one to do up themselves .

Rumor is they have enough of a budget to do as they wish so I'll do my best to find a solid base to build on .
It might be a geographic thing but oddly the nice restored tractors I'm seeing in my area are all earlier hand starts .

I'm looking for decent sheet metal , engine that runs decent and doesn't smoke to much and solid wheels that aren't rusted threw .

[Parson]

Iron wheels will rattle your teeth out on pavement

[Tatume]

Is the John Deere Model A tractor the one that Oliver is seen riding in Green Acres?

The tractor that Oliver is seen riding in Green Acres has long appealed to me. In the TV Series, the tractor was called a Hoyt Clagwell Tractor, however, the tractor actually used, were two different tractors. A John Deere "GP" was used in the opening, and the tractor used during the rest of the show was a Fordson model tractor.

https://starcars.fandom.com/wiki/Hoyt-Clagwell_Tractor_(Green_Acres)

[waksupi]

Iron wheels will rattle your teeth out on pavement

Not to mention illegal on pavement in most states.

[Gewehr-Guy]

i have a GP , General Purpose, but my friends call it my General Pieces, as it is all taken apart in my shop.

[Texas by God]

I grew up with Dad's Massey and Allis Chalmers( you could pop a decent wheelie when he wasn't around using the hand clutch)- but I remember lots of "Popping Johnnys" on the surrounding farms. I still have a 1948 M Farmall that has been "yard art" for ten years but is fixable.....

Sent from my SM-A716U using Tapatalk

[hc18flyer]

Grandpa Henry had an older A and B. The A was electric start with the Belden add on power steering. The B was purchased new with a 2 row cultivator and planter attachment, for $925. Grandpa had a 'perfect' sequence for starting it with the fly wheel. He got pretty mad when I strayed from the sequence and he had to 'fix it' for me! In later years, it sat on a small hillside, so we could coast it, to start. I remember choking it out pulling a big rack of hay bales up a hill, simple fix, coast backwards, pop the hand clutch, and away you go! Those old tractors did a hell of a lot of work, for their size and hp! Brings back lots of fond memories! Good luck on your search, Tom

[KCSO]

The biggest problem now with the Johnny Pop is that the carbs develop cracks and the air leaks make them hard to start and run rough. We looked for a long time for a GOOD carb for Dad's B. If you get an early electric start make sure it is 12 volt set up and not the older 6 volt. As for the rest if you have bailing wire pliers and a monkey wrench you have all the tools the farmers around here ever use! The day I could crank over the B without opening the petcocks was the day I was a MAN!

[Gewehr-Guy]

An IHC tractor owner was arguing with a JD owner, and he said he expected his H to pull his plow across the field, not to JERK it across!

[godzilla]

Spline wear on the crankshaft


I have a 1949 A in the barn that is waiting for my money to overcome my sense.

Pulled it at the county fair when I was a kid and had a blast. As others have stated the tires are worth more than the tractors now.

[EDG]

I know some of them have a hand clutch which leaves you with only one hand on the steering wheel when the tractor lurches. If the one hand on the steering wheel loses its grip you can wind up falling under the plow.

[quail4jake]

276350
This is our 1949 A. Restored to factory new, now used 10 years. We use it for real farm work but take care of it and don't abuse it, it dynoed at 45 HP with aluminum high top pistons but no other performance improvements. Best way to do this is to buy one restored from someone reputable and keep it up. Just a little advice: these can be very dangerous in the hands of inexperienced operators and young wiseguys, never let anyone operate it who is not intimately acquainted with the hand clutch and has an understanding of center of gravity and weight distribution. No hills or slopes beyond gentle... Good luck!

[redneck1]

I think I might have found a winner on the first try .
Went and looked at a 51 A this evening . everything was as described , sheet metal is in good shape , engine sounds good , transmission is quiet in all gears . wheels aren't rusted out from leaking calcium . steering gear is fairly right . and it comes with a parts tractor that mostly runs ...

It does have a few issues like you'd expect , the clutch is weak and its had some poor repairs on the roll o matic front .
But the parts tractor has a good front end and the clutch isn't a huge deal .

The price is right , he wants $2300 for both tractors .


I talked to the fellow writing the checks for this endeavor , I think it'll be near exactly what they want .

[samari46]

A lot of sugar cane farmers down here use military tires on their tractors. In fact there are some advertisements in the quick pick which is a listing of services, tools, and what have you. Usually comes out once a month. Factory tires are extremely expensive. And if you have a field that is very muddy can be a pain to drive through. I've seen two tractors one tied to the other with steel cable just to get one cane cart out of a muddy field. Frank

[owejia]

We had one of the old 2 popers, cranked it by spinning the flywheel or rolling down a hill. Started on gasoline and could switch over to coaloil or kerosene only used it to drag a harrow for smoothing ground or for raking hay. Three forward speeds and one reverse. Raked many an acre of hay with that thing. On rough ground was like trying to ride a bucking horse.

[Froogal]

I think I might have found a winner on the first try .
Went and looked at a 51 A this evening . everything was as described , sheet metal is in good shape , engine sounds good , transmission is quiet in all gears . wheels aren't rusted out from leaking calcium . steering gear is fairly right . and it comes with a parts tractor that mostly runs ...

It does have a few issues like you'd expect , the clutch is weak and its had some poor repairs on the roll o matic front .
But the parts tractor has a good front end and the clutch isn't a huge deal .

The price is right , he wants $2300 for both tractors .


I talked to the fellow writing the checks for this endeavor , I think it'll be near exactly what they want .

You'd better just grab it quick.

[MaryB]

Memories of starting Grandpa's Minneapolis Moline crank start tractor... that and 2 row equipment is all he ever farmed with. Little brother broke his wrist on a backfire because he didn't have his weight on the crank and it kicked back. We finally upgraded it to electric start when Grandpa turned 65. He had retired and was just using it for snow removal. Cousins across the road were renting the land for a share of the crops(think Grandpa and Grandma got 20% of the harvest as rent). That was their retirement fund. When they died the kids kept up the rental for many years and finally sold when land was at peak value... think it was $20,000/acre then tidy sum split 4 ways for 360 acres of land. I lost out on my deer hunting spot though! The old grove was a deer highway after the farmhouse sat empty for 10 years(it needed major repairs and a new well was needed to keep renting it, not economically feasible).

[Digger]

apologize for off subject ..but yes memories ...
Worked on ranch south of Lund , Nevada playing cowboy and such .. they had a two cylinder Deer and it was a bit of a challenge to start at times .
Don't remember what model but it was a "pony motor " start system which had it's own quirks at times but was fun.
In the middle of winter , it could be a bit of a challenge.
Maybe some one here could narrow down the particular model ?

[jonp]

I think I might have found a winner on the first try .
Went and looked at a 51 A this evening . everything was as described , sheet metal is in good shape , engine sounds good , transmission is quiet in all gears . wheels aren't rusted out from leaking calcium . steering gear is fairly right . and it comes with a parts tractor that mostly runs ...

It does have a few issues like you'd expect , the clutch is weak and its had some poor repairs on the roll o matic front .
But the parts tractor has a good front end and the clutch isn't a huge deal .

The price is right , he wants $2300 for both tractors .


I talked to the fellow writing the checks for this endeavor , I think it'll be near exactly what they want .

Take that deal

[Parson]

With pony motor maybe an R

[Pressman]

All the diesel's used the pony motor. An R or 80 diesel has a significantly massive pop. More like a thump that really noticeable at the low RPM they operated at.

[Froogal]

apologize for off subject ..but yes memories ...
Worked on ranch south of Lund , Nevada playing cowboy and such .. they had a two cylinder Deer and it was a bit of a challenge to start at times .
Don't remember what model but it was a "pony motor " start system which had it's own quirks at times but was fun.
In the middle of winter , it could be a bit of a challenge.
Maybe some one here could narrow down the particular model ?

With pony motor, it would have been a diesel. Possibly an R if it was a standard tread model, could also be a 720, 730, or 820/830.

[Digger]

All the diesel's used the pony motor. An R or 80 diesel has a significantly massive pop. More like a thump that really noticeable at the low RPM they operated at.

Yes indeed it had quite a "pop" when operating , very impressive when operating for a young cowboy then !

[Parson]

With pony motor, it would have been a diesel. Possibly an R if it was a standard tread model, could also be a 720, 730, or 820/830.


Not all diesels, our 730 was electric

[Mk42gunner]

I think I might have found a winner on the first try .
Went and looked at a 51 A this evening . everything was as described , sheet metal is in good shape , engine sounds good , transmission is quiet in all gears . wheels aren't rusted out from leaking calcium . steering gear is fairly right . and it comes with a parts tractor that mostly runs ...

It does have a few issues like you'd expect , the clutch is weak and its had some poor repairs on the roll o matic front .
But the parts tractor has a good front end and the clutch isn't a huge deal .

The price is right , he wants $2300 for both tractors .


I talked to the fellow writing the checks for this endeavor , I think it'll be near exactly what they want .


You'd better just grab it quick.
As one that has almost restored my Dad's (grandpa bought two of them new the year my Dad turned ten) Allis-Chalmers WD, buy those two tractors. The hard work is done.

Mine burns a lot of oil, but I can't justify spending the money to rebuild the engine as little as I actually use it. I can go out to the barn and start it on the coldest winter day though.

Robert

[redneck1]

Went a picked up both tractors today , it almost turned into a circus .
I know a hand clutch seems odd to some . but they aren't as tricky as they seem to be ... Its called hand eye coordination for a reason .

But the issue came in when the guy who was hauling them couldn't quite get it into his head that you don't need three ramps to load a tricycle tractor ... I just kept my mouth shut and loaded it myself while they was bothering the poor farmer for a plank to use for a ramp .

So while they was all busy hauling the first tractor off I stayed behind to get the parts tractor running as well as it would and out of the barn its been sitting in for the last 20 years .
Got the tires aired up a temporary gas tank rigged up and sediment bowl
Cleaned out and the farmer found a spare set of plugs and some used points that didn't look to bad after a quick sanding .
Stuck some jumper cables on it and it started up and actually didn't run to bad at a fast idle .
After we got it loaded up they guy hauling it gave me a bit of a kick in the pants by asking how late the scrap yard was open .

It seems they all decided they didn't want to be bothered with it and it was easiest to just haul it off for scrap ...
Sooo .... Now im $300 poorer and have a rather rough John Deere tractor in my yard .

[Mk42gunner]

Yep, kind of strange the first time you see a tractor twist to load with two ramps, but it works. I wouldn't want to do it with a tall trailer though.

On the plus side, it runs and the tires sort of hold air. Now to find the green implements that you need or want.

Good Luck, old tractors can be as much of an addiction as casting boolits.

Robert

[redneck1]

Yea , I'm not going to keep it .
I don't have a need for it , I just couldn't see it going to the scrap yard .
If I put it out by the road with a for sale sign it'll probably disappear in a matter of hours .

I might go as far as cleaning the carb out , once it ran long enough to warm up it quit smoking , just wouldn't run faster then a high idle without spitting n sputtering .

[Petrol & Powder]

Yea , I'm not going to keep it .
I don't have a need for it , I just couldn't see it going to the scrap yard .
If I put it out by the road with a for sale sign it'll probably disappear in a matter of hours .

I might go as far as cleaning the carb out , once it ran long enough to warm up it quit smoking , just wouldn't run faster then a high idle without spitting n sputtering .

Just my personal experience with old engines, if it will run and isn't totally trashed; you are usually ahead of the game. At that point making it run well is normally just a series of little things that need attention. That's the good news.
The bad news is all of the other little things on the tractor/truck/car/generator/whatever; will drive you to the poorhouse.

It's the tires, sheet metal, steering gear, linkages, radiators, etc. that will suck the money out of your wallet like a shop vac on steroids.

[redneck1]

That's all true ...

Its a good thing gas and distillate was cheap back in the day because at the rate it emptied a 2 gallon can just getting it running , warmed up , loaded and unloaded I'm pretty sure just keeping it fed would bankrupt anyone who had to actually farm with one these days .

I am going to have to move it to the back yard and out of sight , already had two people stop this morning to look at the thing .
While I don't plan on keeping it , I am going to hold onto it for a couple months just in case the fellows doing the restoration decide to change their minds on swapping out the repaired front end . or possibly run into something expensive they need .
This one also has a mostly complete three point hitch they might want down the road a bit

[Petrol & Powder]

Sounds like a plan.

[Mk42gunner]

One thing I forgot to mention. Every old tractor I can remember has needed the brakes worked on. I do not like the drop the implement method of stopping.

I don't know much about the fuel economy of farm tractors, but it should have enough capacity for at least a days work when the tank is full. My WD will hold 15 gallons, not that I have ever had need to really work it for a full day. I would imagine all other brands were the same. The Ford 9N I grew up driving had a two gallon reserve when it ran out of gas, so you didn't have to leave it in the field and walk for a gas can.

One thing about it there is no mistaking the sound of a two cylinder JD going by.

Robert

[Parson]

One thing I forgot to mention. Every old tractor I can remember has needed the brakes worked on. I do not like the drop the implement method of stopping.

I don't know much about the fuel economy of farm tractors, but it should have enough capacity for at least a days work when the tank is full. My WD will hold 15 gallons, not that I have ever had need to really work it for a full day. I would imagine all other brands were the same. The Ford 9N I grew up driving had a two gallon reserve when it ran out of gas, so you didn't have to leave it in the field and walk for a gas can.

One thing about it there is no mistaking the sound of a two cylinder JD going by.

Robert

I never had one with a tank big enough to go all day, filled every noon and maybe more when working 16 hour days like in harvest, haying etc.

[bedbugbilly]

My vote would be for a restored JD Model B with an electric start. We had two Model Bs when I was a kid - a '35 and a '36 - both started by turning the flywheel. If tuned well, not an issue to get started but if flooded, could be a real PIA - especially if you are shut down to wait for the parade to start and then have to get it going in a hurry to keep the line going - don't ask me how I know about that! :-)

[redneck1]

I am a Inveterate tinkerer .. If something is broke i usually can't help myself from tearing into it .

So yesterday afternoon I pulled the carb ('s). Off and let it soak over night .
Gave it a good cleaning this morning and put it back on .
Played with it for about an hour , low side adjusted easy and again would run fine at up to a high idle but try as I might I just couldn't get it to run on the high side .
So I checked the timing which seems right .
Even went so far as to dig up a couple plug wires that are in better shape then what's on it .
Still no luck ...
Finally I got smart ... Started it back up and gave the governor a couple wacks with a mallet and bingo it revved right up .

So now it runs . actually it seems to run fairly well .
The tires have held air for the couple days its been here so I guess that's a win . I'd put them 2 notches up from bad , but still a few notches away from being good .

I'll have to look up and see how much oil the crankcase holds .. If I have enough on hand I'll change it .

The gas tank ... Eh its pretty rough inside . I have some muratic acid , if get ambitious enough I might see if it'll loosen up some of big stuff .
I have a tig welder so I can patch up a few pin holes if its necessary .
Well provided I can get the 10 gallons of sludge that's in it out .

And again I have no plans on keeping it around but at least now it runs and I can move it around if needed . it would be nice to be able to do that without a two gallon can bungied to the hood ....
If I can fix a few things without spending any money I will .

[Mal Paso]

You're Hooked. LOL There are worse things to spend time on.

[curdog007]

I have a 52 A Model that is the work tractor on this place - brush hogging and skidding firewood out of the woods mainly.
It looks just as bad as the day I found it in a field behind a farm house 20 years ago, but the old girl still fires on the first spin.
I have the wheels set on the ends of the axles so the axles don't catch a tree in the woods, and it's a little more stable on the hillsides with the row crop front end. I've never had a close call on a hillside with this tractor, if you look at a 2 cylinder JD almost all the weight is below waist level, the rest is tin. They're like a crab, but like everything else, you have to go slow and careful. Speed will catch you out every time, I don't care what piece of gear it is. Same with the hand clutch, get used to it on easy going first, and pay attention (this seems to be a problem for too many folks nowadays, I'm afraid).

[redneck1]

I wouldn't say I'm hooked , I do enjoy tinkering with stuff though .
I also won't be spending any money on it . truth be told I shouldn't have spent the $300 on it , my finances are still rather shakey .
But I'll at minimum get my money back , if the church group doesn't change their mind I'll probably do a good better then that .

If I had a building to put it in I'd consider keeping it around , having something bigger for dragging out firewood would be handy , but my little ford tractor has been getting the job done for 23 years now

[Mk42gunner]

There used to be quite a, let's call it discussion, on the safety of tricycle front end vs. wide front end tractors on many of the old tractor websites. Something to do with the tip over angle being at least close to the same, and the inherit stability of a tripod, IIRC.

My take on it is maybe so, but the wide front at least adds a form of outrigger. Giving the illusion of more safety.

Personally, I'm not changing the front end on my WD. I have came closer to tipping wide front end tractors than I ever have with the WD, maybe because I'm more mature and pay more attention to safety these days.

Robert

[fecmech]

If you keep it around to use I would suggest moving the Ign switch to the column that holds the steering wheel from the panel. In the event the implement hooks on something immovable and you start going over backwards you can shut the tractor off. Your hand clutch is forward and you're going backward, you may not be able to reach the clutch. I had a "Kill" switch on my 52 "B" that saved my butt one day. The bush hog caught on something and in an instant "Johnny" was going over backward. Holding on to the steering wheel I slapped the "Kill" switch off and the front end dropped back down. I don't think I could have reached the clutch in that situation and surely not reached ahead of the steering column to where the ignition switch was. One other item I would suggest is an overrun clutch for the PTO if you use the tractor.

[redneck1]

As they say ... No good deed goes unpunished .

Yesterday I had coffee with a couple members of the church group that started this .
Now let's keep in mind that these are " town" guys .
They have their new tractor at a fairly decent back yard mechanics shop who has gone over it a bit and given the engine a clean bill of health .

His recommendation is to simply fix a couple minor oil leaks , give it a new clutch and brakes tune it up and send it off to get painted .
His exact words to me was ... I looked as hard as I could and couldn't find a single thing wrong with it .

The compression is right where its supposed to be , he stuck a bore scope in it and both cylinders look great .
The valve train looks good with no undue signs of wear , valve seals look brand new . oil pressure is right about 20 psi like it should be .
He even pulled the top cover off to check end play on the crank and its well within spec , and the crank case is spotlessly clean without any sludge build up .
He thinks its has a very good overhaul within the last few hundred hours of use .

Sooo... Now these guys a grumbling at me for finding them a tractor that is and I quote. " to good ". I kid you not .

Now I'm not one to take offense for doing to good a job , I guess that's their problem not mine :)
The conversation took a strange turn when I jokingly told them that they are welcome to drop it off at my place and take the tractor I kept in its place and they seemed to like that idea .

[gbrown]

[/Quote]The conversation took a strange turn when I jokingly told them that they are welcome to drop it off at my place and take the tractor I kept in its place and they seemed to like that idea .[/QUOTE]

Sounds good to me.

[Petrol & Powder]

Redneck1 wrote, "I'd put them 2 notches up from bad , but still a few notches away from being good ."

That describes a LOT of the equipment I've used in my life !

[Mk42gunner]

As they say ... No good deed goes unpunished .

Yesterday I had coffee with a couple members of the church group that started this .
Now let's keep in mind that these are " town" guys .
They have their new tractor at a fairly decent back yard mechanics shop who has gone over it a bit and given the engine a clean bill of health .

His recommendation is to simply fix a couple minor oil leaks , give it a new clutch and brakes tune it up and send it off to get painted .
His exact words to me was ... I looked as hard as I could and couldn't find a single thing wrong with it .

The compression is right where its supposed to be , he stuck a bore scope in it and both cylinders look great .
The valve train looks good with no undue signs of wear , valve seals look brand new . oil pressure is right about 20 psi like it should be .
He even pulled the top cover off to check end play on the crank and its well within spec , and the crank case is spotlessly clean without any sludge build up .
He thinks its has a very good overhaul within the last few hundred hours of use .

Sooo... Now these guys a grumbling at me for finding them a tractor that is and I quote. " to good ". I kid you not .

Now I'm not one to take offense for doing to good a job , I guess that's their problem not mine :)
The conversation took a strange turn when I jokingly told them that they are welcome to drop it off at my place and take the tractor I kept in its place and they seemed to like that idea .
To paraphrase my Dad: "Some people will gripe about being hung with a new rope."

Robert

[redneck1]

Your dad had it about right :)

I had a conversation this evening with the fellow writing the checks , he says the guys who are grumbling also happen to be the ones who put up almost all the money for the endeavor , so let them do what ever they want without feeling guilty .

No one has actually come out and said they want to swap out the nicer tractor for the worn out junker yet , I'm not gonna try and talk any sense into anyone if they do , I'll just sell it and donate the money back to the church .