Vacuum sealed ammo?

[jimlj]

I'm not sure where to ask this. If I have it in the wrong place please move it..

I had my vacuum sealer out for some Canadian bacon I made and got to thinking, what about storing ammo this way long term?? So I took a hand full of freshly cast, powder coated boolit clad reloads and put them in a bag and sealed them up. Has anyone done this? Does it cause any issues with primers or powder long term? All the surplus ammo I've ever had in sealed cans seem to have just a bit of pressure in the can when opening. You get that lovely hint of (7.62X39) 50 plus year old Chinese air wafting out when you first poke a hole in the can. What about ammo stored under vacuum instead of pressure?

[2A-Jay]

I have several 20 Round boxes of 30-06 sealed in my Vacuum Sealer bags, Same with .45acp. 30-30 and .38dpl in my Bug-out bag. These are all Reloads. I tried loose ammo once the Conical Bullets poked holes in the Vacuum sealer bags. Round nose bullets were no problem.

[Winger Ed.]

I used to store loose reloaded ammo in vac. bags.
I wore one of the machines out, and just started using 1 quart zip-lok ones.
Some have been in storage for several years.

The game plan is to keep the air and Oxygen away from them.
From looking at the amount of tarnish on the cases, I can't tell any difference from one kind of bag to another.

[reddog81]

If was storing ammo in a swamp I’d do it. But I store ammo in my air conditioned house so it seems unnecessary.

[Mk42gunner]

My problem with the vacuum sealing idea is that fifteen to twenty years ago I went through three or four of the consumer grade sealers. The ones I had would work for a short while, then develop a very small open circuit in the heating element.

If you get or have a good one, it is a fine idea for long term storage of just about anything.

Robert

[wills]

If was storing ammo in a swamp I’d do it. But I store ammo in my air conditioned house so it seems unnecessary.

Until the the electricity goes out.

[dverna]

I plan on vacuum sealing primers as I have too many to store in the house.

[slim1836]

I plan on vacuum sealing primers as I have too many to store in the house.

Now your bragging. :drinks:

Slim

[GhostHawk]

My cast boolits once lubed if I have more than I need go into small food storage containers, airtight lids plus the BLL keeps them from oxidation.

Loaded ammo is almost all in MTM 100 round flip top boxes. Much easier at the range. Plus I can see at a glance how many are left.

But, if I was going down to the coast, with high humidity and salt and wanted to keep my ammo dry and corrosion free.
Vacuum sealed bags would certainly be the ticket.

[swamp]

I have not had very good luck with loaded ammo. The bags seem to lose vacuum. No problem with anything else.
swamp

[Tripplebeards]

I vacuum sealed some 5.56 loads with 60 grain vmax. About 250 per bag. All the bags lost their vacuum over time but the ammo still looks like brand new. Did this about 4 years ago.

[Omega]

These are going on about 3 years, they have not lost vacuum yet. Better to not handle them too much though, else they may develop leaks.
275960

[cwtebay]

Not sure if this is exactly what you mean, but I received 200 - 32 special rounds that were vacuum packed. Dates handwritten on them was 1997 from eastern Kansas. They were factory loads, I've fired dozens of them with zero issue.

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

[CoolHandMoss]

I haven't been doing it more than a couple years but I do vacuum seal ammo if I intend to store it. In the box or loose. generally I double bag it to make sure it will stay sealed. I have no concerns.

[Winger Ed.]

All the bags lost their vacuum over time but the ammo still looks like brand new. Did this about 4 years ago.

I always thought the bag didn't leak, but it was fumes from the powder's solvents evaporating.
I figure it works like when you open a ammo can, and there is that strong solvent/powder smell.

[jimlj]

My concerns with storing long term under vacuum were will it damage powder or primers. It appears some here have done it for several years without problems.

Thanks for the reply’s.

[reddog81]

Until the the electricity goes out.
The ammo would tolerate loss of electricity better than I would.

[Winger Ed.]

My concerns with storing long term under vacuum were will it damage powder or primers. .

I don't see how.
Exposure to the air is a problem.
Look at all the artifacts they recover and they start deteriorating as soon as they come into contact with fresh air.

[Tripplebeards]

I always thought the bag didn't leak, but it was fumes from the powder's solvents evaporating.
I figure it works like when you open a ammo can, and there is that strong solvent/powder smell.

Dont know. I'll have to dig them out and post a picture. I tried to use my vaccum sealer the other day and it would vaccum. Took it all apart and still nothing. I watched some youtube videos about removing a s cleaning the seals. Ill have to try that next. It's an original food saver from when they first came out. Bought it brand new at the time. Its always been finiky. If I remember I did a 150 or more in each batch. They are at least still nicely sealed in bags. Just wished they stayed sealed. I re did them because the vaccum didn't take. The others stayed vacuumed for a couple of days and then let loose. I'm sure the 60 grain vmax bullets must have poked a hole?

I also watched people use zip lock bags in their vacuum sealer to save money. If I get mine working I'll try the lip lock bag method and see If it works.

[Markopolo]

i have about 40k in primers vacuum sealed in 50 call ammo cans.. we do live in ultra high humidity and salt living on a island in SE Alaska Rainforest. i started doing this when I started getting FTF on primers that were sitting on the shelf.. just too dang moist all the time. i did start using a decent woodstove in my shop and keep it running all the time, but with vac Pak, I do t have to worry about it as much.

275979

[jimlj]

I don't see how.
Exposure to the air is a problem.
Look at all the artifacts they recover and they start deteriorating as soon as they come into contact with fresh air.

I'm sure I am over thinking this. In my (limited) experience with air conditioning systems, you pull a vacuum on the sealed system. This causes any moisture in the system to boil/evaporate out before adding Freon. I didn't know if the vacuum would affect any solvents left in the powder the same way.

[Winger Ed.]

I didn't know if the vacuum would affect any solvents left in the powder the same way.

Oh yeah. It'd be the same effect, but just at different temps than water.

Just like an AC system: Air/Oxygen & moisture is what causes problems, not the lack of it.

[Winger Ed.]

. The others stayed vacuumed for a couple of days and then let loose.

I also watched people use zip lock bags in their vacuum sealer to save money.

For the ones that look like they lost their seal, Ya might try putting one in a sink of water and squeeze it.
That'll tell ya if it leaks, or it has gas inside the ammo generated itself.

I'd get the good name brand freezer bags to vac.
I'd think the el cheapo ones would burn though at the seal unless the heater temp was perfect for them.

[Three44s]

What about molds with desiccant packs added?

Three44s

[flyingmonkey35]

I'm sure I am over thinking this. In my (limited) experience with air conditioning systems, you pull a vacuum on the sealed system. This causes any moisture in the system to boil/evaporate out before adding Freon. I didn't know if the vacuum would affect any solvents left in the powder the same way.Those food saver never get that high of a vacuum to boil.

I use mine for meat and rice.

As I live in a high desert humidity is not a issue. But I have thought of it for my hunting ammo.

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[MaryB]

Food saver bags leak oxygen over time. They are NOT designed for long term storage. The plastic used is not an oxygen barrier. You need a mylar bag like these https://www.amazon.com/SteelPak-Textured-Embossed-Aluminum-Vacuum/dp/B087QQVSG8/ref=sr_1_4?dchild=1&keywords=vacuum+seal+mylar+bags&qid=1611522798&sr=8-4 to be O2 proof. Even then I would toss in an oxygen absorber. You can buy the O2 absorbers in single sized sealed pouches. Once you open the pouch the absorbers activate so if you can find the single absorber per bag type you are better off for low volume use.

[.429&H110]

Purge the bag with something dry...
Airgas will sell you a bottle of dry nitrogen, and a cheap regulator. If you have a wire feed, Argon works, too. Not politically correct to use refrigerant, but "canned air" would work. I used N2 to leak check A/C. Doesn't take much N2 to purge a gallon bag. Push dry N2 through a bag, seal it, forever is a long time. I was concerned with bringing boolits in from the cold, riding around in the truck, they would frost and stay wet. Tools would frost and rust. I learned to live and work in cold. How cold was it? The stopper on my half gallon thermos would freeze stuck. Turn the hot tea upside down to melt the stopper. Tea was too hot to drink, top of thermos frozen. And that's in the front seat. How about a jug of R-22 at zero pressure, pour a teacup full of freon. That's the back of the truck, dark dead of winter in Fairbanks.

[dverna]

I have to believe vacuum packing has to be better than storing in boxes. I have stuff that is decades old that still works and just stored on shelves.

[fcvan]

I have never vacuum sealed ammo, but I do store in zip lock bags. 50 per bag, 10 bags in a plastic coffee can, lid marked with load data and date. Ammo looks like new in the bags. I do have a vacuum pump for servicing refrigerator systems but Have never used it for drawing out air, but did use a drinking straw before sealing. Baggies didn't leak. I stopped drawing out the air and found no difference between bags of cartridges drawn out or just rolled over before sealing.

I don't want to say how many coffee containers I have filled in 38, 9mm, 40 S&W, and 45 ACP. I also make WWII style fold boxes for some ammo, and those get placed into coffee cans, or just boxed up and taped shut. Properly stored in the garage the rounds look and shoot just fine. I also put 130 rounds of .223/5.56 on stripper clips in plain white 2 3/4" 12 ga shotshell boxes, they store just fine boxed and taped shut. Most of the time, I print labels with load data and date. I also started using fold type boxes I made, just to fit 40 rounds on stripper clips, a good day at the range. Neat, orderly, ammo stores and shoots just fine, especially through a single shot with a 1 - 12" twist and a fixed 4x long eye relief scope. It is heck on tin cans.

[ButchC]

What about molds with desiccant packs added?

Three44s

My concern would be isolating the desiccant packs from the mold so as to make sure there was no chemical contact if something went amiss. I'd also want to grease the mold and wrap it to protect the bag from petroleum. I've just shifted to ammo cans and desiccant packs for molds and lesser used dies and the like. Works for me since I don't have the storage space for enough loaded ammo to keep from breaking into the tools every few months. It's easier to inspect and address problems that way too.

[.429&H110]

Gotta correct a idea.
Don't use canned air- difluoromethane- or any chloro-fluoro-freon. The stuff absorbs water and gets acidic. Same with CO2, also goes acidic when wet. Hydrocarbons soak up moisture, but go gas go boom. Museums use a tight case purged with N2, cheap and easy. Sealing a coffee can seals water in, as much as there was, I have been to Florida to see it rain indoors. AZ is famous for not evacuating A/C, just push R22 through it, let the drier catch whatever, and it's so dry in the sun, it works. They were in a hurry...
My frozen ziplock bags would still condense water, so I flushed them with N2.
A frozen 1911, now there's a problem...
Superredhawk just didn't care, -60 to +116.
Frosty boolits and frosty fingers, frosty 44.
I prefer +116 on my old fingers.

[kerplode]

After trying it a couple of times, I think it's a waste of time and money. The bags all leaked after a pretty short period of time and the odd shapes made storage inefficient.

Here's my current three step plan for ammo storage:
1) Place ammo boxes in ammo can
2) Close lid
3) Profit!

[.429&H110]

Fourth step
4) Bury ammo can in backyard, after midnight.

[kerplode]

Yeah, that step's gonna be an important one in the near future!

[Winger Ed.]

Fourth step
4) Bury ammo can in backyard, after midnight.

Ya also need to seed the yard with lots of nuts, bolts, and metal shavings to frustrate the metal detectors.

[Petrol & Powder]

OK, I'm a fan of military ammo cans simply because they work. And while there will be oxygen inside the can when you close the lid, there will not be a lot if the can is completely full. The casings may tarnish a bit but unless there was a lot of moisture in there when you sealed it, it should OK. New paint cans may also be an option (steel, tin plated, removable lid).

I've never been a "prepper" but I've always thought a canning machine may have some value for things you really want to keep dry. (and maybe disguised). There's some expense for the new cans, lids and the canning machine is very pricey, but it does result in a pretty good seal. A number 10 steel can will hold a lot. In fact it will hold a Glock 19 if you take the slide off the frame......so I've been told ;)

[thxmrgarand]

I live in a rain forest according to people who come up with such nomenclature. The forest, just about all old growth spruce and hemlock, is damp year-round. And the house is only about 100 feet from salt water at a 20 foot tide. But I have never seen a need to vacuum seal ammo. I do vacuum seal socks and usually have an example in any daypack I take into the woods. If I step out of a skiff and the bottom is deeper than I thought then it's always worthwhile to put on dry socks before beginning a day in the woods (if the water was over the top of my boots). Interestingly I have sometimes picked up shotgun ammo, now usually with steel shot, that someone has dropped days earlier to be washed twice a day in salt water, taken that ammo apart out of curiosity, and contrary to what some literature says the shot is always fine and not rusty.

[slim1836]

Has anyone tried to store items in rice? They say it works for cell phones. Might have to layer it to separate the rice but y'all catch my drift of what I'm trying to say.

Slim

[Winger Ed.]

Has anyone tried to store items in rice?

Oh yeah,,, that's red neck desiccant.

In the old days, when people had salt shakers on the table, you'd see a few grains of rice in there
to keep the salt from absorbing moisture and clumping.

[slim1836]

Oh yeah,,, that's red neck desiccant.

In the old days, when people had salt shakers on the table, you'd see a few grains of rice in there
to keep the salt from absorbing moisture and clumping.

I represent those old days, just can't remember them now a days.

Slim