Powder Coat Total Fail

[jonp]

I decided to try it a little bit yesterday and while in HB getting a few things picked up a jar of powder coat. Matte Black. Yes, 2 mistakes in one purchase :-)

Put them in a plastic dish but didn't have any plastic pellets so decided to try anyways. Shook them up and got some coat then into the toaster oven I bought last year to try this but never got around to. There was my second or third mistake, I didn't temp the oven. When the boolits came out all clumpy looking and rough I temped the oven and found out it runs almost 75 degrees hot so instead of 400 for 20 min I had them in 475.

So now I have 20 clumpy, rough boolits. Will the paint come off it I try to melt them and be ok, will it contaminate the rest of the melt and should I throw them or should I load them and give it a try while waiting for some good powder and pellets to arrive?

[gpidaho]

I'd melt them down outside in one of those cast iron melting pots if you have a lot of them. I sometimes throw just a few in the pot when it's up to temp. The coatings are easy to skim off. I'd worry more about the fumes than contaminating the melt. Gp

[mehavey]

I temped the oven and found out it runs almost 75 degrees
hot so instead of 400 for 20 min I had them in 475.A true 475 wouldn't hurt anything.
But if you started then a cool oven, it probably hit quite a bit higher than
that before it equilibrated and the thermostat/sensors got it under control.


ps: just throw back in the pot and skim the residue.
pps: Absent a PID, get one of these (https://www.amazon.com/ThermoPro-TP-08S-Wireless-Thermometer-Grilling/dp/B014DAVHSQ) for Temp monitoring.

[slide]

That is a nice set up. Another option, go to amazon and you can get a digital thermometer with thermocouple for around twenty bucks. Drill a hole in a bullet,squeeze the bullet down on t-couple. Lay the bullet in with your coated bullets when you bake them. Takes the guess work out of it. When the bullets hit the recommended temp start a timer. Too high temp can cause your coating to become brittle so you need to watch those temps. You might think you got the dial figured out but it will still go crazy on you. I run a p.i.d. on my oven and I still use the t-bullet. Don't focus on the oven temp focus on the temp of your bullets.

[merlin101]

Don't feel bad Jonp, I had a batch turn out looking like chocolate chips! I not only messed up the temp but also left them a bit to long and they slumped down. OH well back in the pot they went.

[jonp]

No bullet slump so there is that. I did heat the oven first so got that right, I think part of the problem is HB coating. I've read in a couple of places including here that not only is it not the best but the matte black is the worst of the two they still have.

Since I can throw them in the pot again I'll just melt with some other lead I have to do and skim it off trying again.

[Winger Ed.]

Go back to what ya know.

The whole powder coat thing is just a passing fad anyway.:kidding:

[slide]

Winger Ed, you make a good point. I have been doing tests with powder coated bullets and lubed bullets using white label lubes. So far the lubed bullets have outshot the powder coated bullets. I want to do some more testing before I decide. This is mainly in rifle. Time will tell.

[Winger Ed.]

So far the lubed bullets have outshot the powder coated bullets. I want to do some more testing before I decide. This is mainly in rifle. Time will tell.

I have been meaning to try powder coating myself.
But it's like me getting a 'beeper' or a cell phone--
I just haven't quite gotten around to it yet.

It reminds me of my intentions of joining the Procrastinators Club.
I haven't gotten around to doing that either.

[AlHunt]

Go to Smoke4320's vendor page, get powder and BBs that we know work. Follow the prescribed process. If you don't succeed, go back to lubed bullets. Honestly, it works like a charm. I changed the process a little ... after I mastered the process as laid out here.

[jonp]

Go back to what ya know.

The whole powder coat thing is just a passing fad anyway.:kidding:

Haha. I've been ok with tumble lube but what do I know. Kids and their fads like that IPhone thingy.

[jonp]

Go to Smoke4320's vendor page, get powder and BBs that we know work. Follow the prescribed process. If you don't succeed, go back to lubed bullets. Honestly, it works like a charm. I changed the process a little ... after I mastered the process as laid out here.

AlHunt, yeah. That's what I should have done in the first place but I'm only out $7

[Winger Ed.]

I'm only out $7

$7.?
It sounds like you're playing with fire, or working up high without a net.

$7. doesn't get you a oven AND the powder.
I suspect you're using the kitchen oven.
I'd warn against that.

When I used the kitchen oven to dry a big batch of .45ACP cases I'd washed & rinsed awhile back,,,,,,,
After the second live round cooked off---- I was banned from the kitchen for all reloading activities.

[jonp]

Ha, no I meant the powder coat. The toaster oven will be fine now that I've dialed the temp in

[TjB101]

$7.?
It sounds like you're playing with fire, or working up high without a net.

$7. doesn't get you a oven AND the powder.
I suspect you're using the kitchen oven.
I'd warn against that.

When I used the kitchen oven to dry a big batch of .45ACP cases I'd washed & rinsed awhile back,,,,,,,
After the second live round cooked off---- I was banned from the kitchen for all reloading activities.

Holy crap ... no way. Was anyone in the kitchen at the time? What was the noise level. Break anything?

[mehavey]

How does one miss a full-up/loaded 45ACP round in a layer of otherwise empty brass spread on a cookie sheet?
(much less handled multiple times during the wash/rinse operations)
He asks.... :kidding:




OOC: Just how hot are you running your oven when drying?
Ammunition takes a lot of heat in desert/battlefield/storage conditions w/o mishap

[Monobill]

Well now I am second guessing going the powder coating route. I mean, you still need to size the boolits anyway so why not just us a lubicator/sizing process?

[45workhorse]

Powder coated AND the LEE app, (Automatic Processing Press), you can have a pile of bullets sized and ready in load in no time. I don't need to do that myself, just putting it out that if needed to, it is very doable!
YMMV!

[slide]

Powder coat has it's pros and cons just like everything else. Nothing wrong with lube.

[fredj338]

Well now I am second guessing going the powder coating route. I mean, you still need to size the boolits anyway so why not just us a lubicator/sizing process?

Smoke, crud left in your gun, enough reason to go PC.
If people would follow directions given on the site about how to PC, they would avoid the failures. HF PC has been discussed for a few years, it doesnt work well shake & bake. S&B works better with ASBB in the #5 plastic tub. Your oven needs to be checked with a simple $3 oven therm. I have a STAR luber/sizer but doubt I ever go back to it.

[Conditor22]

$7.?
It sounds like you're playing with fire, or working up high without a net.

$7. doesn't get you a oven AND the powder.
I suspect you're using the kitchen oven.
I'd warn against that.

When I used the kitchen oven to dry a big batch of .45ACP cases I'd washed & rinsed awhile back,,,,,,,
After the second live round cooked off---- I was banned from the kitchen for all reloading activities.

I hope you meant live primer, how do you miss a live round? :holysheep:groner:[smilie=b:

[bangerjim]

Matte color anything will NOT coat using the shake-n-bake technique!!!!!! Period. The matting agent kills ALL the tiny triobelectric charges that build up on the boolits.

Throw the HF matte black powder out (just like most all things from HF these days!) and buy some GOOD powder from Smoke on here. Stick with PRIMARY colors first and order the black ASBB''s from him also. Matte powders ONLY work with ESPC guns......like they were engineered to do.

Check you oven temp settings with a QUALITY oven thermometer and adjust your dial setting for 400°F by the thermometer, not by the markings on the front of the oven!

PC is NOT a passing fad by any means! Once you perfect your PC techniques, you will wonder why you ever used dirty old messy grease in the 1st place. I sure did. :drinks:

banger

[fcvan]

jonp, a cheap oven thermometer I bought from Wally World was like, 6 bucks. I started ESPC before ASBBPC and have 2 guns. one is HF, the other is the Chinese copy of the Sears blow dryer type. In fact, I thing the 'sears' gun was probably from China in the first place. When I was done with the thermometer, I gave it, and a blow dryer gun, to a buddy who gave me a mold he accidentally bought 2 of, and so many other things that come with friends helping friends.

I learned the PC thing when this first got off the ground, first pray, spray, and bake, then shake and bake. Some of my favorite boolits were HF flat black, I used it all and had to buy more when a friend wanted some muzzle brakes coated, they came in stainless, no coating. When done, they looked just the same as the barrels he put them on. Is this stuff tough? Yup, my Harley frames are PCd, John Deere doesn't paint, they coat. Prismatic Powders, where I get my stuff, PCs and bakes military vehicles and Caterpiller D9 and D10 dozers. They have a cool showroom, think coated rims and crazy colored AR 15 builds, and take home samples of the 6500 colors they sell. They don't sell same day, but if you order and give them a day, they will deliver to you. Nice people, only 100 miles from my CA house, everything else is overnight shipping, and yes, you pay that premium. I would just plan ahead when I would visit my niece and her family.

Now, I have probably 5 different black types. Even their 'satin' looks glossy, and ink black looks like it drip on you. Needless to say, my standard loads are black, test loads are something else to keep test loads separate. Now, I only ESPC when I am doing a concoction of colors to get the perfect FMJ. I can still shake and bake Zombie Green, Barbie Pink, and Barney Purple, colors friends from work asked for. I even made custom labels, "Got Zombies? Try Zom-B-Gone, use as directed" "Barbie Boolits, because girl just has to accessorize" for the guys they just said "Breast Cancer Awareness, Shoot for a Cure!"

Yup, PC is a passing fad. So much so that Federal is selling Polymer Jacketed Ammo, but charging the same price as FMJ. Sly little devils. PC has allowed cast or factory lead projectiles to be fired at indoor ranges that previously forbid them. You betcha, passing fad for sure. Keep at it, we all had to learn much before there was a section for coatings and alternatives. Too bad the pictures I posted back when got deleted with a server upgrade.

[Walks]

Whatever you do, DO NOT Powder Coat your bullets in an oven set out on the gas grills shelf in 95degree direct sunlight for the full 20min at 400degrees.

[Lloyd Smale]

Go back to what ya know.

The whole powder coat thing is just a passing fad anyway.:kidding:

Id say just the oposite. its the biggest game changer in the 50 plus years ive been casting.

[NyFirefighter357]

Warm those bullets to about 120F before you shake them then the HF powder will stick without BB's. That color coverage of that powder sucks but it will work. I didn't have black BB's and couldn't get a good coating with the HF powder so I tried my HF dual rubber tumbler and they coated well. I use better powder now but I also sometimes mix in some HF powder with the better stuff to use it up, either way I always use the tumbler to coat them.