Blue Dot 30-30 challenge

[PAndy]

In my 30-30 Marlins, 10-11 gr of blue dot has been an accuracy standout with cast bullet loads. My challenge is that I almost always get a first shot flyer out the top. around 3-4" out of the group at 100 yards. I'm guessing it is related to powder position and the way I handle the rifle maybe? I think I have tried everything but still see this at least half the time. IMR Blue also shoots very well but does the same thing. Anyone else ever have this issue?

[RickinTN]

My guess, and that is all it is, a guess that it is your lube. Sounds like somethin a too dry lube would do. Is your bore left fowled after each range session?
Rick

[Rcmaveric]

Could be either or. First shot flyers is also a common problem with lube.

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[JonB_in_Glencoe]

It's most likely Lube.
What Lube?

Do you clean the bore, and maybe leave a oil coating in the bore after cleaning? That can surely throw a first shot flier.

also what ambient temperature? ...I see your profile location is PA. Blue dot can be temperature sensitive when shooting in cold temperatures, like 30º or colder, the barrel will be warmer after the first shot...so the POI may change after the first shot where the barrel is warmer, I doubt it would be 3" but who knows?

[PAndy]

I don't disagree with any of you, i appreciate the ideas. I only notice the high shot with the blue dot. sometimes it is a warm barrel if I shoot other loads first. lube is commercial red or blue stuff plus a copper gas check, depending on the bullet. (purchased)
I did a little muzzle up vs down test for powder position and the difference was about 45 fps. that does not seem too severe. same test will show 100 to 200 fps variation with powders like 4895

[Camba]

PAndy,
What velocities you get with the 10-11 gr of Blue Dot?
What boolit weight?
Thanks.
Camba


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[PAndy]

Today I shot five rounds with jacketed bullets, then went right into the cast/blue dot loads...zero flyers. Go figure. Anyway, in my marlins 10 gr of blue dot will push most cast bullets 1500+ fps. Probably not published so I'm probably not recommending it .

[MarkW]

What weight are you shooting? I'm curious as I have an 8lb jug of IMR Blue and 6 or so 30 cal molds going from a Lee 113gr soupcan up to 190 gr. and looking to come up with a dedicated 1200-1500 loading if possible for a Win 94.

[jjamna]

I have a Hercules Book from 1987 that list's a load for 158gr cast lead, Fed LR #210 primer, 2.5 Inches oal, 13.0 grns Blue Dot, 1,525 fps, 29,000 c.u.p. Just showing as published data.

[charlie b]

http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm

I use 8.0gn of Blue Dot in my .308. 180gn bullet runs around 1100fps.

I usually shoot these at the end of the shooting day so I don't get first round fliers.

[Cosmic_Charlie]

I have an Accurate Molds 31-165D that really shines out of my 30-30. I use 45/45/10 for lube. Loaded some up yesterday over 15 grains of 2400. Alloy is Lyman #2. Going to try them out today. That 45/45/10 leaves my barrels clean after a couple dozen rounds so I have not been cleaning them often. No fliers.

[PAndy]

Blue dot seems to do well for us in the 9-12 gr range. accuracy falls off in my particular situation if I push over 12 grains. Imr blue seems very similar and shot just as well as blue dot for me. I had good luck with a 155 gr that was from accurate, similar to lee 150 fp.

[Four-Sixty]

I'm glad to see others trying IMR Blue in the 30-30. I picked up a bottle and tried about 7.2 grains under the Lee 150 grain boolit and it looks promising.

[megasupermagnum]

I never tried IMR blue. I have tried bluedot in 30-30, but mostly shoot it in 308. I have also tried it in 30-06. I did not notice any first shot fliers anywhere near that bad. My suggestion is to try less lube, and a different lube. Get something like Canaruba Red, and only fill one or two lube grooves.

[trapper9260]

I use to have the problem the OP has when I first shoot my gun then I found on here to past a patch of JPW in the barrel after cleaning it if you do and that too care of the OP problem
I use the old NRA Lube with ATF

[PAndy]

Interesting. Actually I have used bullets with two types of lube...now I wonder if one works better than the other ? Yet another round of experimenting. Thanks for the ideas.

[PAndy]

One bullet has white lube from bullshop, looks like spg...soft. other bullet has white label carnauba red. Velocity is 1500 ballpark

[Iowa Fox]

Trapper are you saying a patch with a light film of Johnson's Paste Wax cured your first shot problem?

[PAndy]

My gun only shows this bad behavior with blue/blue dot powder. I don't really think it's lube in my case but a jpw patch is an easy thing to try.

[dverna]

If it was a powder issue it would happen with jacketed bullets as well and not just on the first shot. Everything seems to point to lube.

Do you clean the barrel after every session? If you do, leave it "dirty" and see what happens. I am not anal about cleaning the barrel after every session. And I do not shoot for score or hunt with a clean barrel.

[Markopolo]

I rarely clean the barrel after shooting cast unless there is some sort of problem... i call it seasoning. i dont shoot anything with jackets anymore.

i had the same issue with a k31, i tried every lube know to me at the time and never did solve the first round higher issue. i tried harder lead, softer lead, wiping before the first shot and after the last shot.. i sent the rifle down the road.

then bullshop sent me some stuff for lube that was very soft for lube. he said it always worked in our colder temps, and I use it to this day. that was like 8 years ago. i wish I could remember the name, let me think on it.. very soft, light green... he still has a place in MT if you look him up.

marko

[rockrat]

Bullshop lube. 50/50 beeswax and synthetic 2 stroke engine oil IIRC