Making a 14 inch Contender barrel longer

[rickt300]

I have two 44 magnum Super 14 barrels. They are both tackdrivers and I would like to put a muzzle extension on one of them to make it legal to use as a carbine. What is the best way to go about this and who should I get to do it?

[country gent]

For what the conversion will cost you to be done on the existing barrel you could probably buy an mgm or other barrel in the length desired with riling all the way down it.

By the time a smith turns the muzzle threads it makes the extension fits it and solders or permanently attaches it then finishes it your going to have a chunk of change in it with the only gain being the added length. The existing barrel could possibly be stubbed with a barrel blank to desired length but again a lot of cost for something available.

If you sell one of the super 14 barrels you would have the biggest share of the MGM barrel there already

[rickt300]

I could have a brake installed, surely there are many out there 2 inches long.

[Shawlerbrook]

Mike Bellm is a TC single shot specialist.
https://www.bellmtcs.com/blog/muzzle-breaks-machine-into-the-barrel/

[Lonegun1894]

I've been thinking of doing the same thing, but the cheap way. Now, this wouldn't be the best looking thing, and would need to be refinished, but ATF says an extension needs to be pinned and welded to be legal. I have a lathe, and a friend is a welder. We have discussed doing this by turning a tube down to be a slip fit over the muzzle with a slit for the front sight to fit into. Now that I think of it, if you're not using irons, you could skip the slit for the front sight and use one of the front sight holes for your pin to fit into. Then drill a hole in the side of the tube and very slightly into the barrel for a piece of nail or other pin to fit, and have him weld the pin in place and do a couple tack welds at the rear of the extension to lock it to the barrel, just to keep the ATF off my butt. I'm sure you could cold blue this and make it look decent, if not good, but the tube I'm talking about would add a section at the muzzle that is necessarily a slightly larger diameter that the barrel was. When I priced this, since the labor would be done by us, we figured our out of pocket cost would be no more than $10, and probably closer to $5.

[NoZombies]

I solved my problem by getting a $200 SBR tax stamp, now all of my contender barrels are legal carbine barrels...

[Lonegun1894]

I solved my problem by getting a $200 SBR tax stamp, now all of my contender barrels are legal carbine barrels...

And here's the other option I've been considering. Thanks for being a "bad" influence.

[NoZombies]

And here's the other option I've been considering. Thanks for being a "bad" influence.

Glad to help! [smilie=1:

It also means that I save money on every barrel in the future, as 10" barrels used are almost always at least $100 cheaper than carbine length...

[Tatume]

A gunsmith on this forum, Assassin, does the job for $200. He has a sterling reputation. I don't think you can buy a really good Contender barrel for less than twice that. My favorites are Bullberry, which run about $450.

[Larry Gibson]

I have two 44 magnum Super 14 barrels. They are both tackdrivers and I would like to put a muzzle extension on one of them to make it legal to use as a carbine. What is the best way to go about this and who should I get to do it?

A friend had a couple done. Had a "blank" [no vent side slots or holes] installed that increased the OAL to a legal 16 1/4" then had them spot welded to meet ATFs definition of "not readily removed".

[P Flados]

if you are willing to do the slip over extension with no provision for a front sight, I would actually recommend just using stainless. A stainless extension on a blued barrel would look better than a not quite matching blue job. The part could probably be made from some 304 SS sched 80 pipe.

[MT Gianni]

I believe the qualification is pinned or welded to prohibit easy removal. I have a 14" 17 Remington bbl someone lengthened with a piece of 22 lr bbl to 16 3/4". It's threaded and pinned.

[NoZombies]

If it's pinned, the pin heads (or head if blind pinned) need to be welded over by ATF regs.

[P Flados]

FYI, the ATF letter I saw says that pin needs to welded over. Elsewhere is says tack welds do not count.

Other choice is high temp silver solder.

[cheese1566]

Your barrel, so do what you wish within your budget and ideas.

I have the same want and am thinking of have them threaded, just for some brakes I’d like to build. But I don’t plan on using them as a carbine, I just want to have some fun making some brakes!

[WestKentucky]

I had planned to SBR my contender this year and use a folder with my 10” barrels. Then this mess with braces got fired up so now I have a brace ordered for the contender. One of two things will happen, they will do another run at braces and I will get grandfathered in for a free form 1 OR I will have a braced contender. Practically the brace serves the same purpose the folder would. The biggest difference is I wanted to holster the folder, and I don’t want to spend a small fortune on parts to convert this than and the other to take an AR buffer and an AR folder etc. I’m just going to replace my grip cap with a plate with a rod extended out the rear and size up a small chunk for the brace to attack to in upside down form. I prefer that anyways having shot a European spec revolver with a weighted rod to the rear, the rod resting against the forearm is not bad at all.

As for adding a bloop tube... make it decorative and make it stainless. For a 44 I would be looking at a large and shiny joker to hang off the front. Something that looks at home on a big bore rifle pin it, tig it, polish it. Look up the Obsidian Colosus intended for 450 bushmaster. That may be an option.

[Iowa Fox]

You could sell one of the 14" and buy a super 16.

[Wayne Smith]

Bulberry is now out of business, retired and closed.

[Tatume]

Bulberry is now out of business, retired and closed.

Troy, the head gunsmith and machinist bought the business and changed the name to Bullberry Legacy. I just got a barrel from him a couple of weeks ago. It is every bit as good as the others I've gotten over the years, and was made by the same man. They never actually closed either; it was a seamless transition.

https://www.bullberrylegacy.com/

Check it out.

[green mountain boy]

i am glad to hear the, they have a very good name in the business.

[MrWolf]

I solved my problem by getting a $200 SBR tax stamp, now all of my contender barrels are legal carbine barrels...

Are the stamps for individual firearms or do they cover all your firearms? I was under the impression they were needed for each undersized.

[Larry Gibson]

Are the stamps for individual firearms or do they cover all your firearms? I was under the impression they were needed for each undersized.

It is the serial numbered receiver that is registered as an SBR. The $200 transfer tax applies to individual firearms so it applies only to that particular receiver. However, with the Contender NoZombies can put whatever barrel and stock, or combination there of, on that Contender receiver......legally.

[marlinman93]

Permanently affixed does not mean it needs to be pinned, or threaded on. If it's a snug fit, and made permanent by using a permanent Loctite as used to install barrel liners, it's as permanent as it can ever be.
I've had this done with a number of barrels, and if done properly it's also invisible on the exterior. I had this done with a .22RF barrel that was 22" and I wanted the longer sighting radius, plus weight, and better looks of a 30" barrel. So I had a larger .45 caliber extension installed over the existing barrel via a press fit, with Loctite.
It has no ill effect on accuracy, and I can hand the gun to anyone, and they've never been able to detect where it's spliced and extended once it was blued.

https://i.imgur.com/8L88qBwl.jpg

[MrWolf]

It is the serial numbered receiver that is registered as an SBR. The $200 transfer tax applies to individual firearms so it applies only to that particular receiver. However, with the Contender NoZombies can put whatever barrel and stock, or combination there of, on that Contender receiver......legally.

That is what I thought. One comment was made about one stamp for all contender barrels he had so was confused. Thanks.

[Lonegun1894]

Permanently affixed does not mean it needs to be pinned, or threaded on. If it's a snug fit, and made permanent by using a permanent Loctite as used to install barrel liners, it's as permanent as it can ever be.
I've had this done with a number of barrels, and if done properly it's also invisible on the exterior. I had this done with a .22RF barrel that was 22" and I wanted the longer sighting radius, plus weight, and better looks of a 30" barrel. So I had a larger .45 caliber extension installed over the existing barrel via a press fit, with Loctite.
It has no ill effect on accuracy, and I can hand the gun to anyone, and they've never been able to detect where it's spliced and extended once it was blued.

https://i.imgur.com/8L88qBwl.jpg

If we are trying to use common sense, you're 100% correct, but we were talking about the ATFs definition of "permanently affixed" so whoever follows this advice doesn't end up in jail. ATF says pinned and welded is required to be "permanent", so regardless of logic and common sense, that is currently the limitation, and as always, subject to change.

Now as to your attaching the .45 barrel above to your 22" .22 barrel, while I personally love the idea and your rifle looks great, it is irrelevant to NFA laws because your barrel is over 16" so not subject to NFA laws. Now if it had been under 16", even though your extension brings it up over 16", your attachment method isn't "permanent" per ATF, so you would have an illegal SBR unless you had a stamp for it. Yes, it is stupid, and I would pay to watch them trying to remove your extension because it would take a lot of work for them to do, but I'm tying to keep people out of prison with this information, and as we all know, common sense and government just don't mix.

[marlinman93]

I wasn't presenting my rifle barrel change as an NFA example. Sorry you took it that way. But it is an example of a permanent way to lengthen a barrel. If someone put that barrel in a barrel vise and tried to twist the extension off they'd simply unscrew the barrel from the action. It's as permanent as a barrel liner is.
The ATF's rules concerning muzzle brakes, and how they are attached is not applicable for all barrel lengthening. Obviously their rules for pinning, soldering, or welding a muzzle brake are all correct. But a lengthened barrel done in other ways like my rifle's barrel is not a muzzle brake or flash hider.

[Lonegun1894]

Marlinman93, you're absolutely correct, in a practical sense. I was speaking purely for NFA purposes, which the laws and regs surrounding that mess are all beyond retarded. For NFA, your method doesn't fit the definition of "permanent", even though we all know it is, just because they specify it has to be pinned and welded. But as usual with government, this is what we get when we have rules made by some idiot who knows nothing about what he's making rules about, and instead of asking a machinist or gunsmith about guns and metal working, he asks his drinking buddy because said drinking buddy got lost and walked into a gun shop on accident once when he was a kid and saw a deer head on the wall once, making him the resident hunting and gun expert of the office.

[marlinman93]

Marlinman93, you're absolutely correct, in a practical sense. I was speaking purely for NFA purposes, which the laws and regs surrounding that mess are all beyond retarded. For NFA, your method doesn't fit the definition of "permanent", even though we all know it is, just because they specify it has to be pinned and welded. But as usual with government, this is what we get when we have rules made by some idiot who knows nothing about what he's making rules about, and instead of asking a machinist or gunsmith about guns and metal working, he asks his drinking buddy because said drinking buddy got lost and walked into a gun shop on accident once when he was a kid and saw a deer head on the wall once, making him the resident hunting and gun expert of the office.

But doesn't the pinned or riveted apply to muzzle brakes or compensators?

[Lonegun1894]

But doesn't the pinned or riveted apply to muzzle brakes or compensators?

Now this is only for NFA purposes, so irrelevant for an extension like you did with your .22 since it wasn't an NFA item anyway. I will use 2 ARs I have had in the past as examples and hope it helps. The legal minimum is 16" breech to muzzle, but that is the legal minimum, and includes any permanently attached muzzle devices. So my current work rifle is 16", and has a standard A2 flash hider screwed on the end, bringing it to about 16.5" or so. When that is removed, it is still 16", so for legal purposes, I can screw on the flash hider, or a suppressor, or whatever, or nothing for that matter, and it does not change the legality of the rifle itself. My old one had a 14.5" barrel, but had a AK-74 style muzzlebrake installed (Bushmaster factory rifle), which had been pinned and welded to make it permanent, as if it had been removable, it would have been considered to be 14.5", and since I didn't have a stamp for it, it would have been an illegal SBR. Both rifles with muzzle accessories were 16-16.5" long, but have to be "permanent" to keep you out of legal trouble, unless you get the tax stamp. Now what I think is somewhat funny, is that several manufacturers offer a 11.5" rifle, with a approximately 5" extension/flash suppressor that is pinned and welded, so it keeps the owners out of legal hot water, but really is absolutely useless for any purpose other than legality. So a plain metal tube, or whatever design someone chooses to attach, the way I understand it at least, is fine, as long as it's a permanent extension that brings the rifle up to 16". THe only exception to this that I know of is a rifle SigSauer made not too many years ago that used a muzzle brake that ATF claimed was a one piece silencer baffle stack, just without the tube surrounding it to allow it to be a functional silencer. Other than that, I'm not aware of any design limitations.

[Tatu]

The cost for adding a "permanent" barrel extension - as per BATFE / NFA rules and regulations for the T/C Contender Super 14" barrels cost me $125 return shipped for having one put on my husbands gun.

Some barrels are like the one pictured, others, we have the barrel/extension finished in different cerakote colors.

And the overall barrel length with the permanent extension installed is 16 1/2".

It may not be the prettiest by design, but it is functional and a lot cheaper than buying a new barrel, and where else can you get a useful and practical RIFLE that weighs 4 pounds, and without having to pay $200 for a stupid tax stamp!

https://hosting.photobucket.com/albums/z132/HonkerHunter_photos/7mmTCU/.highres/013.jpg (https://photobucket.com/u/HonkerHunter_photos/a/857c511a-a579-4fb6-851c-8b39c65a4e88/p/14b4b05b-3c4f-4798-b772-4b5b8fb75456)

[bdicki]

I have to wonder if adding some weight to the end of the barrel would affect accuracy, or just the point of impact. It would certainly change the vibration pattern. I'm thinking of the Winchester adjustable muzzle brake that they had a few years ago, they even had a weight to change if you wanted to hunt without the added noise.

[Lonegun1894]

The cost for adding a "permanent" barrel extension - as per BATFE / NFA rules and regulations for the T/C Contender Super 14" barrels cost me $125 return shipped for having one put on my husbands gun.

Some barrels are like the one pictured, others, we have the barrel/extension finished in different cerakote colors.

And the overall barrel length with the permanent extension installed is 16 1/2".

It may not be the prettiest by design, but it is functional and a lot cheaper than buying a new barrel, and where else can you get a useful and practical RIFLE that weighs 4 pounds, and without having to pay $200 for a stupid tax stamp!

https://hosting.photobucket.com/albums/z132/HonkerHunter_photos/7mmTCU/.highres/013.jpg (https://photobucket.com/u/HonkerHunter_photos/a/857c511a-a579-4fb6-851c-8b39c65a4e88/p/14b4b05b-3c4f-4798-b772-4b5b8fb75456)

Would you mind if I asked where you had it done? Looks much better than the one I did years ago.

[Tatu]

Lonegun1894,

PM sent.

Thank you,

Tatu

[MT Gianni]

The cost for adding a "permanent" barrel extension - as per BATFE / NFA rules and regulations for the T/C Contender Super 14" barrels cost me $125 return shipped for having one put on my husbands gun.

Some barrels are like the one pictured, others, we have the barrel/extension finished in different cerakote colors.

And the overall barrel length with the permanent extension installed is 16 1/2".

It may not be the prettiest by design, but it is functional and a lot cheaper than buying a new barrel, and where else can you get a useful and practical RIFLE that weighs 4 pounds, and without having to pay $200 for a stupid tax stamp!

https://hosting.photobucket.com/albums/z132/HonkerHunter_photos/7mmTCU/.highres/013.jpg (https://photobucket.com/u/HonkerHunter_photos/a/857c511a-a579-4fb6-851c-8b39c65a4e88/p/14b4b05b-3c4f-4798-b772-4b5b8fb75456)

Nice looking rifle but with a $200 stamp for the receiver you can run a dozen different barrels off of it. Your way is cheaper if you have a frame for each barrel.

[Lonegun1894]

Lonegun1894,

PM sent.

Thank you,

Tatu

Thank you very much!

[Tatu]

Nice looking rifle but with a $200 stamp for the receiver you can run a dozen different barrels off of it. Your way is cheaper if you have a frame for each barrel.

Why would I need a frame for each barrel?

I do not need a tax stamp because the overall barrel length is 16 1/2" long.

You just remove the forend, push out the pin, remove the barrel, install a new barrel, pin and forend, and ready to go shoot a different cartridge.

My hands are too small to shoot or even hold up a pistol the size of these guns with a 14" barrel, but with a barrel extension and set up like a little 4 pound rifle, I can shoot it all day.

Tatu

[Hamish]

If it's pinned, the pin heads (or head if blind pinned) need to be welded over by ATF regs.

This seems to have been ignored in this thread. BATFE says Welded, not easily removed. Or pinned and welded. Epoxy will get you problems.

[Lonegun1894]

This seems to have been ignored in this thread. BATFE says Welded, not easily removed. Or pinned and welded. Epoxy will get you problems.

It's been covered, but glad to have another opinion from someone who knows their stuff so there's several of us trying to keep people out of prison.

[MT Gianni]

Why would I need a frame for each barrel?

I do not need a tax stamp because the overall barrel length is 16 1/2" long.

You just remove the forend, push out the pin, remove the barrel, install a new barrel, pin and forend, and ready to go shoot a different cartridge.

My hands are too small to shoot or even hold up a pistol the size of these guns with a 14" barrel, but with a barrel extension and set up like a little 4 pound rifle, I can shoot it all day.

Tatu

For $200 you can stamp the receiver and run any 10"-14" bbl you want. That seems like less money to me than $125 for each bbl. No matter there is room for everybody in this old world.