Anybody know this rifle?

[KenH]

Hello all, these are photos of an old rifle my son-in-law has. As you can see parts are missing, but it does seem to be an old lever action. The bore at the muzzle is .401" and best I can tell the base of the chamber next to the rim portion of the cartridge is .490" diameter.

This first image is the full length view.
https://i.ibb.co/47kh4qv/Full-Length.jpg

Next the side view. The solid section just forward of the opening is where the magazine would go (I think). It does look like a magazine area, but the bottom of the octagonal barrel is rounded to inside as if a tubular magazine was used.
https://i.ibb.co/KD5kvgN/Side.jpg

Here the inside of the rear open section is shown. The trigger and hammer shows up and the portion where a lever would hinge.
https://i.ibb.co/jrGfm9b/Angled.jpg

Top view where the hammer is visible. The section just sin front of the hammer is a dovetailed that sticks above receiver like a scope mount or something. There is a typical dovetail recessed into the barrel (shows in the side view) about 5" in front of the receiver.
https://i.ibb.co/vc4s9mk/Top.jpg

Bottom view.
https://i.ibb.co/LxGcV3f/Bottom.jpg

Anybody got an ideas what manuf, year, etc of this rifle?

Ken H>

[Tatume]

It looks like a toggle-action Winchester.

[Thumbcocker]

73 Winchester would be my guess but I'm no authority.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[missionary5155]

Probably a 38-40..... But a measurement of the action from the barrel to the hammer will show if it could be a 1876 or 1873
But the upper tang has the Model and the lower tang is the serial# to determine the year.

[John Boy]

270732

Click to enlarge ... Winchester 1873 Lever Action Rifle

[Martini450]

Based on the short wrist area of the receiver, and the dimensions you gave, my guess would be an 1876 in 40-60.

[indian joe]

Based on the short wrist area of the receiver, and the dimensions you gave, my guess would be an 1876 in 40-60.

I believe you are correct
1) the length of the sideplates - 76 sideplates are twice the length vs height - 73 much less length to height (shorter in proportion)
2) case dimensions (if he measured reasonably close) 38/40 case is .460 something at the base - 40/60 case would be .500 or close

Whats there seems not in bad order - I wonder where did the rest of it go?

[Hootmix]

Ditto ,, Martini 450 ,, I am rebuilding a 76 45-60 ,, wish I had this fellers ( 40-60 ),, if the bore is fair to good.

coffee's ready ,, Hootmix.

[Bazoo]

Agree it's a winchester 1876.

[KenH]

Thanks a bunch for the info - It looks like the 1876 Winchester lever action. After reading more about the rifle I find the model is listed on the upper tang - and dang if it's not right there. 1876 it says. The serial number is listed on the lower tang as 40xxx. I "should" have found that, but did look over the barrel really good but nothing can be determined there.

40-60 caliber is what it is, stamped on top of barrel next to receiver. The side plate space measures right at 2" at the back, and 4-1/4" long at max distance. Ya'll are right, what's here seems to be in decent shape, even the bore is shootable.

If this rifle was complete and in good shape it would be darn valuable! I saw some listed for several thousand bucks! It might be worthwhile to look for replacement parts - any idea where they might be found? OR, reproduced?

I didn't find anything stamped on rifle until I read more and found out where to look for what info. It's there, faint but visible.

Thanks again to all ya'll for the help.

Ken H>

[pietro]

! It might be worthwhile to look for replacement parts - any idea where they might be found? OR, reproduced?




You'll most likely need to buy whatever from different parts sellers, as any one wouldn't necessarily have all that you need.


http://homesteadparts.com/shop/winchester-1876-c-1_5.html

https://winchesterbob.com/?page_id=55

https://gun-parts.com/winchesterrifle/

https://www.gunpartscorp.com/gun-manufacturer/winchester/rifles-win/1876

https://www.cimarron-firearms.com/1876-centennial-parts.html



Here is a listing from Winchester, for their designated obsolete parts dealers:https://www.winchesterguns.com/support/parts-and-service/obsolete-parts-and-service.html


.

[Hootmix]

Ken ,,, not to throw water on your fire ( big bucks ),, the " big Bucks Win. " are all original w/ correct numbers on various internal parts , how ever if put together w/ orig. ( as much as possible ) parts it would still be a very desire-able rifle ,, and funnnn ,, to shoot ,, great find !!!

coffee's ready ,, Hootmix.

[KenH]

Those are some very good links. Yep, I fully understand the need for an actual original parts are required for the "high dollar" rifles. Thank you again for those links. I can at least drool over the parts {g}.

Remember, I said in first post "old rifle my son-in-law has". I sure wish it was my find. Now at least I'll be able to tell him all about the history of that model rifle.

Ken H>

[David LaPell]

Looks like an 1873 Winchester and if it's .401 bullet diameter it's in .38-40 because that's the actual bullet diameter for the round.

[indian joe]

Looks like an 1873 Winchester and if it's .401 bullet diameter it's in .38-40 because that's the actual bullet diameter for the round.

David
Post number 6 and 7 got it (I missed the difference in wrist length at first look)
He's verified it from barrel and tang markings in post 10 as a 1876 in 40-60 calibre (yes same bore as 38/40 but a 45/70 size base)
very nice find I think!

[.45Cole]

If he's been in the same small city and that's where the rifle came from, I would try to contact any old timer gunsmiths or people that have bought out gunsmiths: looks like it was disassembled to be blued. Something may have happened to the owner/smith causing the parts to be separated.

[farmbif]

might check and see if poppert's gun parts in PA has some bits and pieces to put it back together.
if it was reblued whoever did it knew what they were doing, all corners and edges still look good and sharp

[KenH]

I don't know the history of this rifle, but my S-I-L is from Minnesota where he grew up hunting with his Grandpa. I'm pretty sure the rifle is from that area. I agree, the rifle is in better condition than I'd expect for an old rifle that's incomplete. It's only used as a wall hanger, wonder if I could trade for it? I could start looking for parts and perhaps have a shooter out of it. I'd LOVE to do that.

[KenH]

I just got off phone with S-I-L about origins of the rifle. Turns out his father purchased it at an estate sale auction a few yrs ago up in Minnesota, so they know nothing about the history of rifle. Now for the GREAT news - Christmas came early this year. S-I-L insisted I take the rifle as an early Christmas present. I'm happy - and do plan to be spending a bit of money looking for parts to make it shootable. This will be a slow process, but will be looking. First parts to look for are the lever (lever screw is in place), breech block assembly/firing pin, the linkage to work the bolt, and carrier block.

Yes, I know there is LOTS more to it than those few parts I mentioned, but let's allow a dream to live a while longer :) This will NOT be a short term project.

Ken H>

[navyvet]

Ken good luck in your quest.

[leadeye]

I know there are Uberti reproductions of the 1876, how close would the parts he's missing be?

[sharps4590]

Time and patience will see the project through.....with some money....and maybe some machine skills.

Congrats...and they are cool rifles!!

[indian joe]

I know there are Uberti reproductions of the 1876, how close would the parts he's missing be?

Over on the CAS city site there is a dedicated 1876 forum and a couple blokes there that would know for sure if these parts fit - pretty sure that chapparal was same as winchester but then there were numerous quality issues with some of those chappy rifles.

[Earl Brasse]

Good luck on your new Winter project.
Some parts turn up on E-Bay that vary from reasonable to unbelievable depending on the day & the part.
I found an original follower for a 45-60 I had once for a little more than a repro.

How long is your barrel, most were 28"?

[KenH]

A quick google search tells me that CAS is "Cowboy Action Shooting" site. I registered and waiting for my email to be verified. That will be a good resource, and might even find some parts over there.

I should have already measured the barrel, I was thinking "rifle", but it looks like it's a 22" barrel, so that makes it a carbine? I'm "assuming" all the receiver parts will interchange with rifle. With a serial number of 40xxx it looks like it's a 1883 yr of manuf making it the 3rd model. Today I placed an order for a 16.5" magazine tube on ebay for $30, but with shipping 'n taxes making it $40. There are several parts listed on ebay, but boy are they proud of the one set of side plates at $250 for the set. Is that anything like reasonable?

Not sure this will be just a "winter" project, might take me a bit longer to find enough parts. I'm sure I'll be making lots of screws and pins that will be required. I've make a few screws in the past for a rolling block project and other stuff.

I just got approved and signed into CAS forum. Found the 1876 forum and doing some reading there now.

Ken H>

[veeman]

The 76 forum has some really fine fella's there with lots of knowledge. They will get you all the info you need to get this project on the road to completion. A few of the regulars are here too.

[KenH]

For an update on the project - no real work has been done yet other than cleaning.

I've got the magazine tube ordered from ebay and it shows out for delivery today. I'll make the magazine plug and follower. I expect to make some of the screws also.

I placed an order with Cimarron today for a few parts. The Cimarron is actually an Uberti, so the VTI Uberti parts should be the same as Cimarron parts. Today I ordered the following:

1 x Part #7 Carrier Block 2500007 (will need some grinding to make fit)
1 x Part # 73 &74 Right & left Side Plates (both side plates should fit nicely)
1 x Part # 90 Lifter Arm (hoping it will fit ok once I can find a carrier block)
1 x Part # 96 Magazine Spring
1 x Part # 98 Firing Pin (still need other part, but think I might can make that one.)

These parts are in stock and should ship today.
I'm still looking for the breech block w/extractor, lever (finger lever), and the toggle links.

With the magazine tube I should be able to start work on forearm - got plenty of walnut wood.

Project is moving along, but slowly. I'm thinking I want some 40-60 brass just to have. Drop in chamber type of thing:)

I need to slug barrel to confirm diameter for a bullet mold.

Later

[KenH]

A quick update to project. I've got a pair of Uberti sideplates that only took a small amount of filing to make them work. I'd read they were a "drop in" replacement for original, but the set I got wouldn't drop in. I had to file around the edges some - not a lot. I also got the carrier block installed which required a tad more grinding to clean up 'n fit.
https://i.ibb.co/HKZR8kN/Sideplates.jpg

I'm working on a walnut forearm now and hopefully complete fitting next week when I get the endcap for the forearm. I've got the magazine tube with spring, end plug and follower ready to go.

[725]

This is such a cool project. Following with interest.

[veeman]

Need to somehow age those side plates to match. Keep up the good work!

[KenH]

Yep, once I get the rifle all together I plan to "age" all the parts together so they'll blend and look similar. I was trying to decide if a new blue job for everything, or to age everything. I think I like the idea of ageing the parts to blend and look "old". Once I get the lever and a make a rear sight I think I'll have about everything that will need ageing. Today I ordered a dust cover from Dixie Gun Works so it will need ageing also.

[Gtek]

I'll take too big and needs to be fit over falls in and rattles any day! Your on the good side, enjoy!

[missionary5155]

Been hunting about and no drawings yet
But just left the Uberti web and they claim their rifle is an exact copy of the Winchester .
The low # Chappi rifles were a maybe OK. The later rifles (past 1000) were much better We have two ( 50-95 and Canadian Monty) which are nicely put together. Our 50-95 shoots 350 grain cast 2.5" groups all day long at 100 yards off cross sticks using 3F Goex.

[KenH]

The Uberti parts are a very close copy, but not exact. Those are the parts I've purchased. Got more parts coming from VTI that should be delivered Monday. I'll know more about those parts then. One of the parts I'm concerned about is the breech block (bolt). I is a fun project - and parts too large are better than too small for sure.

missionary5155: Thank you for looking drawings. I have purchased "Winchester Lever Action Repeating Firearms : The Models of 1866, 1873 & 1876" by Arthur Pirkle. It has good line drawings, but not really dimensioned accurately enough to build parts from.

[KenH]

OK, time for an update. This is current look with the start of a forearm in place and side plates fitted.
https://i.ibb.co/PxkDW63/IMG-3614.jpg
I got the VTI order today with rear part of firing pin - now have both parts with a spring I've got that seems to work. Next is to make the firing pin stop to fit the Uberti breech bolt.

I got the Uberti breech bolt and without the lever it's really hard to tell how well the breech bolt will function, but it seems to. There is an issue with the tab on bottom of bolt face preventing the bolt from fully closing and grasping the rim of cartridge. From what I can see that tab (tit?) shouldn't extend past the thickness of the cartridge rim because there is not a relieved place in barrel for it to extend into. The barrel is flat, and I can see where a tab (tit) has pressed against the barrel face in the past. There is a nice extractor slot into the barrel on top for the extractor to fit into. I'm thinking that tit needs to be "touched" with a file to the same thickness as the cartridge rim. Does that make sense?

The right and left lever springs seem to fit and work as they should, again without the lever no way to really tell. The carrier block does hold down as it seems like it should with the right side spring.

The forend protection cap seems to fit as it should. The forearm I made won't work with the end cap. I was concerned about it being thick enough on bottom at the forend. I'd picked up a scrap piece of walnut that was laying around to do a practice forearm. Now to cut a piece of walnut that will fit and do the forearm right.

Thanks to a GREAT boardmember here I've got a set of toggle links coming to use as a pattern to make a set. Yes, it will push my machining ability, and might have to make a couple sets to get them right. That's the beauty of being retired - plenty of time to work on projects {g} Once the links are made, then the lever will be the big thing. Both VTI and Cimarron have the lever and toggle links on backorder from Italy and no idea when they'll get them. Hopefully this winter sometime?

[KenH]

Rather than starting a new thread I'll ask a question on this thread - or would it be better to start new thread to ask about ageing metal?

The Uberti parts I got for the 1876 have a new black looking finish. I'd like to remove the black finish and "age" the parts, make the new parts look more like the old patina on the existing rifle. I'm thinking just sand off finish using a fine sand paper - perhaps to an 800 grit finish? 400 grit? Then wipe down with vinegar and let sit a while. OR - perhaps FeCl solution? I use FeCl for etching Damascus for the pattern so have some on hand.

Comments and guidance please,

Ken H>

[KenH]

OK, for a short update to the project rifle. Thanks to a board member I've been able to make a couple of toggle links that work. For the needed parts I've either made or purchased Uberti parts for the rifle. Again a special THANK YOU to a kind member of the board who sent me a set of toggle links to use as a pattern. I wouldn't have been able to make the links without his kind assistance.

I'll talk about the Uberti firing pin problem. When moving the bolt out of battery to rear ejecting point , about mid way it movement stops. See image:
https://i.ibb.co/6DHkZcS/Jam-mid.jpg

By putting finger (or thumb) on bottom of bolt to lift up slightly the movement will continue to full rear position.
https://i.ibb.co/9qx1gpC/Jam-back.jpg

Fortunately I found my neighbor has an original 1876 that his great-great-grandpa purchased new and has been handed down to him. He was kind enough to loan me the rifle to remove side plates and lever to see how things work on a toggle link lever action. I'd never even seen one before this project rifle. I fiddled around for a couple days trying to figure out the jam problem - finally I measured the firing pin diameter of the original Winchester, then the Uberti. OK, the Uberti pin is .008" larger in diameter causing the jam. The slight downward movement of the bolt as the toggle links pull bolt rearwards cause the bolt to drop a tiny bit throwing the firing pin out of alignment with the hole in the action.

I made a new firing pin the same diameter as the Winchester pin (remember Winchester is a one piece firing pin while the Uberti is a 2 piece firing pin). That solved the problem. Almost every Uberti part I've purchased has needed some type of modification.

The aluminum finger lever seened in the photo is one I made by using the original as a pattern. I had a piece of 1/2" aluminum plate laying around so used that. Works good, except for the finger lever spring puts a good bit of pressure and would wear the aluminum pretty quick I'm sure so I left spring off for testing.

Here's another image of where the rifle is now.
https://i.ibb.co/G9pyGNQ/Right-Side.jpg

I wish to say THANK YOU to all of ya'll for the help 'n guidance provided with this project.

[Texas by God]

Cheers to you, you are breathing new life into that skeleton. Looking good.

[Thumbcocker]

Great job!

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[KenH]

OK, here's another quick update on the project rifle. Here are a couple of images of the rear sight I mounted on the rifle. The sight is from the Pedersoli 1874 Sharps I've got. I removed the rear sight and mounted a ladder tang sight.

https://i.ibb.co/1qH2b9p/Rear-Sight-Down.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/BrN2xkz/Rear-Sight-up.jpg

There are a couple of methods used to lock magazine in place. Either a screw that extends thru the magazine end plug into a shallow hole in bottom of barrel, or a tab on the magazine end plug that rotates up to engage a slot in bottom of barrel.

In the image below the magazine extends out past the forearm 5-1/2". About 1-1/2" from the forearm tip there is a slot in the barrel where I suspect the original magazine ended. The slot looks like it would be where the magazine plug tab would rotate into to prevent the magazine tube from slipping forward during recoil. What do you think about me cutting this old original magazine tube to fit that slot? This magazine tube did NOT come with the rifle, I purchased it off ebay. Comments?

OR, should I leave magazine the length it is using the screw that would extend into a hole I'd have to drill in bottom of barrel?

https://i.ibb.co/0h0rX24/Left-Side-View.jpg

[shrapnel]

Looks like fun, but reminds me of Johnny Cash’s Cadillac.

[Shawlerbrook]

I just love projects like this. Thanks for sharing.

[missionary5155]

Magazine: You need to decide how any rounds are enough for your needs.
Many old Winchesters that were carried daily had modifications done to them. Magazines were cut for numerous reasons to what ever length that fixed the crushed mag tube or supplied enough rounds for the owners needs.

[725]

Of course it's all up to what you want, but if it were me, I'd cut it back and re-fit the original design. Kind of unrelated but, my buddy came into a real beater marlin and had JES re-cut it to .375 Win. When it came back we discussed the next step in the rehab and the rifle ended up with the mag tube cut back to just beyond the forearm. Transformed the rifle. Just made it sportier, lighter in the point & easy on the carry. Did a few ounces of removed metal make that happen? Hardly. It was just a different feel and attitude. He's very glad we did.

[onceabull]

THere is a lot of good in the winchester model 55,or 64 style mag.tube.....one of my sales mistakes was selling a 1920's edition '94 that carried a original model 64 barrel and front end..butttstock was md.55 style....still hoping the young lady that bought it will decide she has to have a black rifle instead !!!!!

[MOC031]

Every time I see an old rifle or handgun that has been reduced to being that kind of condition, it just gives me a case of the sads, even if I really wouldn't have a lot of interest in it myself if it were in perfectly good condition instead.

However, seeing the restoration of an old rifle found in that condition... now that has the opposite effect.

Well done!

[KenH]

Thanks for kind words and comments. How many shells do I need in magazine at one time? 3 or 4 is plenty for me, we ALL know we get the deer first shot, with perhaps a final "kill" shot - well, that's usually true because if first shot misses, the next shot is usually shot after a "hope 'n prayer". For personal reasons I don't usually take a shot like that. AND, 99% of my shooting with that rifle will be punching holes in paper.

I do enjoy project guns - got a few of them, old Rolling Blocks, a trapdoor, and a Western Auto Revelation 30-30 lever action (Marlin 336) Jes rebored to 38-55 for me. I do have one modern reproduction 1874 Sharps made by Pedersoli.

Ken H>

[T-Bird]

this has been fun to watch, you have some major skills with machining please continue to keep us posted as you progress. My oldest daughter used to live in Daphne.:smile:

[Texas by God]

You asked, so I'll vote for the shorter mag tube as I think it will look better. Keep us posted, it's going to be great. I've made a 1/2 mag conversion on a couple of 94 Winchesters and they handled great.

Sent from my SM-A716U using Tapatalk

[KenH]

OK, ya'll win - I cut the magazine tube today. Allow me a couple days to get tube finished and installed to make another photo.

Yep, Daphne is just up the road from me, good town. I've lived in Fairhope since 2007 or 2008 time frame. 2010 I purchased a house a couple miles outside city limits which was great with my shooting range in backyard. Last winter they moved city limits to my property line really messing up my shooting range :(

Later

[KenH]

Here's the magazine that's now cut off. I've still got to finish the tube. I planned to finish the end cap, but sorta like the looks of the clean finish that has a pewter look. I know the 1876 didn't have the pewter caps like the old Sharps did, but still looks good.

https://i.ibb.co/K2BLmNG/IMG-3688.jpg

[725]

Keep the photos coming! Looks super.

[veeman]

Your the only one you need to impress! Looks good to me!

[KenH]

OK, here's the result with shorten magazine and treated in FeCl to the "aged" look on tube and endcap. Bad reflection on the side plate, and I do have more work to do on the rifle. Trying to get it shooting condition, then work on details. The lever is a Uberti finger lever that was loaned to me by an extremely nice forum member who has been good enough to share knowledge with me.

I shot 5 rounds of 18.3 grains Lil'Gun with a 208 grain bullet, seating depth of 2.15" OAL. The 5 rounds gave 1574 to 1621 fps range with chrono. Tilted barrel up on two shots gave 1610 & 1621 fps. Seems like Lil'Gun needs filler over powder since 18.3 grains is only about 40% brass fill. Since I'm shooting in back yard I've only got 15 yds or so. Shooting offhand there's no way to tell accuracy. It does make nice round holes in paper and grouped like I'd expect for me shooting offhand.

https://i.ibb.co/cwgbdcT/IMG-3691.jpg

[Rick B]

Remarkable progress, with what you started with. I shoot a 45-75 1876 and use 4198. I would avoid Lil Gun. Looking forward to additional reports on your 1876.
Rick

[KenH]

Thank you Rick for the nice words about my progress. I'll have to admit I sorta impressed myself since I had no idea what a toggle link lever action was when I first got the rifle. I had idea I'd for sure get it to shooting. I've learned LOTS about toggle links and what parts fit, and how to make the Uberti parts fit the original.

Now, why would you avoid Lil'Gun powder? It seems to give low pressure when loading for around 1400 fps with a decent amount of powder burnt. Lit'Gun ≈ 84% power burnt vs H4198 ≈ 63%. I realize the case is <1/2 full with Lil'Gun while with 4198 the case is over half full which would prevent double charge, and Lil'Gun does need a filler to hold powder back toward primer for better ignition.

[KCSO]

1873 Winchester probably a 38-40 from the dimensions given. Most of the Cimarron parts will fit with a little work if the bore is good it might be worth fixing up.

[KenH]

1873 Winchester probably a 38-40 from the dimensions given. Most of the Cimarron parts will fit with a little work if the bore is good it might be worth fixing up.

Which rifle are you talking about when you say 1873? The rifle I have is an 1876 in 40-60 caliber marked on barrel (see post #10).

[Tortoise1]

Great project. The accumulated knowledge on this forum is impressive.

[KenH]

Great project. The accumulated knowledge on this forum is impressive.
You are so right about the accumulated knowledge - and folks willing to share knowledge. Folks on this forum and the '76 forum on CAS site are the ONLY reason I've had success in rebuilding this rifle and getting to shoot it.

[T-Bird]

I shoot 29 gr 4198 under a 330 gould hollow point in my 45/70, get about 1350 fps. I use dacron fluff over it. Done it for years. Slower and bulkier than Lil Gun which I like in other applications. Realize that they are different calibers but they both have large case capacity. Maybe this is worth what you paid for it!:smile:

[ebb]

Gun is looking great, congratulations.

[KenH]

Time for another update on the project rifle. I'm getting darn close now. I still have to make a new forearm so it fits properly, and another firing pin. The current firing pin has an extra flat milled on top of it. When I made it I got the top milled a little to far and it doesn't cock the hammer as it should. I turned pin over and milled a slot on other side to see it work. It does, now to make a correct pin.

Here's my proudest achievement - toggle links. I've made several of them trying to get headspace correct and fitting properly. A pretty large learning curve on my part.
https://i.ibb.co/P5GWFtH/Left-Toggle.jpg

They fit good, just oiled a bit and now they work smooth. The headspace is right about .060" - that is space between bolt face and barrel face. The rims of brass are about .055" to .056" or so giving about .004" or so clearance headspace. Tighter than normal but it works pretty good. Clearance between bolt space and barrel face checked with a .061" pin. Bolt closes and pin is pretty tight, too tight to easily pull out. A .055" rod slides freely between bolt face and barrel face and has a tad of slop. So, I'm thinking the clearance is actually around the .060" mark which is good for my brass with rim thickness of .055" to .057".

The Jamison 40-60 brass I ordered comes with rim thickness of .055" and a rim diameter of .616". I had to turn rim diameter down to .602" diameter so the extractor would slide over easy.

[missionary5155]

Toggle links are well done !
I had once considered making a set for a model 1873. Then I started realizing my chi-com drill press was all I had so I decided to look elsewhere.

[Prairie Cowboy]

Much respect KenH. Awesome work on those toggle links.

[auto5man]

very cool. Fascinating thread you have here!

[Prairie Cowboy]

Now that you have a functional antique elk rifle you need to hunt an antique elk with it. :mrgreen:
(with holy black hand loads of course)

[Rick B]

Outstanding job on the toggle links. Enjoy shooting your resurrected 1876.
Rick

[KenH]

Another short update on the project rifle. Last weekend I finished a replacement forearm for the "draft" version I made from scrap wood. While I'm not totally happy with the wood to metal fit, it's ok for now.

https://i.ibb.co/0F1sZpr/Forearm.jpg

I also made a couple of screws from W1 tool steel, then heat treated so the slots wouldn't bugger so easy. That turned them a nice blue color also. One was a filler screw for the tang sight screw, a 3/16-36 screw. Another I made was the finger lever screw to fit the Uberti finger lever. The original Winchester lever uses a .190" body diameter screw while the Uberti is about .198" diameter body. The original Winchester screw allows the Uberti lever to wobble a good bit.

Yesterday I loaded up 3 rounds of black powder. Filling the case 100% level full with take almost 50 grains of GOEX FFg requiring compression for depth of seated bullet. 40 grains is amount required for minor compression with a lubed felt spacer between powder and bullet. Since I wasn't sure about how heavy a load this would be, I opted for 40 grains.

https://i.ibb.co/vLKGYwK/Black-Powder-Chrono.png

Not sure why #1 shot was a tad higher fps, but perhaps it was due to a harder crimp I put on one round?

I was impressed with the black powder and think I'll load up some more BP. Cleaning is easier than I'm accustomed to with muzzle loaders. I used a solvent on brush thru bore a few times, then a dry patch. Seems to be clean? Is there a special solvent I should be using?

Ken H>

[indian joe]

Another short update on the project rifle. Last weekend I finished a replacement forearm for the "draft" version I made from scrap wood. While I'm not totally happy with the wood to metal fit, it's ok for now.

https://i.ibb.co/0F1sZpr/Forearm.jpg

I also made a couple of screws from W1 tool steel, then heat treated so the slots wouldn't bugger so easy. That turned them a nice blue color also. One was a filler screw for the tang sight screw, a 3/16-36 screw. Another I made was the finger lever screw to fit the Uberti finger lever. The original Winchester lever uses a .190" body diameter screw while the Uberti is about .198" diameter body. The original Winchester screw allows the Uberti lever to wobble a good bit.

Yesterday I loaded up 3 rounds of black powder. Filling the case 100% level full with take almost 50 grains of GOEX FFg requiring compression for depth of seated bullet. 40 grains is amount required for minor compression with a lubed felt spacer between powder and bullet. Since I wasn't sure about how heavy a load this would be, I opted for 40 grains.

https://i.ibb.co/vLKGYwK/Black-Powder-Chrono.png

Not sure why #1 shot was a tad higher fps, but perhaps it was due to a harder crimp I put on one round?

I was impressed with the black powder and think I'll load up some more BP. Cleaning is easier than I'm accustomed to with muzzle loaders. I used a solvent on brush thru bore a few times, then a dry patch. Seems to be clean? Is there a special solvent I should be using?

Ken H>

Yep special solvent is H2O - room temperature - if you wanna go gangbusters add one drop of good dish soap per litre.

[Texas by God]

Hot water and Dawn is what I use to clean blackpowder fouling. Your forend looks good! Keep it up, I'm glad that you're trying holy black because that's what the action was proofed for.

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[KenH]

Thanks for nice words on the forearm.

Yep, hot soapy water is what I've always used on muzzle loaders, and my Rolling Blocks, but boy that can be messy. Best done outside in the yard, and the whole gun tends to get wet. I was hoping for a cleaning method that would be easy 'n not so messy - like running a brush thru the bore a few times with a "magical" solvent? :)

[ebb]

Ive heard of BP shooters using Windex but have not tried it on my own.

[Wayne Smith]

Windex made with vinegar is the prescribed type. Has been for years.

Modern cartridge 44-40 I get about 38gr FFG with compression.

[Randy Bohannon]

1:7 Napa cutting oil and water 2” Pro Shot patch dampened one dry patch then your favorite lube for storage. You can fold over the patch and get a nice tight ‘squeegee’ fit .Kroil will let you know if the barrel is leaded with a tight fitting jag.

[KenH]

Windex/vinegar I've used for cleaning knives so I know it works pretty good and I do have it on hand. Thanks for all the ideas.

[KenH]

Folks, I just realized I'd never posted a final photo of the finished rifle. OR, what I'm considering mostly finished anyway. The finger lever is a Uberti part that was loaned to me by a very helpful member of the group. My lever is still on backorder. I did have to make a new screw for the Uberti lever to prevent wobble as the Uberti screw hole is almost .010" larger diameter than the original Winchester.

I've had LOTS of fun, and I've learned more than I ever expected to learn about these toggle link type lever action rifles. Ya'll have really been a BIG help - both with encouragement and shared knowledge. While I've had to modify almost all the Uberti parts, and made the toggle links and firing pin, it's nothing like Hootmix has done with his 1876. He's made almost all the parts.

Anyway, here's the result.

https://i.ibb.co/DLvQcVZ/1876-Finished.jpg

[Texas by God]

That is a good looking shooter. You brought that skeleton back to life, Doctor!

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[TCLouis]

The rifle looks great and you have provided us all a great bit of entertainment of the highest order.

[Rick B]

Looking forward to additional shooting reports.
Rick

[KenH]

OK, here are chrono reports of 2 sets of shots, one is black powder, other is Lil'Gun. Since they put that blasted subdivision and city limits adjoining my property line they've messed up my shooting range. Now I'm limited to a short 25 yds at back of shop. I keep expecting complaints there as the subdivision is filled up. Anyway, at 25 yds, shooting with old blade type iron sights and a bit of a prop to help hold rifle steady I'm getting about 1" size 5 shot groups. Sure seems like I should be better, but looking thru a scope on my pellet rifle I can see more wobble than I realized.

https://i.ibb.co/P5PtpPS/16-0-Lit-Gun.png

That's about all my FFg, but I do have a good bit of FFFg to try. The bullet is the Lee 410-210-SWC that drops at 208 with my alloy mix. I do powder coat, but the heavy lubed felt wad helps keep the fowling soft. The 40 grains of GOEX FFg fills 40-60 brass so the felt wad in up in neck of the "bottle neck" cartridge. I tried 45 grains of Fg, but the velocity was down around 1100 fps.
https://i.ibb.co/vLKGYwK/Black-Powder-Chrono.png

This has been a really fun project and I'm looking forward to more shooting this old rifle.

Ken H>