How hard is it to make a magazine?

[303Guy]

More specifically, for a 22.

I have three 22's missing their magazines. One I have a sample magazine for. Even the ones I have five round magazines for need ten round mags. But let's start with a Voere magazine. I have no sample. This rifle is my main possum and rabbit rifle due to it's shortness and suppressor. I would very much like to build a ten shot mag for it. Ten being the maximum legal limit.

[uscra112]

Hmmm..... Ask the hill tribesmen around the Khyber pass. They used to do it all the time with just sheet metal, hammers and anvils.

Seriously - some of the more serious model railroaders do stuff like that. Usually using hard brass sheet. Easier to solder. Here's a USA source for tools. https://www.micromark.com/
.

[1066]

Is your Voere a semi-auto .22 like this?
https://www.gunstar.co.uk/voere-self-loading-rifle-semi-auto-22-rifles/rifles/876162

If so I also have one but no spare magazine unfortunately. I can take photos and measurements if that would help

Just found this also - it seems it might be the same magazine as the Mauser 105 and 106.
https://riflemags.co.uk/voere-8-round-22lr-magazine-semi-auto-fit/

[jmorris]

Depends on what material, equipment and or skill you have.

With lots of equipment, you don’t need much skill, just move pieces of metal to various locations and push buttons. With a hammer, file and anvil, your going to need lots of skill to have a functional part.

I would start by looking everywhere for a replacement. If I managed to exhaust all resources for used parts and came up empty, I would then begin a search for a “donor” magazine from another .22 rifle.

Finding one that’s close enough to be easily modified, to work, is going to be a much easier task than reinventing the wheel, so to speak.

[1066]

Have you thought about 3d printing? My Sako Finnfire magazine original magazine is plastic and I also have a 3d printed copy that works well. Or possibly a 3d printed body and sheet brass top and lips.

[Baltimoreed]

I built a speedloader for my krag by bending sheet metal around a form very similar to the photo. I made it a hair too short and while my reloads are ok a buds reloads were too long to fit. A .22 magazine would be doable but for the tempering of the feed lips. A .22 magazines feed lips are critical to the operation of your rifle or pistol. Id do some research to find the closest thing available and mod it. Give GPC a look as they have a huge inventory of old out of print junk too. 268174

[Red River Rick]

https://riflemags.co.uk/voere-magazines/
https://www.triplek.com/product/voere-22lr-7-rd-magazine/
https://www.gunclips.net/vo22rima.html

RRR

[Bulldogger]

Old school me says you need to make dies to stamp reinforced metal plates to clamp and or weld together.

New school me says, If I were going to do one today, or tomorrow, I'd spend some time with my rudimentary CAD program and knock a few prototypes out.

MBTcustom had a thread about stamping some mags several years ago, and he is still somewhat active here.

There have been a few teaser threads about printing mags, but I can't recall any very successful ones.

Some 3DP websites may have more threads on this. It's certainly do-able, and if I had something with a decent sized cartridge that I needed mags for, I'd try it.

Either way, if you decide to dive into a mag-making project I will follow and assist as able, as it interests me as well.

Bulldogger

[Bulldogger]

As jmorris notes, sometimes one can find a "close enough" magazine and adapt it. I have some old Czech VZ-70's in .32 ACP that when I bought them there were zero spare mags and they came with no mags (and were priced accordingly). 6-8 months later following revived interest as a bunch of us had bought these old surplus pistols and were asking, someone offered mags, but at $35-40 each. That price was close to a fourth of the price of the pistols, so I wonder how many they sold.

My solution was to buy cheap aftermarket Walther PP magazines (the parent design of the VZ) and modify them by extending the bottom of the mags by 1/8" using a bit of tack welded steel, so they would fit properly into the mag well of the VZ and trip the magazine catch. This was not optimum as it weakened the feed spring by lengthening it (I didn't make a plug) and my welding was terrible too. BUT they worked for the range. As a carry gun, I bought a few factory mags that I could trust.

There are solutions!

BDGR

[one-eyed fat man]

Learn new skills! Calculate bend allowances, temper sheet steel, spot welding. Someplace there is an old timey blacksmith knows just what you need.

[wv109323]

If you have 5 round magazines or are available I would try to cut the 5 rounders and reweld them into a 10 round. Wolff has a generic 22 magazine spring that you could cut to length.
Another option would be 3D scan, a 5 round, extend it to 10 rounds and 3D print. I have heard that sheet meral magazines are hard to 3D print but it may be n option.

[uscra112]

3D printing might be a good way to make forms around which to bend the sheet metal to make the mag.

[uscra112]

A glimmer of a memory is coming back to me. I once met an artist type who practiced an art of making small sheet metal objects by laying the raw sheet on a bed of wax, then, using small hammers and such, beating the form into the metal. He said it was a very old technique used by makers of armor in the middle ages.

[elmacgyver0]

I would do an internet search.
Making magazines sounds simple but in reality is not so easy.
I would only try to make a magazine as a last resort.
It can be done though but remember, the feed lips need to be rigid to maintain their shape.
Good luck!

[303Guy]

Thanks for the responses, folks.

RRR, the exact magazine is tight there in your links. About double the price of the rifle! But at least now I know what it looks like. I did once make a drawing of what would fit in the magazine well.

Ok, this is going to be quite a challenge which is what I was expecting. I don't have a TIG setup which is rather limiting but using brass sheet could be the answer. I've been known to solder steel but it is quite a mission. I no longer have access to a milling machine but I do have a lathe, not that it helps. Anyway, I particularly want to tackle fabricating a magazine but if I can find one to adapt, that would be much easier. Trouble is, magazines get lost hence my having rifles without magazines.

[BigEyeBob]

Get onto these two Aussie online sites , usedguns and oz gunsales ,always magazines and parts available .Rebel Gunworks has a fairly comprehensive list of parts as well ,some new some used.Google search will find them.

[nagantguy]

I’m
All for jumping in and making modifying what I can’t find/get/buy but my weak google-Fu turned up lots of Voere 22 mags for sale all over US and Europe. Even some for sale
On eBay. Is it a problem of finding them or a problem of getting them to your location?

[lup]

I believe that weaponsguid.com often has some magazine making information.

You will need a login to access it though.

The is forum dedicated to magazines in there.

[jmorris]

Trouble is, magazines get lost hence my having rifles without magazines.


If you actually get one to work made from brass or soldered steel, made with a hammer and file, you’ll sleep with it under your pillow, if you don’t have a safe to lock it up in.

[Elroy]

You may best to buy a cheap steel magazine for a common 22 ,and modify it to work for your rifle..I did that to an old Ithica X15 Lightning ,and if I remember right it was as simple as brazing a little nub on it to allow the mag to lock into the rifle at the proper depth.

[Drm50]

If making mags was simple there would be a lot of them on the market. Many of the aftermarket mags at $40 @ don’t work that well. I’ve got 22 mags I have no idea what they are for. At $5 I never let one get buy. Voere, I would have to see one to match up. I do have a new Voere 22rf barrel, don’t know what model it is.

[1066]

This is an 8 shot Voere mag. I can give you measurements and angles if you really want to go ahead with it. As far as mags go, this one looks pretty simple.
http://i.imgur.com/mfDbL0ql.jpg (https://imgur.com/mfDbL0q)
http://i.imgur.com/8a66FqAl.jpg (https://imgur.com/8a66FqA)
http://i.imgur.com/QLVjhhzl.jpg (https://imgur.com/QLVjhhz)
http://i.imgur.com/QYj8893l.jpg (https://imgur.com/QYj8893)
http://i.imgur.com/JcUPDSNl.jpg (https://imgur.com/JcUPDSN)
http://i.imgur.com/ds1M3W8l.jpg (https://imgur.com/ds1M3W8)
http://i.imgur.com/2r6fx9Rl.jpg (https://imgur.com/2r6fx9R)
http://i.imgur.com/BxEFvPjl.jpg (https://imgur.com/BxEFvPj)

[303Guy]

That looks like what I would expect it to be. Pretty much the shape of the mag well. It's simple enough but not so simple to bend the sheet into shape. Then follow with heat treatment. I could make a former for that. The trick would be to evenly heat the sheet and bend it hot. Or bend it then heat it in the former so it keeps its shape. This will be a challenge!

Thanks, 1066, I would appreciate the measurements if you would be so kind.

I'll also look on the web to see what's out there. Thanks, all.

[Baltimoreed]

303, Know anyone with a first generation colt woodsman, a Supermatic citation HS or a Smith model 41? Doesn’t look like the grip angle is very extreme like the later Woodsmans or Ruger .22s. See if any of those are close.

[mf79]

maybe you can get some epoxy clay and mold it to inside of gun where mag goes then remove it when hard . make sure to do it in a way that you can get it out.

[jmorris]

If you have an example of one that works. What is the width, length and angle of the round as it sits (be sure to account for the rim, so the angle is parallel with the case.

[jmorris]

You could also just guy a magazine for it and extend the area where the spring is going to be.

https://www.triplek.com/product/voere-22lr-7-rd-magazine/

Edit: I should have searched first, buy one of these and be done.

https://www.agamazond.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=354649

Or buy two and get free shipping.

[M-Tecs]

Volume reduces costs. If you find someone willing to build 3 or less my guess is you are looking at $300 to $500 each if you are lucky. If you order a 1,000 you should be able to get them for $20 or $30 each

[jmorris]

^ why I put the last link in the post above, not worth messing with, when you can buy a new 10 round mag for $34.

[1066]

More specifically, for a 22.

I have three 22's missing their magazines. One I have a sample magazine for. Even the ones I have five round magazines for need ten round mags. But let's start with a Voere magazine. I have no sample. This rifle is my main possum and rabbit rifle due to it's shortness and suppressor. I would very much like to build a ten shot mag for it. Ten being the maximum legal limit.

Are we talking about the semi-auto or the bolt action Voere .22? The mags are different. My rifle and the pictures are for a semi-auto. The semi-auto on these rifles has a facility to be able to lock the bolt and use as a bolt action or semi-auto.

And isn't the OP living in New Zealand?

[Burnt Fingers]

Any fool can make a magazine.

The hard part is making one that works.

[303Guy]

Any fool can make a magazine.
The hard part is making one that works.
Hah! Exactly. So there is the challenge aspect.

Yes, I'm in New Zealand. Which means I can buy a magazine from overseas (but not the US). The UK source is asking £54. For that I can buy a complete rifle with scope. I'm a retiree so I need to be frugal. I do have a workshop and some spare time though. Then again, when a magazine if offered for NZ$35 to NZ$45 it becomes quite tempting.

But remember that if I can make one successfully, I would be able to make another and another and another. So there is that aspect too.

[1066]

If you are going to try to make a magazine - this would be a good one to start with.

Appears to made of 22 swg steel (.64mm) Spring also 22 swg.
Rake angle 74 degrees.
Inside diameter of round nose 8mm

http://i.imgur.com/0cV48YMl.jpg (https://imgur.com/0cV48YM)
http://i.imgur.com/aCofOi6l.jpg (https://imgur.com/aCofOi6)
http://i.imgur.com/JSGbcTAl.jpg (https://imgur.com/JSGbcTA)
http://i.imgur.com/5Su3Gsol.jpg (https://imgur.com/5Su3Gso)
http://i.imgur.com/zp3QA9gl.jpg (https://imgur.com/zp3QA9g)
http://i.imgur.com/GMVed7Tl.jpg (https://imgur.com/GMVed7T)

I would think of this as a sort of "low pressure" magazine ie. it has a gentle spring, it's well supported at the top in the action and large lazy lips.
If I was making it I might be tempted to make one with brass tube/sheet. Most model shops will stock brass tube with ID of 8mm and small sheets of 22swg brass are also readily available.
Made in three parts could easily be soft soldered.
Or machine a steel tube on your lathe and steel sheet and hard solder the bits together.
http://i.imgur.com/S1Tv3rrl.png (https://imgur.com/S1Tv3rr)

[skeettx]

https://www.rebelgunworks.com.au/products/aftermarket-magazine-voere-22-lr-10-rnd

Expensive but you know what it looks like :)

[303Guy]

Thanks for that, 1066.

mf69 set me to thinking. Looking at the geometry of that Voere magazine, it might be simpler to make it in four parts with the main body made from fiber glass. The two sides with the lips could be made from steel strapping which is easily available that could be glued into place and the rear piece with the latch cut out also glued on. The base piece is not a problem as it does not need to fit into anything. The follower would be a bit tricky but can be shaped from any workable material.

Using brass crossed my mind too but I didn't think of using brass tubing. Good idea.

Making a former for this mag, whether to form or jig metal parts or form fiberglass parts would be easy to make. With information 1066 has given, I think I can do it. I shall start looking for materials and decide which way to go.

[Shopdog]

Too bad you're 1/2 a world away 303. You could stop by here and WE(as in,you do some work) could "probably" knock one out before lunch. Would be expedient tooling meaning,it's lifespan wouldn't come close to industry stds. Or,that it would process the same. Big difference designing tooling for short fast,get'r done and what it takes to run 10k units.

You "can"(which means just that,not "should"),buy an expensive example,use it for design purposes,then sell it once you have a 1/2 dz? Or "borrow" in or from,a stud service sort of way...... owner of said "stud" gets a free clip(code for a post folding process) for their troubles.

On things like this,finding the right shop,with possibly even more important,the right attitude,is the "gold ring". There is a video on YouTube of some,believe it's Czech boys,making,I think AK mags(could be wrong) with some WWII machines. And making it profitably. As an example of how industry used to do it..... spiced with,how in certain instances production doesn't HAVE to be CNC'd. Good luck with your project.

[Scrounge]

A glimmer of a memory is coming back to me. I once met an artist type who practiced an art of making small sheet metal objects by laying the raw sheet on a bed of wax, then, using small hammers and such, beating the form into the metal. He said it was a very old technique used by makers of armor in the middle ages.
Repoussé and chasing are what you're remembering.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Repoussé_and_chasing

The first one is hammered from the back side, the second from the front, for decorative work. The two are often combined, especially for practical stuff. Get a decent book on working sheet metal for tool boxes & HVAC ducting, and combine them and you're half-way there. ;)

[303Guy]

Tutankhamun's mummy mask is amazing!

I've just had a look at my Remington 511 mag. It's so simple. No forming or bending. Well, the Remington's mag side wall have forming to hold the rounds central but to use the concept, I would attach the guides. I would also need to attach bits on the outside to make it fit the mag well. I'll post a picture next time I open the safe.

I have once or twice made forming tools for heavier material but simpler forms. I've been thinking about how I might do it and while it can be done, the work involved is quite daunting.

[Drm50]

The late Jack O’Connor said there were two kinds of people who took scopes apart. Experts and fools. I did this once and found I was in later group. I will have to get his book out and see what he says about magazines. I know I have attempted to make them a couple times and ended up throwing in the towel.