Powder Coating Problems - HELP!

[o416]

I figured I would ask the experts here as I am newbie to powder coating. I have watched lots of videos on it and read a lot but things went pretty poorly for me.

Here is a picture of my bullets that I tried to PC:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ko0fkj6O_PngPR7_-xq9YW92DL1DwbKO/view?usp=sharing

The coat did stick on but I have this weird marbling effect and some bare spots.

Here is what I did:
1. Took a handful of bullets and put them in a number 5 plastic food container.
2. Put a teaspoonful of PC and swirled like a mad man for 30 seconds; I could still see some bare lead so I swirled some more.
3. I dumped them into a sifter tray and took off the excess PC; there were stills some bare lead spots
4. I baked them without putting them base down as I didn't want to disturb the PC
5. I baked for 15 minutes at 375F as per manufacturer instructions (https://emeraldcoatings.com/product/phantom-glass-black/)

That was my process but they look nowhere near as nice as some of what others show here.

The bullets sized fine and the PC didn't come off but some expert advice would be much appreciated :)

[o416]

Oh, I also tried to preheat them for one minute at 400F with no real benefit.

[Chris S]

So, all I do differently is to shake more vigorously, not just swirl, but up and down as well. Then I pick them out with a pair of hemostats grasping the groove area and place them base down on a silicone mat. Then I bake them at 400 to 450 (depending on the powder) for AT LEAST 20 minutes, no less. Otherwise, I think your first blush looks fine.
Chris

[o416]

So, all I do differently is to shake more vigorously, not just swirl, but up and down as well. Then I pick them out with a pair of hemostats grasping the groove area and place them base down on a silicone mat. Then I bake them at 400 to 450 (depending on the powder) for AT LEAST 20 minutes, no less. Otherwise, I think your first blush looks fine.
Chris

Thanks for the input Chris. I was just hoping for a prettier look :/ I am sure they are functional, but maybe black is hard to cover thoroughly?

[reddog81]

If you want the sides to look perfect you’ll have to bake base down. Laying the bullets on there side will result in imperfections on the sides.

[kungfustyle]

Did you add air soft bb's? That will help create the static needed. Also watch the humidity, high humidity will kill the coating. Bake for longer. 20 min once you get to 400. That is what most recommend.

[GregLaROCHE]

Make sure bare boolits don’t get contaminated from slight amount of oils on your fingers. Set them upright and bake at least at 400F for thirty minutes. If they look good, you can try reducing the time some.

[jessdigs]

What powder are you using

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[rancher1913]

once again it needs sayin----not all powder coat powders will tumble coat, the powder was designed to be sprayed and thru trial and error the folks on here have figured out some easy ways to coat bollits with out a spray gun but---not all powders will do this. when you are starting out, use pretested and proven powders, it will save you a lot of problems and then as you get better, experiment away and add to the knowledge on here.

[popper]

Black looks neat but is not the best for tumbling. Those will shoot OK. Not bad for first try.

[AndyC]

I could never get good coverage trying to shake by hand, so instead I dump about 100 boolits into a #5 plastic tub (without BBs) and vibrate for 5-10 mins in my case-cleaner.

[bangerjim]

Shake UP AND DOWN vigorously (!) for 30-40 seconds....not just swirl. I found that works every time. But humidity does play a BIG part in this black magic voodoo process.

And you did not say what brand of powder. Makes a big difference! For your first times doing this, use a known brand of powder that is proven to tumble coat. Use black ASBB's not the cheap soft colored ones.

Just dumping them out will definitely cause lay marks on your boolits. Never dump if you want perfectly smooth sides. Sit them up with tweezers or forceps.

If you get tired of all these steps, go to an ESPC gun system like I did (and the actual way the powder was engineered to be applied) and you get perfect finishes every time regardless of the powder, temperature, humidity or phase of the moon.

You boolits look perfectly good to shoot.

bangerjim

[Idz]

I just do another coat over the first. I'm not as picky as some and use the shake bullets with powder, dump in mesh basket, and bake 20 min at 400f. Then repeat if needed. Then run coated bullets through sizing die.

[mattw]

I have often found that even though some lead is showing... there seems to be a clear coat over it. I have that issue with Smokes black as well, but there is something there if I go after it with a very sharp and tiny knife and magnifiers. I have had some that were other colors that seemed to really separate the clear out, the bullets looked horrible, but there was a coating there.

I would check them and then shoot them, but I bet you will be fine. The best coating I have found is Smokes white and black mixed about 50/50 and the same for white and wine red. In both cases, neither works will apart but they work beautifully together... Can't explain why.

[FLINTNFIRE]

I use a number 5 container , airsoft bbs and use Smokes powder he sells on here , I shake and swirl in tubs I use and agitate it for between 20 seconds or more , check if it looks good dump sift and bake , I use the round and round but also up and down to make sure powder is distributed throughout the container , I probably put more bullets in then some do and maybe even more powder .

I started doing small batches and after testing , have moved up to larger batches , how I do it works for me , so I will continue doing it this way , there is a lot of discussion back and forth on different aspects , that is something only you can decide what you will do , Your bullets in photo looked fine .

[Conditor22]

1 Make sure alloy (boolits) are clean before PCing -- DON"T QUENCH BEFORE PCING (it's too easy to contaminate the boolits and you lose almost everything you gain when you bake them PCing

2 with most blacks you will need airsoft BB's of poly pellets to build enough static to get a decent (I said decent not good) coverage there are a few blacks that you can get good coverage ASBBDT if you work at it. [many PC's coat well without BB's/poly pellets]

3 You can preheat the boolits in an oven set to 150° or less, (sometimes I set them on top of my oven) you need to be able to touch them with bare handed

4 You can use twezers to stand them up or rubber gloves, just dip the twezers or glove in the pc where they will be touching the boolits first

try flattening one with a hammer to see if the PC flakes/chips

You can add a little of another PC to the black andthat may give you great coverage.



this is off the topic and hardly ever discussed.
When coating in 2-3 stages, always particularly cure the base coat around 50-75% of the recommended cure schedule to allow the top coat to properly cross-link with the base coat. This method of curing will result in the best possible bond between coats. over curing the base coat can cause possible Delamination between coatings.

IF you are doing 2 coats, only bake the first coat a little past powder flowout so the first coat is not fully cured and the second coat can bond completely with it

PS. I never shake, breaks to many containers. I get good to great results by only swirling. Your trying to build up static.

[o416]

WOW! Thank you SO MUCH to all of you for responding. I wasn't expecting this much feedback. There is much for me to learn, apply and absorb.

I bought a cheap Frankford Arsenal tumbler from Amazon to help me tumble the bullets. I will try the tweezer method as well :)

Much respect from your neighbor up north in Canada. I hope I can move to the USA one day because your 2nd amendment is priceless!

Thanks again guys!

[Bill8914]

Practically all powder calls for a 400 degree heat. That is the object heat not air. Once the bullet or whatever you are coating comes up to heat that is when the time at temperature starts.

[FLINTNFIRE]

You know even swirling broke some of my containers till I bought some from the dollar store made in USA and screw on lids months now I have been swirling and shaking and no cracks funny rubbermaid and other tubs split quick .

[cwlongshot]

1 Make sure alloy (boolits) are clean before PCing -- DON"T QUENCH BEFORE PCING (it's too easy to contaminate the boolits and you lose almost everything you gain when you bake them PCing

2 with most blacks you will need airsoft BB's of poly pellets to build enough static to get a decent (I said decent not good) coverage there are a few blacks that you can get good coverage ASBBDT if you work at it. [many PC's coat well without BB's/poly pellets]

3 You can preheat the boolits in an oven set to 150° or less, (sometimes I set them on top of my oven) you need to be able to touch them with bare handed

4 You can use twezers to stand them up or rubber gloves, just dip the twezers or glove in the pc where they will be touching the boolits first

try flattening one with a hammer to see if the PC flakes/chips

You can add a little of another PC to the black andthat may give you great coverage.



this is off the topic and hardly ever discussed.
When coating in 2-3 stages, always particularly cure the base coat around 50-75% of the recommended cure schedule to allow the top coat to properly cross-link with the base coat. This method of curing will result in the best possible bond between coats. over curing the base coat can cause possible Delamination between coatings.

IF you are doing 2 coats, only bake the first coat a little past powder flowout so the first coat is not fully cured and the second coat can bond completely with it

PS. I never shake, breaks to many containers. I get good to great results by only swirling. Your trying to build up static.
Lots of good advice. Its allot to wade thru and I dont wish to step on toes or hurt feelings as some donknow what they are doing others mostly know and some have a good idea..

Jim above is and will always give it to ya straigh and true as he coats ALLOT O BOOLITS!!

The KEY and MOST IMPORTANT thing for our shake and bale is to make sufficient static.

Ya wont do that easily with just a few bullets. Simply because of SURFACE AREA. ITS SMALL, more surface the faster ya are able to build static. Thats why BB's or beads are suggested. SURFACE AREA!! This is why #5 plastics are suggested. NONE... listen mow NONE ARE REQUIRED for all people!!! Some YES while others NO...

TOO much can cause excessively heavy coatings. This as I have expereinced are only issues on tight ogive dims and where ya want to gas check. The dia produced is insignificant as any sizing will
Leave ya with a dia you choose.

Good luck

CW