All Sin the Same

[Thundarstick]

1Jo 5:16-17

If you see any brother or sister commit a sin that does not lead to death, you should pray and God will give them life. I refer to those whose sin does not lead to death. There is a sin that leads to death. I am not saying that you should pray about that.
All wrongdoing is sin, and there is sin that does not lead to death.

Your thoughts on this? What's sin leading to death, not leading to death? I've oftenseen it said ALL sins are the same, yes, no?

[JimB..]

This one is tricky because I always think of spiritual death in relation to sin, but in this case I think John means physical death. Examples of sin that cause death are not obvious to me, suicide would be the most likely, drug abuse or drinking yourself to death, maybe committing adultery with the neighbor and her old man comes home and puts bullet in yer noggin?

In a broader sense I wonder if John is saying not to pray for the physically dead? One might say that at that point the departed can no longer act, he or she no longer has free will, so there is nothing to pray for? That God is not responsive to prayers seeking, begging for, forgiveness on behalf of others?

[Ickisrulz]

The "sin that leads to death" is rejecting Jesus as the Christ and only source of salvation.

Not all sins are equal. Common sense and the Bible answers this.

[ioon44]

Sin ' to miss the mark".

[1hole]

The "sin that leads to death" is rejecting Jesus as the Christ and only source of salvation.

Not all sins are equal. Common sense and the Bible answers this.

Absolutely. Armed robbery and jay-walking are both illegal so the law is broken in both cases but they are by no means equal.

Like the law, acts that cause the most damage to others are the major sins but it's only the sin of disbelief that condemns men to hell.

Salvation is not based at some imaginary "good" vs. "bad" point on a sliding scale of sin severity and that IS what "the Bible says" (John 3:18).

It's us Biblically iggerant humans that let ourselves get all wrapped up in stoopid conjecture like this, not God.

[dannyd]

All sins are forgivable if the person is truly repentant. Just like the thief on the cross or a better example is Paul himself.

[dverna]

The "sin that leads to death" is rejecting Jesus as the Christ and only source of salvation.

Not all sins are equal. Common sense and the Bible answers this.

Perfectly stated and concise.

[JimB..]

The "sin that leads to death" is rejecting Jesus as the Christ and only source of salvation.

Not all sins are equal. Common sense and the Bible answers this.

We have all denied Jesus at one time or another, through words or actions, and it seems to me that it’s wholly appropriate to pray for someone that is doing so. It can’t therefore be the “sin that leads to death” that John is talking about.

[Ickisrulz]

We have all denied Jesus at one time or another, through words or actions, and it seems to me that it’s wholly appropriate to pray for someone that is doing so. It can’t therefore be the “sin that leads to death” that John is talking about.

No, I believe that John and the author of Hebrews are talking about someone who once was a committed Christian and is now denying that Jesus is the Christ, scoffing at the Gospel message.

A Christian who willfully sins (and there aren't any who don't) from time to time is not "denying Christ", they are sinning. Even Peter, who denied knowing Jesus, did not deny Christ the way John and the writer of Hebrews had in mind:

"It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace." Hebrews 6:4-6

You see very little talk in the Bible about something that leads a believer to spiritual death or cannot be forgiven. Apart from the two writers I mentioned above, you have Jesus' warning about blaspheming the Holy Spirit and Paul's warnings about circumcision. Jesus was concerned about people denying his work when they knew better. Paul was concerned about Gentiles who were converted to Christianity thinking they were justified by works rather than Jesus Christ.

[JimB..]

No, I believe that John and the author of Hebrews are talking about someone who once was a committed Christian and is now denying that Jesus is the Christ, scoffing at the Gospel message.

A Christian who willfully sins (and there aren't any who don't) from time to time is not "denying Christ", they are sinning. Even Peter, who denied knowing Jesus, did not deny Christ the way John and the writer of Hebrews had in mind:

"It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace." Hebrews 6:4-6

You see very little talk in the Bible about something that leads a believer to spiritual death or cannot be forgiven. Apart from the two writers I mentioned above, you have Jesus' warning about blaspheming the Holy Spirit and Paul's warnings about circumcision. Jesus was concerned about people denying his work when they knew better. Paul was concerned about Gentiles who were converted to Christianity thinking they were justified by works rather than Jesus Christ.

Not being argumentative, but am at work and only have a moment so please forgive me if the tone of this is somewhat offputting and the grammar strained.

So are some people to be written off? Are to identify and judge those people? I see no reason to believe that God puts that burden on us. I lean more towards us not really knowing what is in another’s heart, and perhaps they harbor doubts about the truth of their own statements even if they are scoffing at a belief that Christ is Lord and Savior, and that we should witness to and pray for those folks.

It seems more likely to me that he meant not to pray for the dead, indirectly saying that we each need to put our spiritual house in order while we are alive because nobody can clean up your mess for you once you are gone.

You’ve obviously studied this more than I have, and again I don’t intend to dismiss your position or be argumentative, it just seems like a strain to make this passage about spiritual death when it makes sense as physical death.

[Rizzo]

1Jo 5:16-17

If you see any brother or sister commit a sin that does not lead to death, you should pray and God will give them life. I refer to those whose sin does not lead to death. There is a sin that leads to death. I am not saying that you should pray about that.
All wrongdoing is sin, and there is sin that does not lead to death.

Your thoughts on this? What's sin leading to death, not leading to death? I've oftenseen it said ALL sins are the same, yes, no?

My thought on this is a Bible verse(?) that states:
"The wages of sin is death"
I take it to mean ALL sins since it does not specify.
OK, I just looked it up.
For you Chapter/verse people, it is Rom 6:23

[1hole]

My thought on this is a Bible verse(?) that states:
"The wages of sin is death"
I take it to mean ALL sins since it does not specify.
OK, I just looked it up.
For you Chapter/verse people, it is Rom 6:23

It does indeed mean all sin. All sin is "missing the mark" of how we should live. Obviously, not all sin is as bad as any other (That's insane, murder and speeding are NOT the same!) but all sin contaminates the sinner and the wages of sin - all sin - IS death (Rom 6:23). That's why none of us can avoid our punishment except our penalty be paid.

We cannot possibly be "good enough" to be saved from our sin penalty so Jesus came, lived and died as a perfect man; he paid the penalty for those who accept his free - to us - gift. Those who meet his criteria will be accorded HIS perfectly sin-free life record for our own; that is very "good news"! Those imperfect people who think they know a better way to "earn" God's acceptance are in for a rude shock (Mat 7:21-24).

Men's whiny complaining about how good they are and shaking their fists in God's face because they feel "good" enough to earn a ticket to heaven miss the whole point of what's going on in the Gospel.

Thankfully, Jesus' gift of salvation doesn't have to be worked for or earned by us, as such. HE has done it all for those who live and die by one rule of true faith in HIM as our only eternal savior (Eph 2:8-10)! Why is that simple path so hard for many self-styled "smart" people to get?

[dtknowles]

Not all sins are equal but evil is evil and will not be forgiven. If you are not good of heart and soul then your sins will be the death of you. If you are of good heart and soul and regret you sins for the hurt they cause you can be forgiven and have everlasting life. Regretting your sins because the might keep you out of heaven won't cut it. You have to regret your sins because they hurt someone, anyone or everyone. The wages of sin is death, do you work at being sinful or do you work at being good. The wages of good works is everlasting life. Do you take or do you give?

Tim

[Wayne Smith]

The broadest and most complete definition of sin in the Bible: for all have sinned and fallen short of the Glory of God.

Pardon my ignorance but the very best I do falls desperately short of the Glory of God. If sin were an ocean and I were a fish and you hooked me and pulled me up into the Glory of God I would wither and die without Christ.

In the Old Testament (Jeremiah) my righteousness - the very best I can do - my good stuff - in God's eyes is likened to "dirty rags" in the English, in the Hebrew it is literally 'used women's mensural rags' - the last use of a rag in that society before it was burned. That's my good stuff in God's eyes.

The bottom line is that fallen human effort cannot satisfy a perfect God. Only God's perfect sacrifice satisfies God's justice. It is only through Christ that humanity can approach God.