I bought a Lyman M die

[dtknowles]

I ordered what was sold as a Lyman M expander die for 32-20. It came in one of the excessively nice orange plastic boxes marked as 31 short. The die is what I wanted. The expander is 0.310". It is not short but long which is good as I am using on cast bullet loads for my 30 BR long.

[Winger Ed.]

Once in awhile you can get by without it for certain cases, but its pretty much a must have for cast.

[gpidaho]

I'm fond of the Noe expanders that fit inside the Lee universal expander (flarer) die. Makes it very useful for different cases of the same neck size. Say 32-20, 303 Brit, 7.62X54 etc. Gp

[elmacgyver0]

I have never found a need for an "M" die, that doesn't mean I won't buy some at some point.
Don't know why but you know the way it is.

[DHDeal]

I'm fond of the Noe expanders that fit inside the Lee universal expander (flarer) die. Makes it very useful for different cases of the same neck size. Say 32-20, 303 Brit, 7.62X54 etc. Gp

You and me both. I've got an M Die per caliber I shoot cast in and found in a few cases they were undersized. Not the case with the NOE expanders as you can order whatever size you want, within reason.

[HangFireW8]

I gave up on the Lyman M after I saw how much it pushed the neck off center. The problem is with most cases and calibers, either the initial diameter is too large and begins next expansion before the neck is supported, or it is too small to support the neck when the mouth hits the step.

The NOE come in smaller increments, so I can match the i.d. of the sized case to the initial shaft diameter, so when the mouth hits the step a good length of the neck is supported by a slip fit on the shaft.

I invite anyone with a runout gage to measure eccentricity at the neck before and after M die use.

[Bazoo]

I use M dies for flat base jacketed bullets in both 30-30 and 30-06. Yes you can make ammo without one, but it takes all the frustration out of the seating operation.

[1hole]

Lyman's "short" or "long" M die labels refers to the cartridges they are best for, not the die (the expander plug really). I buy the "short" version because with just a moment's adjustment it can work for any normal cartridge.

[mxer]

New to the forum, just this evening.
I don’t cast bullets, but have a commercial supplier just down the road for all handguns, .30 Carbine and 45-70. Using a Dillon 550b, this (https://lousgunwork.com/M-Neck-Expander-Powder-Dies.html) resolved a long time frustration loading .45 ACP 200 grain SWC for 1911. Pricey, but worth every penny. I haven’t yet seen the need for the M die for 9mm, 115 grain cast round nose. For both the .45 ACP and 9mm Lee’s crimp die also helps.

[dtknowles]

Lyman's "short" or "long" M die labels refers to the cartridges they are best for, not the die (the expander plug really). I buy the "short" version because with just a moment's adjustment it can work for any normal cartridge.

That explains the markings on the box. Thanks.

Tim

[nicholst55]

New to the forum, just this evening.
I don’t cast bullets, but have a commercial supplier just down the road for all handguns, .30 Carbine and 45-70. Using a Dillon 550b, this (https://lousgunwork.com/M-Neck-Expander-Powder-Dies.html) resolved a long time frustration loading .45 ACP 200 grain SWC for 1911. Pricey, but worth every penny. I haven’t yet seen the need for the M die for 9mm, 115 grain cast round nose. For both the .45 ACP and 9mm Lee’s crimp die also helps.

A member here makes a very similar part, IIRC.

[dtknowles]

Right now I am forming new 30 BR long brass from Lapua 6.5 x 47 brass. I was not happy with the brass that came with the rifle. It was formed from RP 300 Savage brass. I have a forming die and a neck sizing die that uses bushings. I want to turn the necks so that with the neck sizing bushing I have I get a one thou squeeze on a 0.310 cast bullet. The bushing gives me one thou neck clearance on a chambered round. That is an estimate based on the difference between a fired case and a sized case. I got the M die to expand the necks to the right diameter so I can turn them. After I get these cases formed I might have to polish down the M die expander so I can use it to bell the case mouths if I need to to load cast bullets without shaving lead and still have a one thou squeeze.

Tim

[Wayne Smith]

Actually the 'short' and 'long' relate to the length of the die. You got the short die for a relatively short cartridge, pistol cartridges use the short die, and most rifle cartridges use the long die. I have one of each and several M die inserts that I can mix and match.

[rbuck351]

I build my own "M" type dies to what ever size and shape I want.

[leadhead]

I shot .30BR in a Remington XP100 in handgun silhouette for years, and always
used Winchester .308 brass. Why would you use Lapua brass?
Denny

[dtknowles]

I shot .30BR in a Remington XP100 in handgun silhouette for years, and always
used Winchester .308 brass. Why would you use Lapua brass?
Denny

Lapua brass is the best and 6.5 x 47 is almost the right length and shape so I just have to neck it up to 30 cal, turn the necks and trim to length. It also has a small primer pocket and a small flash hole. .308 brass has larger primer pockets and normal flash hole and is very long so it has to be cut and trimmed instead of just trimmed. You have to remove a lot more material when turning the necks. I also have a 6mm PPC that I have used RP, Fed, Win, Norma and Lapua brass. The Lapua brass is more accurate and last longer.

Tim

[dtknowles]

Actually the 'short' and 'long' relate to the length of the die. You got the short die for a relatively short cartridge, pistol cartridges use the short die, and most rifle cartridges use the long die. I have one of each and several M die inserts that I can mix and match.

This M die is longer than the ones that come with the 3 die pistol sets. It also has a steel adjustment screw/plug not aluminum like my pistol dies. M die that came with my 9mm die set on the right and my new one on the left.

266537

Tim

[leadhead]

Tim..... Thanks for the info... back when I was shooting IHMSA, I don't think
that cal. was even around. I never had to turn the necks on .308 brass.
I just resized in the Redding die, trimmed it down, and loaded it. I couldn't
use Federal or Rem brass without turning the necks. Win .308 brass no
problem. Won the cast bullet international championship in unlimited class in
in 1978 with it. Wow, I guess that was a long time ago.
Denny

[John Boy]

* Lyman M die... $21 plus shipping
* Track of the Wolf Expansion Plug ... $2.99 plus shipping
Have a large box of TOTW Expansion Plugs for all of my bullet diameters for all calibers :drinks:

[dtknowles]

Tim..... Thanks for the info... back when I was shooting IHMSA, I don't think
that cal. was even around. I never had to turn the necks on .308 brass.
I just resized in the Redding die, trimmed it down, and loaded it. I couldn't
use Federal or Rem brass without turning the necks. Win .308 brass no
problem. Won the cast bullet international championship in unlimited class in
in 1978 with it. Wow, I guess that was a long time ago.
Denny

Congratulations on your championship no matter how long ago. I shot small bore hunters pistol at a club in Lompoc, CA for a while.

That is interesting regarding the Win brass must have had thin case walls.

266550

On the left is the 6.5 x 47 parent case, next to it is the formed and neck expanded case (see the donut from the shoulder of the parent case), next is the first pass of neck turning, it has some minor lack of uniformity, and the last is a case that was neck turned a second time. I think the second pass at neck turning is over kill and I am not doing it for this lot of cases.

My rifle has a tight chamber so I must neck turn plus neck turning makes the necks more uniform so the bullet gets a straighter alignment to the bore. The donut must be removed or after neck sizing in a bushing die the bullet will not be able to be seated deeper than just to the donut. The thickness of the brass at the neck after turning is 0.011". The donut is 0.020" thick. The thickest part of the neck after forming is 0.015" and as you can see the thinnest is less than 0.011 since turning to 0.011 does not remove brass everywhere.

Tim

[dtknowles]

* Lyman M die... $21 plus shipping
* Track of the Wolf Expansion Plug ... $2.99 plus shipping
Have a large box of TOTW Expansion Plugs for all of my bullet diameters for all calibers :drinks:

I wish I check here before I bought the die and I could have bought a few TOTW expansion plugs for the price of the die and I could have used them in the M dies I got with my pistol dies. Thanks for the info, live and learn.

Tim