Silver...

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Silver is up.
It's been really climbing the last three weeks
It hit $30 yesterday, but closed at $28

Why do you suppose it's up so high?

[rancher1913]

try buying a 1 oz silver coin, that will tell you the real price. last I checked they were selling for close to 50 bucks.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Rancher,
My preferred choice is old American Coins. I like the Walker Half dollar the most. I have bought them by the roll, usually from ebay. I checked ebay's last few "completed sales", they averaged about $220 per roll...about double what I spend 2 years ago.

[bakerjw]

As we all know, silver is a highly utilized metal in industry. With Covid, so much of the supply chain is disrupted that demand exceeds supply and as learned in econ101, prices rise. That as well as people leveraging their investments in case of severe turmoil.

I am not sold on precious metals. The example that I use is that if we have a collapse and someone comes to me to buy a chicken and intends to trade with silver, they will learn that regardless of what they paid for the silver, the chicken is going to cost them 1 ounce.

To that end, I believe that lead is the best investment because if they feel my price per chicken is too high and decide to take it by other means, I will have the advantage.

[Gewehr-Guy]

I think people are pulling currency from the stock market, and buying something that won't go away overnight. The value of gold and silver didn't go up, the buying power of the dollar just went down. It might be very volatile in price until a strengthening economy encourages demand for other metal mining, of which silver is a by product.
A green energy policy push could increase demand, as a lot of silver is used in the manufacture of solar panels. My opinion is that all commodities are under priced, compared to the volume of currency being pumped into the wrong sections of the economy right now.

[NyFirefighter357]

My mother bought 10-1 troy oz ingots almost 40 years ago I think for about $9 oz the price dropped then pretty much stayed flat for a long time. Several years ago when the prices skyrocketed I called her up & said to sell them. She didn't know where they were & thought maybe I had them. Well she passed last week & while cleaning some stuff out I found them tucked away in one of her draws. She has 8 grandchildren each will be getting one. My 2 sisters can have the other 2. When I was 14-16 yrs old I remember gold prices at about $350 oz, I worked & had plenty of cash on hand I wanted to buy a few ingots then, sure wish I did, I would have sold them by now!

[NyFirefighter357]

I am not sold on precious metals. The example that I use is that if we have a collapse and someone comes to me to buy a chicken and intends to trade with silver, they will learn that regardless of what they paid for the silver, the chicken is going to cost them 1 ounce.

I'm not sold either, what good does that precious metal do for you in a collapsed economy? Can't eat it, what are you going to make with it? How much did you pay for it to trade for a chicken? I think food, fuel, ammo ect. would be a better trade. All that said, I don't want to live through any Mad Max scenarios.

[GhostHawk]

Silver is a metal that is in high demand, but low supply. For years big outfits have been artificially depressing the silver market with "paper" silver. Silver futures essentially. But that control has been slipping and I think slipped totally.

I would not be surprised to see silver go up to or close to 100$ an oz over the next year. As it becomes more and more apparent that the government is printing money faster than they can feed paper to the presses. Trust in our paper dollar drops accordingly.

Once you lose faith in Fiat currency (our dollars) There really are limited options for the common people.

Gold is just plain too expensive at 2k$ per oz. Diamonds and gems are even more out of reach and even harder to convert back.
That leaves silver.

I bought several hundred ounces some 5 years ago and have continued to buy from time to time when the price was down close to 14$. Of course you never really get to buy for spot price, there is always a premium. More for Walking Liberty Silver dollars. Less for other mints 1 oz .999 pure silver rounds.

But if your careful selling you should get most of that premium back.
And on days where the silver spot price is moving upward that premium will be bigger than when the price is stable.

All things to consider when buying or selling.

[Mohawk Daddy]

"Why do you suppose it's up so high?" A better question would be, why do you suppose the US dollar is sinking so fast? That one is easy; it's because the federal government has been handing out trillions of dollars that it doesn't have. Everybody has gotten some. That free $1200 most of us got, the $600 a week unemployment payments that tens of millions have been receiving, trillions handed out to businesses almost with no questions asked, it all adds up. When you print trillions of dollars based on nothing but air, then the value of all existing dollars goes down. And with over 50 million people unemployed and not paying taxes due to coronavirus, the government's income has been reduced to a trickle.
The dollar is likely headed for an end similar to that of the Zimbabwe dollar or the German marks printed by the boxcar load by the Weimar Republic after WWI: completely worthless. Some South American countries followed the same path in the past; Argentina over the last 75 years is a good example. Remember nickel candy bars? In a couple of years we may see $5 candy bars. Or maybe $50. At the very end there will be $50,000 candy bars which makes most peoples' life savings seem trivial. Thus silver.

[rancher1913]

I'm not sold either, what good does that precious metal do for you in a collapsed economy? Can't eat it, what are you going to make with it? How much did you pay for it to trade for a chicken? I think food, fuel, ammo ect. would be a better trade. All that said, I don't want to live through any Mad Max scenarios.

pm's have been used in trading for hundreds of years, the market will figure it out quick should the need arise. the reason I keep some is for property taxes, the government is going to want theirs no matter the economy and if you cant pay your property tax you will be homeless quick.

[bedbugbilly]

supply and demand . . . like any other commodity. All I hear are advertisements that say "Buy Silver" and there are plenty who are worried about what will happen in the future so they decide to pull and liquidate a portion of their investments and put it in silver . . or gold . . . if enough do it, why wouldn't it go up? If it were beans and there were only so many to be had, and people felt it was worth investing in . . . supply and demand will dictate price.

And then you have those who have no common sense . . . a few weeks ago I talked with a friend of mine who is a very well educated woman . . . she told me how she was thinking of selling what stocks she has (she recently bought some but never had any before) as she didn't want to lose money if things should crash . . . okay . . . I then asked her if she had figured out just how much she would be paying in capital gains on it as well as if she had figured in the brokerage fees . . . her reply was "huh"? I told her that I knew nothing of her stocks or circumstances and that I didn't want to know - but she had better talk with her broker before making any rash decisions as the could very well end up right back where she started from as a result of the capital gains and brokerage fees - both for buying the stock and for selling it She then told me that she was considering getting all the tickles, dimes and quarters she cold find "just in case" as an elderly friend of her's had told her that his dad had done that during the Depression and used them when needed for buying and bartering. Okay again . . . . but then I reminded her that during the Depression, our coinage was silver - unlike today where it is copper clad.

Everyone has to do what they think is right for their own situation when it comes to their investments, etc. . . . and as pointed out, if things should ever crash . . . the government is still going to want their property taxes and other levies . . . that's why so many people lost everything during the Depression. But if there ever is another crash, it will be nothing like the Great Depression . . . it will be a whole new ball game . . . .

[Scrounge]

My mother bought 10-1 troy oz ingots almost 40 years ago I think for about $9 oz the price dropped then pretty much stayed flat for a long time. Several years ago when the prices skyrocketed I called her up & said to sell them. She didn't know where they were & thought maybe I had them. Well she passed last week & while cleaning some stuff out I found them tucked away in one of her draws. She has 8 grandchildren each will be getting one. My 2 sisters can have the other 2. When I was 14-16 yrs old I remember gold prices at about $350 oz, I worked & had plenty of cash on hand I wanted to buy a few ingots then, sure wish I did, I would have sold them by now!

I grew up in SoCal, and we would sometimes go pan for gold in the San Gabriel River. Always got a little, but never very much. Some time in the early 80's, I think it was, dad gathered up all the little vials of gold flakes and sold them. He got about $900 an ounce, or right on $900 IIRC.

[dtknowles]

More than a year ago I sold stocks and bought $30,000 in a gold fund when the price was around $1,200 an ounce. I also have some gold and silver coins, mostly eagles. With prices high now it is not a time to buy. Sort of like guns and ammo, when you need them is not the time to buy them.

The reason silver is so high is the same reason guns and ammo are high. Late cycle preppers.

Tim

[Plate plinker]

Supposedly the mints were shut down because of the virus. So there is supposedly a supply hiccup/shortage.
IDK but I have a small stash of silver and am watching for a price point that makes me happy. When it crashes I will start buying again.

[bakerjw]

But if there ever is another crash, it will be nothing like the Great Depression . . . it will be a whole new ball game . . . .

This is why so many people have been prepping. As mentioned by others, inflated prices of firearms, ammunition, food, PMs, etc... are due to those late to the ballgame.

[dragon813gt]

Supposedly the mints were shut down because of the virus. So there is supposedly a supply hiccup/shortage.

This effects bullion and proof coins from the US Mint. Not global supply. I collect numismatic proof eagles and the price was up quite a bit this year. What’s amusing to me is there’s a bullion coin minted in Philadelphia, they don’t usually make bullion coins, that’s being sold numismatically for around $200 at the moment. Bullion coins have no mint mark so there is no way to prove it besides the sealed labeled container it’s in. It’s also a bullion coin which is worth its weight in silver only even w/ limited mintage. But people are willing to pay the premium due to “collector’s value”.

I was gong to start buying some junk silver through APMEX since the price over spot is low. But they aren’t accepting any orders under $300. That’s over the weekly allowance I give myself. So no silver buying for me which is probably a good thing since it’s to high at the moment.

[EDG]

If silver or gold goes up much old existing deposits that are not currently mined will become profitable to mine.
So old mines will re open and the supply of silver will go up limiting appreciation of the metal.

[SSGOldfart]

Silver is a metal that is in high demand, but low supply. For years big outfits have been artificially depressing the silver market with "paper" silver. Silver futures essentially. But that control has been slipping and I think slipped totally.

I would not be surprised to see silver go up to or close to 100$ an oz over the next year. As it becomes more and more apparent that the government is printing money faster than they can feed paper to the presses. Trust in our paper dollar drops accordingly.

Once you lose faith in Fiat currency (our dollars) There really are limited options for the common people.

Gold is just plain too expensive at 2k$ per oz. Diamonds and gems are even more out of reach and even harder to convert back.
That leaves silver.

I bought several hundred ounces some 5 years ago and have continued to buy from time to time when the price was down close to 14$. Of course you never really get to buy for spot price, there is always a premium. More for Walking Liberty Silver dollars. Less for other mints 1 oz .999 pure silver rounds.

But if your careful selling you should get most of that premium back.
And on days where the silver spot price is moving upward that premium will be bigger than when the price is stable.

All things to consider when buying or selling.

I Hope your right.I'm sitting on a stash that started at $8.00 oz.

[jimlj]

In my opinion silver has about kept up with inflation. In 1968 I could buy a candy bar for 10 cents. I paid some shyster $4 for a 1922 silver dollar at a swap meet. Today that silver dollar might buy 30 candy bars, (I could have bought 39 after tax candy bars in 1968) so I'm down a few candy bars in 1968 dollars.

Using my candy bar theory, with the exception of the last 15 years of my working life I have been able to buy about the same number of candy bars per hour of labor. I was also able to buy the same amount of silver per hour.

Having said all of that, I still like silver dollars and have purchased a bunch of them over the years. They keep better than candy bars and my belt fits better with silver than candy.

[AK Caster]

All the commercials on TV tell me to buy gold and silver. If its that good of an investment then why do they want to get rid of it and take my dollars in return?

[elmacgyver0]

Does it cast well?

Lots of Werewolves out there.

[rancher1913]

most of those advertisers are selling "paper" gold and silver. if you want to see the price of real silver or gold, look on ebay or other auction places that deal in pm's

[Der Gebirgsjager]

I'm not sold either, what good does that precious metal do for you in a collapsed economy? Can't eat it, what are you going to make with it? How much did you pay for it to trade for a chicken? I think food, fuel, ammo ect. would be a better trade. All that said, I don't want to live through any Mad Max scenarios.

I've pondered your point for many years, and have concluded that owning a certain amount of precious metals is a wise thing. What that "certain amount" is kind of depends on how much you can invest and not miss during normal times.

If our paper money becomes worthless, and I do believe it will, and I believe that it will be completely phased out in favor of debit cards, the PMs will still work as a medium of exchange. Of course barter will be big, my box of ammo for your chicken, but there will still need to be a trusted thing of value that can be passed from hand to hand.

Exchanging value over a geographical distance is one example. Also, if you want something, but someone with that thing doesn't want what you have to offer (full up on chickens!) they may accept a PM coin to use to obtain something they want from someone who doesn't need any chickens or ammo.

So, I think there will always be a place for PM coins. What will prove difficult is getting people to agree on what any given size PM coin is actually worth compared to the value of what they want to buy or sell. Could very well be that, if the person who has something you want doesn't want a chicken or a box of ammo, they may agree to give you the item you desire for a coin, but what is the value of the coin? Just like now, there will always be sharpies trying to squeeze you.

I agree also with those who have said that all of one's prepping should not be in the area of PMs.

[dangitgriff]

most of those advertisers are selling "paper" gold and silver. if you want to see the price of real silver or gold, look on ebay or other auction places that deal in pm's

Or...bookmark this website:

https://www.kitco.com/

[rancher1913]

not really, that has the current spot price which is mostly "paper" pm's being traded, just try and buy a silver american eagle for that price, last I looked even the big boys wanted about 40 bucks for a known silver 1oz coin, and fleabay is even higher.

[bangerjim]

I am glad to see my 10 troy pounds of OLD SILVER half dollars is finally on the rise. And in a SHTF situation, they are still easily spendable for 50¢ each! That is why I always avoid precious metal bullion in any form. Bought them 14+ years ago at the same I bought a bunch of St Guadens $20 gold pieces. Beautiful coins! And they are really going up also! Being in nearly un-circulated certified condition, they are definitely above spot price on the market.

Now is NOT the time to invest in gold and silver. If I had put all that bunch money in the stock market or Guaranteed Annuities, I would have made a lot more by now. But the advisors all say to have 10% or so of your nest egg in precious metals. Not close yet, and probably never will be, at these high prices.

But I can't complain. It is sure fun to hold $45K worth of gold in my hands when I go to my bank box!

banger

[Piedmont]

The currency has been going to collapse since the 1970s when I was a teenager. We were going to run out of energy too in the seventies if you "grownups don't stop wasting so much" as a kid in a TV ad said. I think that was an ad for turning down thermostats in the Jimmy Carter era. There are doomsayers in every generation and this is nothing new. In no time in my life would you have needed silver or gold or would it have been a benefit to you to hold it.

In the 1980s AIDS was going to wipe out much of the world's population. In the 1990s we were losing all the rainforests and it was a crisis. Then "the Earth has a feeever" Al Gore had a new crisis and you had to buy special lightbulbs and pay carbon taxes and make him rich or we were all in big trouble. Now Covid 19 is going to wipe out half of Brazil's population a neighbor told me a few weeks back after watching the TV news

Don't listen to alarmists. Most are trying to sell you something. Most of the rest really don't know much.

[Mohawk Daddy]

This is a message for Uncle Sam:
Dialogue from an old Ernest Hemingway story:
"How did you go broke?"
"Two ways. Slowly at first. Then all at once."

[Ed K]

Silver is up.
It's been really climbing the last three weeks
It hit $30 yesterday, but closed at $28

Why do you suppose it's up so high?

How about: Why do you suppose it's only worth half of what it was 9 years ago?

[dangitgriff]

not really, that has the current spot price which is mostly "paper" pm's being traded, just try and buy a silver american eagle for that price, last I looked even the big boys wanted about 40 bucks for a known silver 1oz coin, and fleabay is even higher.

No, really.
The price is for the physical commodity. The difference between that and your local PM vendor’s spot is due to markup for that vendor in that locale. The COMEX spot price should always be used as a benchmark to judge where the best deals are in your area... and to keep the local dealers somewhat honest.
R/Griff

[Eddie Southgate]

Got money to invest spend it on powder, lead, primers , brass , jacketed bullets . Also good will be cheap but good magazine loading .22 autos and ammo to feed them . Gold and silver are good when people got money to buy them in normal times but when everything goes down the tubes they won't likely feed you . Bad times I can probably trade a $119.00 Rossi and a couple of boxes of .22lr for a cow .

[rancher1913]

ok, I'll play, go to that site and try and buy a 1 oz silver eagle at spot. best I could find was a generic round that they wanted over 40 bucks for. silver doctors has american eagles and they want close to 50 bucks for them. the spot price is determined by buying and selling large quantities, mostly paper silver or paper gold, the market has been rigged by paper products for years and is just now starting to break away.

[farmbif]

I guess its like any other investable thing, there are a few thousand people on the planet that have so much they can make the markets move if they want, for the rest of us we can only guess what will happen to future prices of investables. but if silver goes to $100 oz and gold to $5000 an oz now would be a good time to invest but its only speculation of what might happen. I remember my grandfather telling me about the depression and they would sell 2 dozen ears of corn and 2 dressed chickens for a dollar but there was hardly anybody that had a dollar, during that time things were so tough the family lost about 1/2 of the 1000 acre farm to the county because they didn't have the cash to pay the taxes.
unfortunately mismanagement of our country has caused the dollar to lose about 10 percent of its value on the global market in just the past 6 months. the national debt is spiraling out of control and tax cuts will leave social security funds lacking.,
If you have invested in silver or gold your ahead of the game with those prices heading straight up.

[dangitgriff]

The currency has been going to collapse since the 1970s when I was a teenager. We were going to run out of energy too in the seventies if you "grownups don't stop wasting so much" as a kid in a TV ad said. I think that was an ad for turning down thermostats in the Jimmy Carter era. There are doomsayers in every generation and this is nothing new. In no time in my life would you have needed silver or gold or would it have been a benefit to you to hold it.

In the 1980s AIDS was going to wipe out much of the world's population. In the 1990s we were losing all the rainforests and it was a crisis. Then "the Earth has a feeever" Al Gore had a new crisis and you had to buy special lightbulbs and pay carbon taxes and make him rich or we were all in big trouble. Now Covid 19 is going to wipe out half of Brazil's population a neighbor told me a few weeks back after watching the TV news

Don't listen to alarmists. Most are trying to sell you something. Most of the rest really don't know much.

During my 50-year lifetime the United States government has run out of road to kick the can down. Considering Nixon closed the gold window in August, 1971 and effectively removed the last meaningful restraint of sound fiscal policy, I’m surprised they made it this far. A cursory search online will lead one to some very informative charts on our public debt and future liabilities, which are in excess of 200 trillion dollars.
The astute comments regarding inflationary monetary policy and the resultant loss of purchasing power for every American are absolutely correct. Our government, in concert with the Federal Reserve’s profligate, legalized counterfeiting of our currency, has effectively robbed wealth from us all, along with future generations of Americans.
Gold and silver act as a store of our remaining wealth. It should form a part of your savings in conjunction with other means of achieving the same ends. Also consider that 10 ounces of gold bullion now packs more than $20,000 worth of savings into the dimensions of a zippo lighter, making it highly portable in the event you need to skedaddle to a safer location.
R/Griff

[farmbif]

if you want to buy pieces of silver or gold there is a place called Gainesville coins in lutz Florida that sells gold and silver cast or stamped in many different forms for about as close to market price as anywhere else. I watched my stepfather spend quite a bit on futures and other gold and silver scams but the actual pieces of metal from those folks was the real deal. hopefully they are still a stand up outfit as they were

[dangitgriff]

ok, I'll play, go to that site and try and buy a 1 oz silver eagle at spot. best I could find was a generic round that they wanted over 40 bucks for. silver doctors has american eagles and they want close to 50 bucks for them. the spot price is determined by buying and selling large quantities, mostly paper silver or paper gold, the market has been rigged by paper products for years and is just now starting to break away.

You are correct about the paper market. The paper contracts for gold far exceed the available supply and many paper speculators will be losing a lot of money very soon.
The original ratio of silver to gold was set at 14 to 1. Though I don’t believe it will return to those levels, it could reasonably be expected to reach 40 or 50 to one before this depression is turned around.
For comparison, the current ratio is about 73:1. At 50:1 silver would be $40/oz., and 40:1 would see silver at $50/oz., and double that if gold goes to $4,000/oz., which is entirely within the realm of possibilities given our current crisis.
R/Griff

https://youtu.be/48IL8wgX1kU

[dangitgriff]

if you want to buy pieces of silver or gold there is a place called Gainesville coins in lutz Florida that sells gold and silver cast or stamped in many different forms for about as close to market price as anywhere else. I watched my stepfather spend quite a bit on futures and other gold and silver scams but the actual pieces of metal from those folks was the real deal. hopefully they are still a stand up outfit as they were

They are probably experiencing high demand that is delaying their shipments to customers. That happened in 2018, too...according to a guy I work with that bought a pound.

[Ozark mike]

Jus another rock outta the ground for me could care less

[GhostHawk]

5 years ago I owed no one anything. Stores of all vitals were recently topped off.

Lead, powder, primers were all more than suffician to my needs.

So I invested a chunk in silver. I could double my money right now. But I do not think it is done going up.
So why sell?

I don't need it. It is moving in the right direction. Let it roll.

I do not have a huge pile like some of those East Coast robber barons do.
But I have simple tastes and needs. Don't need a huge pile.

If Silver goes to 100 I would have a roughly 8 fold increase. Still not all that much in the big scheme of things.

Still it is nice to have eggs in many baskets.

[Bang Switch]

Silver is not high enough, yet.

If you use the old 20 to 1 ratio, gold worth 20$ per oz. or double eagle, then silver should be worth 100$ per oz. or one once coin.
I think it is under valued right now because it so plentiful and the demand for it is low.
Silver should be trading at or near 100$.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

ok, I'll play, go to that site and try and buy a 1 oz silver eagle at spot. best I could find was a generic round that they wanted over 40 bucks for. silver doctors has american eagles and they want close to 50 bucks for them. the spot price is determined by buying and selling large quantities, mostly paper silver or paper gold, the market has been rigged by paper products for years and is just now starting to break away.

JM Bullion lists Silver Eagles in stock, Random year (no choice) for $37. (pre-order for 2020 year for $39).
As I type this, the market ticker has Silver spot price at $29.31

https://www.jmbullion.com/silver/silver-coins/american-silver-eagles/all-american-silver-eagles/

[MaryB]

Supposedly the mints were shut down because of the virus. So there is supposedly a supply hiccup/shortage.
IDK but I have a small stash of silver and am watching for a price point that makes me happy. When it crashes I will start buying again.

Copper mines are shut down due to lack of demand with manufacturing shut down. Silver is a by product of that and of lead mining. SO supply has dropped way off...

[super6]

Had a friend who bought silver during the last silver boom, He bought @ 30 and went to 38 a few weeks later, He did not sell at 38 and silver dropped to $14 a few weeks later... Be careful!

[reddog81]

When the price moves from $15 to $30 in a couple months it's time to sell, not buy... You're supposed to buy low and sell high...

Looking at historic charts shows a number of spikes and the price always comes back down. Often times just as fast as it shot up.

When the market gets frothy and people selling silver start talking about how it's a great time to buy silver be wary. If the people selling silver knew it was heading to $100 they'd be holding it, not getting rid of it.

FWIW you can find silver at the major retailers for about $32.50 per ounce and sell it back to them for around $29. At this point I'm considering selling some.

[bangerjim]

In dealing with silver, I advise my friends to NOT buy bars or bullion coins minted by.........whoever! Or foreign coins.

Buy OLD solid silver half dollars. They are almost pure silver (90%) and as I said in a SHTF situation they are still worth 50¢! You cannot spend bullion coins or bars. Only sell them thru metal houses and dealers. The bullion coins are better than bars, because the are minted by a (supposedly) reputable mint. Bars can be made out of most any alloy and stamped.

But stick with old US currency for "hoarding"!

( Pre-1964 Kennedy, 1948-63 Franklin, 1916-1947 Walking Liberty ------- all 90% Ag)

banger

[reddog81]

IMO If we reach a point where a silver half dollar is only worth $.50 it won't make much of a difference whether or not you've got "junk silver" or .999.

You can buy silver bullion coins for a 10% premium over spot or old US coins for a 30% premium. When purchasing large quantities that spread makes a big difference. I have saved the invoices from most of my purchases to verify the gold/silver/platinum is legit should the time come...

[dragon813gt]

In dealing with silver, I advise my friends to NOT buy bars or bullion coins minted by.........whoever! Or foreign coins.
There is nothing wrong w/ foreign coins. The important thing is that they are from a reputable mint. I don’t hesitate to buy from Canada or Australia. I do agree w/ no bars. They can be shaved where coins typically prevent this.

You’re going to pay a large premium for 90% silver coins. Both over spot and face value. The 35% war nickels are almost always the lowest price over spot. $2 face gets you 1.125 ounces but the coins are in pretty rough shape. You will have around .75 ounces for $2 in 90% half dollars. If you’re buying them for silver the amount you get for your dollar matters.

Under normal circumstances I would recommend going to to the bank and buying all the half dollars they have. I’ve gotten countless 40% Kennedy coins this way. Take the other ones back and get dollars. But w/ the current situation you can’t do this. And I haven’t been getting as many desirable coins lately.

[dangitgriff]

Gold and silver are in the early stages of a secular bull market, which means that they are cheap now and will be expensive later. Only those of you who want to speculate in the metals market need to watch for the highs. The rest of the buyers are in it for medium-to-long-term wealth preservation.
Of particular note is the fact that gold has increased by $1,738.50, or 604%, since 2000, which equates to an average of 30% per year, despite the previous high in 2011 and recent low in 2015. There will be price surges as well as retractions over the short term, but all indications point to much higher prices for gold and silver going forward.
As the Federal Reserve pumps trillions of dollars’ worth of inflation into the economy and financial markets, your savings will be taxed like never before. The time has come for Americans to convert their worthless dollars into tangible assets while they still have purchasing power.
Good luck, we’re all going to need it.
R/Griff

[reloader28]

I'm not sold either, what good does that precious metal do for you in a collapsed economy? Can't eat it, what are you going to make with it? How much did you pay for it to trade for a chicken? I think food, fuel, ammo ect. would be a better trade. All that said, I don't want to live through any Mad Max scenarios.

The way I look at it is its more for when the economy comes back on line. Our current paper money is going to be a thing of the past and worthless but the metals will always be of value

[bmortell]

i don't know about long long term. i think some of silvers industrial use will be replaced by advances in material science. higher density and higher price metals are only rare on earths surface. there's asteroids out there that make Global GDP look like my bank account, eventually somebody is gonna go grab em and gold might become cheap enough that we can cast shiny gold boolits!

[dangitgriff]

Peter Schiff on gold and silver:
“Gold and silver are not up because of Covid. Now, Covid is part of the reason, but it’s not the actual cause. You see, what happened is governments, and, in particular, central banks, they’ve responded to Covid by printing a lot of money. Governments are running big deficits and central banks are printing the money to monetize those deficits, especially the Federal Reserve. And so, it’s the money printing. It’s the inflation that central banks are creating in order to monetize government debt that is a response to Covid that’s helping to drive the gold price higher.”

[dtknowles]

Peter Schiff on gold and silver:
“Gold and silver are not up because of Covid. Now, Covid is part of the reason, but it’s not the actual cause. You see, what happened is governments, and, in particular, central banks, they’ve responded to Covid by printing a lot of money. Governments are running big deficits and central banks are printing the money to monetize those deficits, especially the Federal Reserve. And so, it’s the money printing. It’s the inflation that central banks are creating in order to monetize government debt that is a response to Covid that’s helping to drive the gold price higher.”

He is only really half right. Gold and Silver are up but oil, lead and copper have not risen. It is not so much inflation but fear of inflation or deep recession. It is a risk off move. If the market does crash it will take gold and silver down to as people will have to sell their gold and silver to pay for their shorts and to feed themselves and pay the rent and mortgage. Inflation is still low and will remain low until the crisis is over.

Tim

[dangitgriff]

Yep, he mentioned inflation, too:

“The market is trying to instill fear in the weaker hands, so you get these spectacular one-day moves in the opposite direction of the primary trend to shake people out, to get the weaker players out of the market so you can clear away the excess baggage and then continue the trend,” he said, noting that people shouldn’t lose sight of the fundamentals, and they’re still bullish for gold.

Given the actions of the US Federal Reserve, with its unprecedented money printing, the government’s borrowing and resulting deficits, as well as the macroeconomic dynamics currently in play, we have “the most bullish fundamentals for gold in history,” Schiff said.

According to him, inflation is the driving factor for both the rising price of precious metals and falling bond yields. “And it’s going to continue to drive the price of gold higher, despite the reaction we got in the market today to the PPI number."

[dolfinwriter]

The value of gold and silver didn't go up, the buying power of the dollar just went down.

The government also monetizes its debt to us (bonds and T-Bills), so that when we redeem the bonds, it APPEARS that we're getting our money back with interest, but we're actually getting less buying power because the value of those dollars returned to us is less. That's called inflation. That's what happens when government spending is out of control and exceeds revenues as has happened this year with all of these stimulus packages and enhanced unemployment benefit packages in a time of dramatically reduced tax revenues. With great sectors of the economy either shut down completely or greatly reduced due to pandemic concerns (i.e,. by blue state governors and mayors to impact the economy to hurt Trump in November, and also manufacture justification to demand federal bailouts to try to shore up their budgets after years of deficit spending to buy votes).

I'm not surprised silver and gold are up. And it means I sold my silver too early once again.


Everybody has gotten some.

That's not true. We didn't get one cent of that money, and not even the child credit for my son that wasn't yet 17. The eligibility is based on your 2018 or 2019 tax return, and we had not yet done our 2019 taxes. Living in SoCal, we make more to compensate for the ridiculous cost of living, but we still pay the same federal tax rate on that income as those who live in Kansas with 1/4 the cost of living (which is one reason we're moving there).


during the Depression, our coinage was silver - unlike today where it is copper clad.

There's a little more to it than that--FDR made it illegal to own more than a certain amount of silver or gold. Some very wealthy people sent bags of gold eagles and double eagles to be stored in vaults in Europe, but a great deal of silver and gold were basically confiscated here by the federal government and melted down. Many millions of Morgan silver dollars, Peace dollars and silver half dollars were melted down.

[dolfinwriter]

In my opinion silver has about kept up with inflation.

And THAT is THE reason for buying precious metals. Don't listen to the hypesters and profiteers who benefit from you buying THEIR silver and THEIR gold. Both gold and silver go up and down just like any other commodity. The best reason to own them is that usually hold their value vs. inflation, and they are never worth ZERO.

[dolfinwriter]

not really, that has the current spot price which is mostly "paper" pm's being traded, just try and buy a silver american eagle for that price, last I looked even the big boys wanted about 40 bucks for a known silver 1oz coin, and fleabay is even higher.

Are you talking about a raw silver MS eagle right out of a Monster box, or a coin certified by NGC or PCGS, or even ANACS? Burnished will be higher and Proofs will be higher also.

[dangitgriff]

And THAT is THE reason for buying precious metals. Don't listen to the hypesters and profiteers who benefit from you buying THEIR silver and THEIR gold. Both gold and silver go up and down just like any other commodity. The best reason to own them is that usually hold their value vs. inflation, and they are never worth ZERO.

Accurately stated.
I must clarify for those that misunderstand what inflation is: an increase of the supply of currency. That’s it. All other prices rise as a result of inflation, and most everyone mistakenly conflates price increases with actual inflation.
A chart from Kitco.com:
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200814/b5f158ba10000a95c440687aef27f4e7.jpg
R/Griff

[rancher1913]

Are you talking about a raw silver MS eagle right out of a Monster box, or a coin certified by NGC or PCGS, or even ANACS? Burnished will be higher and Proofs will be higher also.

the ones I saw where 2018 silver eagles, not numismatic, just run of the mill coins. to get a better spot actual price for actual silver and not paper, follow the sales on ebay.

[dangitgriff]

Gold and silver both took a big hit this week, gold down over $100 from its record high. Notice, however, it is settling above the previous high set in 2011. This trend will continue as the bull market in precious metals finds its feet and continues its upward trajectory.
It’s still a good time to buy.
R/Griff

[dtknowles]

Accurately stated.
I must clarify for those that misunderstand what inflation is: an increase of the supply of currency. That’s it. All other prices rise as a result of inflation, and most everyone mistakenly conflates price increases with actual inflation.
A chart from Kitco.com:
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200814/b5f158ba10000a95c440687aef27f4e7.jpg
R/Griff

The Fed uses the core CPI as their prime measure of inflation. They use M2 to measure changes in the money supply. Prices do not always increase with an increase in the money supply. We are talking about consumer price inflation not money supply inflation. Inflation is also something you do to balloons and tires. When talking about inflation in an economic sense people most often think of consumer price inflation.

Tim

[super6]

I will buy at 15 and sell at 30 like I have before. To each his own. $25,000 will yield $50,000

[dangitgriff]

The Fed uses the core CPI as their prime measure of inflation. They use M2 to measure changes in the money supply. Prices do not always increase with an increase in the money supply. We are talking about consumer price inflation not money supply inflation. Inflation is also something you do to balloons and tires. When talking about inflation in an economic sense people most often think of consumer price inflation.

Tim

I know, I was pointing out that there is a cause/effect mechanism there. Currency supply goes up and prices follow.
By the way, the Fed pulled a fast one and changed the way they measure inflation (in the 1990’s, if memory serves) to basically hide the real rate, which is as much as 3-4X higher, using real-world pricing across a much broader range of goods. How anyone can trust anything reported from official government agencies is beyond comprehension.
R/Griff

[dtknowles]

I know, I was pointing out that there is a cause/effect mechanism there. Currency supply goes up and prices follow.
By the way, the Fed pulled a fast one and changed the way they measure inflation (in the 1990’s, if memory serves) to basically hide the real rate, which is as much as 3-4X higher, using real-world pricing across a much broader range of goods. How anyone can trust anything reported from official government agencies is beyond comprehension.
R/Griff

one does not so much trust statistics reported by the government as much as interpret them

[dangitgriff]

That’s exactly right!
There is a lot of “reading between the lines” one has to do.
R/Griff

[BrassMagnet]

Rancher,
My preferred choice is old American Coins. I like the Walker Half dollar the most. I have bought them by the roll, usually from ebay. I checked ebay's last few "completed sales", they averaged about $220 per roll...about double what I spend 2 years ago.

I have read reports of lots of counterfeit silver coins on FleaBay. They measure right and weigh right, but are a nickel alloy. I saw a bowl of counterfeits in a coin store and they looked real to me. There were two silver dollars in the bowl with identical scratches.

[MaryB]

Yup eBay is full of Chinese fakes. You can go to Alibaba and buy them!!! US 90% coins are faked a lot when ti comes to quarters, half dollars, dollars. And silver American Eagles are faked along with a bunch of the mint rounds and bars... only buy from the big name dealers(Apmex, Gainsvile coins etc).

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I have read reports of lots of counterfeit silver coins on FleaBay. They measure right and weigh right, but are a nickel alloy. I saw a bowl of counterfeits in a coin store and they looked real to me. There were two silver dollars in the bowl with identical scratches.

I have heard of, and seen some fakes.
old American Silver coins do have their own sound.
Old American coins will have a patina/tarnish that is random (coin to coin), and is easy to identify if you are buying numerous rolls. I'll stick with the Walker halves and Mercury dimes.

[MaryB]

Mercury dimes are my thing, love them!